ᐅ Strategy for Buying a Kitchen / How to Negotiate Effectively?
Created on: 6 Aug 2020 16:47
S
Shiny86
I’ve started planning my kitchen and feel completely overwhelmed. It feels like being at a bazaar. Exactly what you see on TV shows happened to me. So far, I’ve visited 4 kitchen showrooms. I’m still waiting on the design and price from 2 of them. These are smaller studios, so I’m curious to see what they come up with.
But with the other two, it went exactly as expected. Twice I asked the manager for a discount, and it turned into a kind of show. The comments were laughable: “We can do it for price X, but then we won’t make any profit on you. The manager will probably want to talk to me about this.” Even after the second discount, I still felt like I was paying too much. Both salespeople set deadlines for me. One even said I had to sign the contract that same day.
I also don’t know how to negotiate smartly or what the right tactics are. I don’t really know the actual value of my kitchen. When does negotiating become unreasonable? How do you know for sure when there’s no more room to negotiate? Are there actually people who don’t negotiate at all and just accept the first offered discount? I’ve wondered about that too. It’s a shame I don’t know any kitchen salesperson personally to get insider tips.
Since I have a lot of expensive requests, I feel almost ridiculous setting my budget too low. The problem is that I can’t compare apples to apples because my kitchen concept has changed with every planning appointment. In my small town, I’ve now visited all the studios except for Roller. There are still studios in neighboring towns, but I already feel like I won’t have a kitchen even after visiting 5 more showrooms.
Nearly all plans are for a Nobilia kitchen, coming to around 20,000 euros (about $22,000), or even more if I include my latest wishes. I’ve asked if I should buy the appliances myself to save money, but I was advised against it. They said they wouldn’t install them due to warranty reasons.
What price would you set if you were in my position? And please share how you got your kitchen and how you negotiated.
My requirements are:
- A tall cabinet row with 6 cabinets, each 60cm (24 inches) wide, boxed in drywall. Two of these should be pantry cabinets with pull-out shelves, and the other 4 will house appliances.
- A kitchen peninsula about 1.2m (4 feet) wide and approximately 3.10m (10 feet) long, with drawers on both sides only.
- I want quite high-end appliances, probably Bosch Series 8 black Carbon Accent line, likely including an oven with microwave, a combi-steam oven, and a built-in coffee machine.
- Cooktop with an integrated downdraft vent, recirculating air, flush-mounted (Bosch Series 8 has been planned so far, but I don’t know how good the cooktop is).
- Very quiet dishwasher, brand doesn’t matter (Bosch and Neff have been suggested so far).
- Refrigerator inside a tall cabinet with 2 bio-fresh drawers, brand doesn’t matter (Liebherr and Bosch have been suggested).
- Ceramic countertop
- Undermount ceramic sink
I don’t want to spend more than necessary. But I realize I probably won’t get everything for 15,000 euros (about $16,500).
How should I proceed?
But with the other two, it went exactly as expected. Twice I asked the manager for a discount, and it turned into a kind of show. The comments were laughable: “We can do it for price X, but then we won’t make any profit on you. The manager will probably want to talk to me about this.” Even after the second discount, I still felt like I was paying too much. Both salespeople set deadlines for me. One even said I had to sign the contract that same day.
I also don’t know how to negotiate smartly or what the right tactics are. I don’t really know the actual value of my kitchen. When does negotiating become unreasonable? How do you know for sure when there’s no more room to negotiate? Are there actually people who don’t negotiate at all and just accept the first offered discount? I’ve wondered about that too. It’s a shame I don’t know any kitchen salesperson personally to get insider tips.
Since I have a lot of expensive requests, I feel almost ridiculous setting my budget too low. The problem is that I can’t compare apples to apples because my kitchen concept has changed with every planning appointment. In my small town, I’ve now visited all the studios except for Roller. There are still studios in neighboring towns, but I already feel like I won’t have a kitchen even after visiting 5 more showrooms.
Nearly all plans are for a Nobilia kitchen, coming to around 20,000 euros (about $22,000), or even more if I include my latest wishes. I’ve asked if I should buy the appliances myself to save money, but I was advised against it. They said they wouldn’t install them due to warranty reasons.
What price would you set if you were in my position? And please share how you got your kitchen and how you negotiated.
My requirements are:
- A tall cabinet row with 6 cabinets, each 60cm (24 inches) wide, boxed in drywall. Two of these should be pantry cabinets with pull-out shelves, and the other 4 will house appliances.
- A kitchen peninsula about 1.2m (4 feet) wide and approximately 3.10m (10 feet) long, with drawers on both sides only.
- I want quite high-end appliances, probably Bosch Series 8 black Carbon Accent line, likely including an oven with microwave, a combi-steam oven, and a built-in coffee machine.
- Cooktop with an integrated downdraft vent, recirculating air, flush-mounted (Bosch Series 8 has been planned so far, but I don’t know how good the cooktop is).
- Very quiet dishwasher, brand doesn’t matter (Bosch and Neff have been suggested so far).
- Refrigerator inside a tall cabinet with 2 bio-fresh drawers, brand doesn’t matter (Liebherr and Bosch have been suggested).
- Ceramic countertop
- Undermount ceramic sink
I don’t want to spend more than necessary. But I realize I probably won’t get everything for 15,000 euros (about $16,500).
How should I proceed?
Just to clarify, it’s not about squeezing out every last cent. I want a fair price, but when a seller goes to the manager twice and manages to drop the price from 43,000 to 19,600 after the second meeting because they realized that 20,000 euros is probably my limit—and I have to sign the contract the same day because the planning costs will increase by 1,200 euros (which is still a great price) the next day—then I do wonder how much more is possible. I’m happy to pay 500 euros more for good advice, but not thousands of euros.
Honestly, I would always prefer to support a small local kitchen store and pay a few hundred euros extra rather than give my money to a big chain.
Okay, I’ve received the usual advice here: plan the kitchen precisely in another forum and then compare apples to apples. But I don’t think it’s going to come to that.
For example, I visited a small kitchen studio in my town. They only offer one kitchen manufacturer, which might not be available in other studios. The advice was excellent, and they will break down the price into different items from the start. I’m definitely curious about that. In the end, it probably comes down to gut feeling. Mostly, I was interested in how most people here have approached this.
Honestly, I would always prefer to support a small local kitchen store and pay a few hundred euros extra rather than give my money to a big chain.
Okay, I’ve received the usual advice here: plan the kitchen precisely in another forum and then compare apples to apples. But I don’t think it’s going to come to that.
For example, I visited a small kitchen studio in my town. They only offer one kitchen manufacturer, which might not be available in other studios. The advice was excellent, and they will break down the price into different items from the start. I’m definitely curious about that. In the end, it probably comes down to gut feeling. Mostly, I was interested in how most people here have approached this.
T
T_im_Norden7 Aug 2020 19:16Kitchens are like furniture; their prices often seem to depend on factors such as the outside temperature, the phase of the moon, and even the shoe size of the current salesperson.
One of the most memorable experiences was at a furniture store where a sofa was offered at an unbelievable special price—almost equivalent to a down payment. Unfortunately, we had already seen the price tags that were hidden behind the sofa. The very next day, the price was 500 euros (about $540) lower, and below that, another tag showed a price 800 euros (about $865) higher.
The market is deliberately kept non-transparent through private labels and numerous brand names for the same products.
Anyone who avoids comparing prices probably already knows why they do so.
One of the most memorable experiences was at a furniture store where a sofa was offered at an unbelievable special price—almost equivalent to a down payment. Unfortunately, we had already seen the price tags that were hidden behind the sofa. The very next day, the price was 500 euros (about $540) lower, and below that, another tag showed a price 800 euros (about $865) higher.
The market is deliberately kept non-transparent through private labels and numerous brand names for the same products.
Anyone who avoids comparing prices probably already knows why they do so.
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pagoni20208 Aug 2020 00:40Shiny86 schrieb:
Just to clarify, I’m not trying to squeeze out every last cent I don’t see anything wrong with someone trying to get the best possible price for a product or service. A friend of mine often works for us, and naturally, he looks out for his own interests rather than ours—just like we all do. That’s human nature; still, we always find a solution that works for us.
If your price doesn’t suit the seller or service provider, they will simply reject it—don’t worry. Or did you have a razor blade to their throat? -
Shiny86 schrieb:
if a salesperson goes to the boss twice and manages to get the price from 43,000 down to 19,600 after the second conversation because they realize that 20,000 euros is my limit and I have to sign the contract that same day since the planning costs increase by 1,200 euros the next day, which is still a great price, then I really wonder what else is possible This is exactly the kind of sneaky business practice we’re talking about here, which also affects reputable suppliers and tradespeople. The same goes for those tile installers mentioned earlier, charging hourly rates comparable to heart surgeons and exploiting the builder’s urgent situation in a disgusting way. Charging €100/sqm (about $110/sq ft) for installation has nothing to do with a fair tradesperson’s wage, in my opinion, it’s just highway robbery.
Because this kind of practice really does happen—also often with the fast process of prefab houses—it’s usually necessary to be very critical and not just accept prices but get well-informed in advance.
What’s important is that you get a nice kitchen that you feel comfortable with. I’m curious to see how it goes for you; maybe you’ll have different experiences this time.
pagoni2020 schrieb:
When I asked at the end how much this large kitchen would cost without appliances, things suddenly got awkward. I told him to just calculate the kitchen normally and sell it to me without the appliances... oh dear. Then when he started talking about his warranty for sliding in the oven and plugging in the appliance’s power cord, that was the last straw for me.I would find that strange too. They probably make little profit on the furniture itself, but rather on the electrical work. In the end, it’s all a mixed calculation where, for example, the warranty is also factored in. That’s all included in the price. You don’t get that at Ikea. Ikea buyers like doing the assembly themselves and would rather spend a few days on DIY fixing rattles and pulls than pay 500€ more for a 4-year warranty.pagoni2020 schrieb:
Therefore, I believe it’s important to find the hidden “gems” that offer good advice and service, and to be willing to pay the price that comes with that.A “gem” always just means a rock-bottom price—let’s be honest about that.
pagoni2020 schrieb:
So I just switched to IKEA then.pagoni2020 schrieb:
Unfortunately, the market has developed with a “stinginess is cool” attitude and sky-high prices that include deceptive intentions.Shiny86 schrieb:
One salesman disappeared for like 15-20 minutes to ask his boss, and the second time it took 10 minutes to get approval from the boss. Then they wanted me to sign on the same day to get that price.I wouldn’t put up with attitudes like that.exto1791 schrieb:
being “tricked.”…I wonder if car buying is transparent when the sale price is 3100€ below the MSRP. Do people complain about unclear pricing then? Why can one dealer do it and the other not?Alessandro schrieb:
The pricing of these kitchens and the margins of each store depend on so many factors that some add more on top and others less, even if they are from the same manufacturer. Also, hours of consultation with potential customers who ultimately don’t buy have to be accounted for.I agree.Shiny86 schrieb:
Since the planning costs 1200 euros more the next day, which is still a great price, I wonder what else is possible. I’m happy to pay 500 euros more for good consulting, but not thousands of euros.Consultations shouldn’t come with a fee, but they are a service.Shiny86 schrieb:
In the end, I guess it’s a gut feeling. I was mostly interested in how most people here have approached this.For most, it’s all about “what is the final price”—and that’s not just among expats. The same applies to plumbing (you’ll probably make a thread on that too): “Why should I pay the sky-high prices from the craftsman when I can get the same stuff cheaper at Reuter and similar?” “Isn’t that rip-off?” “Help, I’m at the mercy of the subcontractor—he wants to make money from me—what can I do?” “Who has experience with MyHammer?” “Whose fault is the leak behind the tile?”… more to come.We have a good kitchen studio here in northern Germany where you don’t need to negotiate. I set a price for my kitchen that I thought was fair for our house, and the kitchen salesperson planned a Nolte kitchen accordingly. He said, of course, that Miele wasn’t included but Neff was. If this or that was added, he couldn’t meet the price, but with a certain setup, it fit. He was about 300 above my target. Two other studios offered inferior kitchens and couldn’t design the cabinet layout I wanted for the tall units. We ended those discussions after one salesperson calculated the Nobilia kitchen with the wrong cabinet layout, which was already over budget before appliances.
pagoni2020 schrieb:
The same clique includes the tile setters mentioned earlier who charge heart surgeon-level hourly rates and exploit the builder’s difficult situation in a disgusting way. €100/sqm (sq. meter) installation has nothing to do with a reasonable craftsman’s wage.Yes, disgusting. The client chooses very expensive 100 x 100 cm (39 x 39 inch) or 15 x 120 cm (6 x 47 inch) tiles, and the tile setter adjusts the price for the increased effort, yet still gets called disgusting. Do people also complain about higher service costs when buying a Range Rover, Porsche, or Mercedes AMG?ypg schrieb:
And in the end, it’s all a mixed calculation, where, for example, the warranty is also factored in. That’s all included in the price. You don’t get that with Ikea. Ikea buyers love DIY anyway, they’d rather spend a few days fixing things if something creaks or rattles than pay an extra 500€ for a 4-year warranty. Big fail – Ikea actually offers a 25 (sic!) year warranty on its kitchens:
“25 years Metod kitchen system warranty coverage on material and/or workmanship defects for the following parts of the METOD kitchen system: • METOD cabinet carcasses • fronts • Utrusta fixed interior fittings (except wire baskets and push openers) • Maximera drawers • legs and plinths • side panels • decorative strips • worktops (except LILLTRÄSK) • sinks (except FYNDIG sinks)”
T
T_im_Norden8 Aug 2020 08:53When it comes to kitchens and appliances, it's not about mixing calculations but rather about avoiding a direct price comparison.
Complete packages with appliances whose model numbers or designations do not exist on the market can simply no longer be compared.
There is a good reason why there are so many kitchen studios.
Complete packages with appliances whose model numbers or designations do not exist on the market can simply no longer be compared.
There is a good reason why there are so many kitchen studios.
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