ᐅ Log Cabin with Half-Hipped Roof by the Forest – How to Improve the Design?
Created on: 11 Jun 2018 19:45
K
keychain
Hello everyone,
We have been planning and actively reading for over a year now. As our plans become more concrete, we would like to present our design and get your feedback.
First of all: Yes, the house is big. It is our dream, we are doing a lot of the work ourselves, and we know that we cannot extend it further — the situation here is a bit unusual, as strictly speaking this is only officially buildable land for a short time window.
A brief introduction: I am 36 years old and co-owner of an IT company. My partner is 31 and works as a lecturer. About two years ago, we found our dream plot — a little over 2800sqm (about 0.7 acres), with direct forest access and located in the third row. All neighboring plots are, as far as possible, already built on, mostly with former weekend houses or residential homes.
First, the questionnaire:
Building plan / restrictions?
No, there is no building plan, so we are following common local building standards. The neighboring house has two full stories, which we are using as a reference.
Plot size
2800sqm (about 0.7 acres)
Slope
Slight slope; we are on a ridge of the Ore Mountains. The building site has a height difference of max. 60cm (about 2 feet) from northeast to southwest. The entire plot slopes about 1.80m (6 feet) downward to the south along the west boundary. Rocky ground starting at 2.5m (8 feet) depth.
Plot ratio / floor area ratio
No exact figures known; according to the lawyer from the building permit office, we are well within limits.
Building envelope, building line and boundary
None
Boundary setbacks
Do you mean setback distances and boundary construction? If so: 3m (10 feet) all around; boundary construction for sheds and garages is theoretically permitted.
Number of parking spaces
1–2 under the porch + double garage.
Number of floors
2
Roof type
Half-hipped roof (Dutch hip roof).
Architectural style
Hmm... not sure?
Orientation
South-southwest
Maximum height/limits
None
Other requirements
Homeowners’ needs
We want our house to welcome us. Warm wood, natural building materials, lots of light and air — high ceilings, large beams. It should blend well with the environment, be warm and cozy.
Style, roof type, building type
Log house made from glue-laminated beams (probably Finnlog).
Basement, floors
Fully basemented with two full floors.
Number of residents, age
Currently 2 people. Children may come, parents as well.
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor
Currently about 300sqm (about 3200 sqft). This seems quite large, but looking at individual rooms (living/dining area) I don’t know where else to put the sound system. Maybe the planning is off or our space expectations are. We don’t have a TV; the fireplace is the central element.
Office: family use or home office?
An office is planned, but only as a fallback. I don’t want to work from home and only need space for private files and a desk.
Guest bedrooms per year
Variable, currently very few. Hopefully many more with the house — then we can accommodate them.
Open or closed architecture
Mixed. I prefer open, but an open void above the living area is not possible if you don’t want all cooking smells in the bedroom.
Traditional or modern construction
Hmm... solid wood house? Traditional.
Open kitchen, cooking island
An open, large kitchen with a big island where more than two people can cook comfortably. No seating in the kitchen, but a huge workspace.
Number of dining seats
10
Fireplace
Yes, a large soapstone stove.
Music / stereo wall
I am considering installating a Sonos system with a music room in the basement.
Balcony, roof terrace
No; we have a garden for that.
Garage, carport
Both; at least the entrance canopy is large enough for one car.
Vegetable garden, greenhouse
We want a greenhouse, a swimming pond, and a fire pit.
Other wishes / special features / daily routine, including reasons why or why not
House design
Who designed it:
The design was created with an architect, based on our drafts.
What do you particularly like? Why?
High ceilings and visible ceiling beams on the upper floor, separated area upstairs for us, the fireplace room as a second retreat, the single-story “extension” for the dining room, the large kitchen, the fireplaces... and especially the abundant wood.
What don’t you like? Why?
The gable windows should get an added triangular top to maximize light. The current window layout feels a bit outdated. We actually wanted an open void, but this can’t be sensibly integrated. Heating is a constant issue and never fully resolved.
The worst: the master bathroom fixtures. We want a large bathtub and a double shower. Either the bathroom is too small or we lack imagination. It doesn’t look cozy...
Preferred heating system: currently unfortunately natural gas. Solid fuel heating is out for various reasons: a wood gasifier is too expensive and labor-intensive; pellet or woodchip stoves are not economical, plus we can’t reliably get deliveries in winter when the road is snowed in. Natural gas is about 100m (330 feet) away; we are still waiting for connection cost estimates. Heat pumps only make financial sense with geothermal; however, installation and technology would then be more expensive than a current compact car. We do not want oil heating or liquefied gas tanks.
If you have to omit something, which details/extensions
-can you omit:
-can you not omit:
Why is the design like it is now? For example:
The architect received a draft from us, every room was discussed beforehand (use, size, contents), and the design was revised multiple times. We like that it implements nearly everything we wanted and that the house does not look too bulky — due to the half-hipped roof and the gables, it does not seem so on the plans at least.
What is your most important / basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
Apart from the effort for plastering: is the floor plan practical? For example: washing machine on the first floor where laundry occurs, bathroom for the children...
Now some free text — our notes:
Some things are already different from the plans:
We have also been thinking about other things:
I think that’s it. Thanks for your opinions!
We have been planning and actively reading for over a year now. As our plans become more concrete, we would like to present our design and get your feedback.
First of all: Yes, the house is big. It is our dream, we are doing a lot of the work ourselves, and we know that we cannot extend it further — the situation here is a bit unusual, as strictly speaking this is only officially buildable land for a short time window.
A brief introduction: I am 36 years old and co-owner of an IT company. My partner is 31 and works as a lecturer. About two years ago, we found our dream plot — a little over 2800sqm (about 0.7 acres), with direct forest access and located in the third row. All neighboring plots are, as far as possible, already built on, mostly with former weekend houses or residential homes.
First, the questionnaire:
Building plan / restrictions?
No, there is no building plan, so we are following common local building standards. The neighboring house has two full stories, which we are using as a reference.
Plot size
2800sqm (about 0.7 acres)
Slope
Slight slope; we are on a ridge of the Ore Mountains. The building site has a height difference of max. 60cm (about 2 feet) from northeast to southwest. The entire plot slopes about 1.80m (6 feet) downward to the south along the west boundary. Rocky ground starting at 2.5m (8 feet) depth.
Plot ratio / floor area ratio
No exact figures known; according to the lawyer from the building permit office, we are well within limits.
Building envelope, building line and boundary
None
Boundary setbacks
Do you mean setback distances and boundary construction? If so: 3m (10 feet) all around; boundary construction for sheds and garages is theoretically permitted.
Number of parking spaces
1–2 under the porch + double garage.
Number of floors
2
Roof type
Half-hipped roof (Dutch hip roof).
Architectural style
Hmm... not sure?
Orientation
South-southwest
Maximum height/limits
None
Other requirements
Homeowners’ needs
We want our house to welcome us. Warm wood, natural building materials, lots of light and air — high ceilings, large beams. It should blend well with the environment, be warm and cozy.
Style, roof type, building type
Log house made from glue-laminated beams (probably Finnlog).
Basement, floors
Fully basemented with two full floors.
Number of residents, age
Currently 2 people. Children may come, parents as well.
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor
Currently about 300sqm (about 3200 sqft). This seems quite large, but looking at individual rooms (living/dining area) I don’t know where else to put the sound system. Maybe the planning is off or our space expectations are. We don’t have a TV; the fireplace is the central element.
Office: family use or home office?
An office is planned, but only as a fallback. I don’t want to work from home and only need space for private files and a desk.
Guest bedrooms per year
Variable, currently very few. Hopefully many more with the house — then we can accommodate them.
Open or closed architecture
Mixed. I prefer open, but an open void above the living area is not possible if you don’t want all cooking smells in the bedroom.
Traditional or modern construction
Hmm... solid wood house? Traditional.
Open kitchen, cooking island
An open, large kitchen with a big island where more than two people can cook comfortably. No seating in the kitchen, but a huge workspace.
Number of dining seats
10
Fireplace
Yes, a large soapstone stove.
Music / stereo wall
I am considering installating a Sonos system with a music room in the basement.
Balcony, roof terrace
No; we have a garden for that.
Garage, carport
Both; at least the entrance canopy is large enough for one car.
Vegetable garden, greenhouse
We want a greenhouse, a swimming pond, and a fire pit.
Other wishes / special features / daily routine, including reasons why or why not
House design
Who designed it:
The design was created with an architect, based on our drafts.
What do you particularly like? Why?
High ceilings and visible ceiling beams on the upper floor, separated area upstairs for us, the fireplace room as a second retreat, the single-story “extension” for the dining room, the large kitchen, the fireplaces... and especially the abundant wood.
What don’t you like? Why?
The gable windows should get an added triangular top to maximize light. The current window layout feels a bit outdated. We actually wanted an open void, but this can’t be sensibly integrated. Heating is a constant issue and never fully resolved.
The worst: the master bathroom fixtures. We want a large bathtub and a double shower. Either the bathroom is too small or we lack imagination. It doesn’t look cozy...
Preferred heating system: currently unfortunately natural gas. Solid fuel heating is out for various reasons: a wood gasifier is too expensive and labor-intensive; pellet or woodchip stoves are not economical, plus we can’t reliably get deliveries in winter when the road is snowed in. Natural gas is about 100m (330 feet) away; we are still waiting for connection cost estimates. Heat pumps only make financial sense with geothermal; however, installation and technology would then be more expensive than a current compact car. We do not want oil heating or liquefied gas tanks.
If you have to omit something, which details/extensions
-can you omit:
-can you not omit:
Why is the design like it is now? For example:
The architect received a draft from us, every room was discussed beforehand (use, size, contents), and the design was revised multiple times. We like that it implements nearly everything we wanted and that the house does not look too bulky — due to the half-hipped roof and the gables, it does not seem so on the plans at least.
What is your most important / basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
Apart from the effort for plastering: is the floor plan practical? For example: washing machine on the first floor where laundry occurs, bathroom for the children...
Now some free text — our notes:
Some things are already different from the plans:
- All windows can be opened.
- Sliding doors open outwards, not inwards.
- All dormer windows will not be rectangular but have added triangular tops.
- Between the hallway and living area there is no central post; instead, a large double door is planned.
- The basement has a technical room beside the stairs, designed as a through room. In my opinion, this is a poor solution; we probably also need to plan a separate boiler room.
- Where the embankment is drawn, doors will be installed. This will allow the large rooms to get natural daylight and be usable living space.
- The stair step projecting into the hallway is bad and will definitely be removed.
We have also been thinking about other things:
- The hallway upstairs is planned as a “library.” To bring in light, we intend to use two light wells with diameters of 30–35cm (12–14 inches). The advantage: it will never be completely dark at night when someone needs to use the bathroom.
- The fireplace will be a soapstone stove; no plan exists yet. Strictly speaking, it will not stand against a wall but form the wall itself. We also planned a second connection in the fireplace room; originally we wanted a tunnel fireplace but were convinced it’s not a good idea as a room divider.
- The children’s rooms are not ideal — one faces north, the other south. We could make two narrow, elongated rooms and a corridor so both face south, but we consider that clearly suboptimal.
- All doors on the ground floor will be 1m (3.3 feet) wide to at least accommodate wheelchair access reasonably.
I think that’s it. Thanks for your opinions!
keychain schrieb:
...
that two amateurs really put effort into their childlike scribbles and actually thought something through. You don’t always have to be dismissive, even if that’s easier. Or is it really that satisfying to keep pointing out someone’s incompetence just because the house is simply more expensive? Hmm, I don’t know, should I give you a gold star or a gentle headbutt? This isn’t kindergarten. I think it’s great that you are seriously considering your wishes. Your bad luck with the architect is probably just due to the current market situation. But what good would it do anyone if we just sugarcoat things for you here? You don’t build a million-dollar house without a competent architect. That would be like performing heart surgery on your wife yourself instead of leaving it to the cardiac surgeon.
But if you like it that way, then just build it like that. It’s not unlivable. It just won’t win any awards, which is a shame considering the money involved.
I also think Huf Haus might be the right provider for you. Maybe you’ll have better luck there.
H
HausaufGrund20 Jun 2018 21:15It is interesting to learn about the journey you have already been through, as this makes many things easier to understand.
Criticism always hurts.
My advice: always try to focus exclusively on the factual level behind all responses, even if the emotional aspect on your side or on the side of the writers sometimes makes this difficult.
Block that out; this is really important.
Otherwise, too much energy is lost, and it wears you down.
That said, I have to say that you are responding objectively – I think that’s good.
Is there a fixed, unchangeable “envelope,” meaning the distances in all four cardinal directions have been fully utilized?
Are there still any variables?
I suppose making it smaller shouldn’t be a problem, right?
The first draft had ground floor dimensions of 12.87 by 18 meters (42.2 by 59 feet).
In the new draft, the ground floor is 12 by 20 meters (39.4 by 65.6 feet).
If I’m not mistaken, that means you have 240 times 2 = 480 m² (5167 sq ft)?
Am I miscalculating?
I really can’t imagine that building a house like this wouldn’t cost at least a seven-figure sum – excluding land, exterior work, and additional costs.
You don’t install tiles costing 20 € (about $22) in a house like this, either.
Why not get a price quote from prefabricated house suppliers for your latest floor plan?
Or from a general contractor.
If money matters (which one can assume, right?), this would be essential as a planning cross-check.
What good is finding the ideal floor plan if you can’t afford to implement it financially?
Did you do this with the other floor plans you discarded back then?
Best regards
Criticism always hurts.
My advice: always try to focus exclusively on the factual level behind all responses, even if the emotional aspect on your side or on the side of the writers sometimes makes this difficult.
Block that out; this is really important.
Otherwise, too much energy is lost, and it wears you down.
That said, I have to say that you are responding objectively – I think that’s good.
Is there a fixed, unchangeable “envelope,” meaning the distances in all four cardinal directions have been fully utilized?
Are there still any variables?
I suppose making it smaller shouldn’t be a problem, right?
The first draft had ground floor dimensions of 12.87 by 18 meters (42.2 by 59 feet).
In the new draft, the ground floor is 12 by 20 meters (39.4 by 65.6 feet).
If I’m not mistaken, that means you have 240 times 2 = 480 m² (5167 sq ft)?
Am I miscalculating?
I really can’t imagine that building a house like this wouldn’t cost at least a seven-figure sum – excluding land, exterior work, and additional costs.
You don’t install tiles costing 20 € (about $22) in a house like this, either.
Why not get a price quote from prefabricated house suppliers for your latest floor plan?
Or from a general contractor.
If money matters (which one can assume, right?), this would be essential as a planning cross-check.
What good is finding the ideal floor plan if you can’t afford to implement it financially?
Did you do this with the other floor plans you discarded back then?
Best regards
@HausaufGrund
Of course, there are financial limits, as with any construction project. We have spent about 200,000 euros on the land, initial site development, and the preparations we are currently working on. Additional costs for the exterior areas include smaller items like sewage treatment systems, roads, fences, and gates. Let’s just say there is still quite a bit of work to do. The plot is great but somewhat remote. I admit I didn’t expect some things to be so extensive. I’m not opposed to keeping the total cost under the magic 7-figure mark, to put it cautiously.
The building permit / planning permission will need to be changed one way or another. Since we have to do that anyway, there’s no need to keep artificial limits. Previously, the house had around 480 square meters (5,167 square feet) including the basement, which wasn’t fully utilized. Now we have only two floors, fewer stairs, but the same living area, with natural light everywhere except for the interior heating and electrical connection rooms.
We have the standard 3-meter (10 feet) setback distances, so in theory, we could have 30 meters (98 feet) width. I don’t want to push it, though, it wouldn’t look that great and you might not be able to get heavy machinery like an excavator around the house if things are too tight. There is no building envelope; because it faces south, we don’t want to leave too much space in front, we’d just be making the garden smaller.
The current design didn’t just come out of nowhere; it was based on a rough agreement, and the price should work out — we save more by leaving out the basement than we now spend on the larger exterior shell, since the groundwork isn’t simple for us. Binding quotes will arrive next week as a basis for detailed planning, and the architect has already revised the first drafts and made a proposal of his own. We’ll see if I’m allowed to share it.
Thanks also for the kind words. I’m trying to keep the discussion focused — I’m here because I know nothing about planning a house and only know a little about certain aspects. Otherwise, I probably would have noticed earlier that a 1.8-meter (6 feet) bed was included in the first draft. Objective criticism is therefore welcome and not inappropriate, on the contrary. Just as I have benefited from archived posts, I hope this thread helps others as well. No matter how ugly my gymnasium looks, it can serve as a cautionary example. And once the house is standing, no matter which of the past or future designs it ends up being, we will invite all forum participants to a meal.
Of course, there are financial limits, as with any construction project. We have spent about 200,000 euros on the land, initial site development, and the preparations we are currently working on. Additional costs for the exterior areas include smaller items like sewage treatment systems, roads, fences, and gates. Let’s just say there is still quite a bit of work to do. The plot is great but somewhat remote. I admit I didn’t expect some things to be so extensive. I’m not opposed to keeping the total cost under the magic 7-figure mark, to put it cautiously.
The building permit / planning permission will need to be changed one way or another. Since we have to do that anyway, there’s no need to keep artificial limits. Previously, the house had around 480 square meters (5,167 square feet) including the basement, which wasn’t fully utilized. Now we have only two floors, fewer stairs, but the same living area, with natural light everywhere except for the interior heating and electrical connection rooms.
We have the standard 3-meter (10 feet) setback distances, so in theory, we could have 30 meters (98 feet) width. I don’t want to push it, though, it wouldn’t look that great and you might not be able to get heavy machinery like an excavator around the house if things are too tight. There is no building envelope; because it faces south, we don’t want to leave too much space in front, we’d just be making the garden smaller.
The current design didn’t just come out of nowhere; it was based on a rough agreement, and the price should work out — we save more by leaving out the basement than we now spend on the larger exterior shell, since the groundwork isn’t simple for us. Binding quotes will arrive next week as a basis for detailed planning, and the architect has already revised the first drafts and made a proposal of his own. We’ll see if I’m allowed to share it.
Thanks also for the kind words. I’m trying to keep the discussion focused — I’m here because I know nothing about planning a house and only know a little about certain aspects. Otherwise, I probably would have noticed earlier that a 1.8-meter (6 feet) bed was included in the first draft. Objective criticism is therefore welcome and not inappropriate, on the contrary. Just as I have benefited from archived posts, I hope this thread helps others as well. No matter how ugly my gymnasium looks, it can serve as a cautionary example. And once the house is standing, no matter which of the past or future designs it ends up being, we will invite all forum participants to a meal.
@kaho674
Unfortunately, it is a bit more complicated. The plot was originally outside the development area but was later incorporated into it. After almost three years, a preliminary building permit was approved. Now, due to some reforms, the plot is supposed to be excluded again—or more precisely, the clarification is to be withdrawn. Therefore, I can submit a building application based on the preliminary decision until early July, which cannot be easily rejected. If I miss the deadline or withdraw the ongoing application, the plot will become a recreational land outside the development area again and will be unbuildable.
Unfortunately, it is a bit more complicated. The plot was originally outside the development area but was later incorporated into it. After almost three years, a preliminary building permit was approved. Now, due to some reforms, the plot is supposed to be excluded again—or more precisely, the clarification is to be withdrawn. Therefore, I can submit a building application based on the preliminary decision until early July, which cannot be easily rejected. If I miss the deadline or withdraw the ongoing application, the plot will become a recreational land outside the development area again and will be unbuildable.
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