ᐅ Photovoltaics at Any Cost – Current Situation and Available Options
Created on: 31 Jul 2022 13:22
H
HnghusBY
Hello everyone,
After countless rejections due to overload, availability, and delivery issues, I have finally received an offer for a photovoltaic system.
The system is planned for our new build (completion in 2023). We have a gable roof, almost south-facing, with a 30-degree pitch, fully usable, about 50 sqm (540 sq ft) of roof area per side.
The house is being built in Bavaria, about 60 km (37 miles) from Thuringia.
The offer surprised me a bit. The following items are included:
14x MAXEON modules at 430 W each, heat pump system, totaling 6.02 kWp - €11,138
1x Tesla Powerwall 2.0, 13.5 kWh - €10,400
Installation, etc. - €3,130
Total: €24,668 net
I find that quite expensive. I would leave out the battery anyway, but even then, I think the price for the 6 kWp system is too high. Apparently, this is currently the price you pay in Bavaria if you can find someone at all. For me, the question is whether it even makes sense to invest right now or just pay for electricity. Of course, it’s a matter of calculation, but if you follow the discussions here, those prices seem sky-high — or not?
Is it better to get offers from other regions? Are there any recommendations around the 97XXX area?
After countless rejections due to overload, availability, and delivery issues, I have finally received an offer for a photovoltaic system.
The system is planned for our new build (completion in 2023). We have a gable roof, almost south-facing, with a 30-degree pitch, fully usable, about 50 sqm (540 sq ft) of roof area per side.
The house is being built in Bavaria, about 60 km (37 miles) from Thuringia.
The offer surprised me a bit. The following items are included:
14x MAXEON modules at 430 W each, heat pump system, totaling 6.02 kWp - €11,138
1x Tesla Powerwall 2.0, 13.5 kWh - €10,400
Installation, etc. - €3,130
Total: €24,668 net
I find that quite expensive. I would leave out the battery anyway, but even then, I think the price for the 6 kWp system is too high. Apparently, this is currently the price you pay in Bavaria if you can find someone at all. For me, the question is whether it even makes sense to invest right now or just pay for electricity. Of course, it’s a matter of calculation, but if you follow the discussions here, those prices seem sky-high — or not?
Is it better to get offers from other regions? Are there any recommendations around the 97XXX area?
R
RotorMotor23 Nov 2022 08:28A storage tank does not make sense for a heat pump. Instead, it is useful for nighttime use, so that it empties every day.
Rough calculation with average values: 200 cycles/year, 7 kWh/cycle -> 1400 kWh/year through the storage tank.
Electricity price 40¢/kWh - feed-in tariff 8.6¢/kWh -> €440/year
€7800 initial investment divided by €440/year -> the storage tank must last almost 18 years.
Realistically, the lifespan is probably about half of that.
From this, one can conclude that either the electricity price would need to double or the storage tank cost be halved to break even.
Since storage tanks are also not very environmentally friendly, I would currently advise against them.
Rough calculation with average values: 200 cycles/year, 7 kWh/cycle -> 1400 kWh/year through the storage tank.
Electricity price 40¢/kWh - feed-in tariff 8.6¢/kWh -> €440/year
€7800 initial investment divided by €440/year -> the storage tank must last almost 18 years.
Realistically, the lifespan is probably about half of that.
From this, one can conclude that either the electricity price would need to double or the storage tank cost be halved to break even.
Since storage tanks are also not very environmentally friendly, I would currently advise against them.
It probably depends on the consumption pattern as well. For example, if you mainly have loads at night that cannot be shifted to daylight hours, this can change the calculation.
Nowadays, you can expect at least 50, rather 60 cents per kWh if you don’t want to factor in an annual increase.
Nowadays, you can expect at least 50, rather 60 cents per kWh if you don’t want to factor in an annual increase.
R
RotorMotor23 Nov 2022 08:51Tolentino schrieb:
It probably also depends on the consumption pattern. For example, if you mainly have consumers active at night that can’t be shifted to daylight hours, this could change the calculation. There may be some special cases, but how realistic is that scenario for a single-family home?
And there will always be days when you can’t fully charge the storage.
Especially with a heat pump and only 10 kWp (kilowatts peak), there will be plenty of winter days when nothing reaches the storage.
Tolentino schrieb:
And nowadays, you can probably expect at least 50, more likely 60 cents / kWh, if you don’t want to factor in an annual price increase. Well, time will tell if that’s realistic.
Many people are already protesting at 40 cents, and price caps are being introduced.
Well, I have no idea how common that is.
My wife is a plant enthusiast, and tropical plants require additional lighting.
Then there are aquarium owners, gamers, sauna users, shift workers, and possibly home-office night workers. Yes, certainly not the majority, but if you know you have more or larger energy consumers at night, you can calculate more precisely—that’s what I wanted to say.
Yes, you need particularly large space in winter.
How long is the battery supposed to last? I think that even if market prices come down again in the medium term, prices will stabilize well above 40 cents per kilowatt-hour. I mean, we now have almost everywhere over 50 cents per kilowatt-hour with new contracts. With existing contracts, one provider after another is following suit after my increase from 25.xx to 52.xx just now.
This won’t seriously drop again, and the government won’t keep subsidizing forever. That means these prices will form the new baseline for the next two years.
The simple answer will be to save even more electricity.
By the way, what about DIY batteries? There are a few on special interest platforms and forums. Is that even legal? For off-grid use?
I’ve read that you can connect car batteries (I mean 12V lead-gel batteries) for this purpose?
My wife is a plant enthusiast, and tropical plants require additional lighting.
Then there are aquarium owners, gamers, sauna users, shift workers, and possibly home-office night workers. Yes, certainly not the majority, but if you know you have more or larger energy consumers at night, you can calculate more precisely—that’s what I wanted to say.
Yes, you need particularly large space in winter.
How long is the battery supposed to last? I think that even if market prices come down again in the medium term, prices will stabilize well above 40 cents per kilowatt-hour. I mean, we now have almost everywhere over 50 cents per kilowatt-hour with new contracts. With existing contracts, one provider after another is following suit after my increase from 25.xx to 52.xx just now.
This won’t seriously drop again, and the government won’t keep subsidizing forever. That means these prices will form the new baseline for the next two years.
The simple answer will be to save even more electricity.
By the way, what about DIY batteries? There are a few on special interest platforms and forums. Is that even legal? For off-grid use?
I’ve read that you can connect car batteries (I mean 12V lead-gel batteries) for this purpose?
ateliersiegel23 Nov 2022 09:10Regarding the question aspect: "at any cost?"
In an article that I found credible, I read that batteries will very likely become not only significantly more efficient in the future but also more environmentally friendly. To strengthen the system, it is helpful to participate, even if it is not yet economically "worth it."
In an article that I found credible, I read that batteries will very likely become not only significantly more efficient in the future but also more environmentally friendly. To strengthen the system, it is helpful to participate, even if it is not yet economically "worth it."
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