ᐅ Log Cabin with Half-Hipped Roof by the Forest – How to Improve the Design?
Created on: 11 Jun 2018 19:45
K
keychain
Hello everyone,
We have been planning and actively reading for over a year now. As our plans become more concrete, we would like to present our design and get your feedback.
First of all: Yes, the house is big. It is our dream, we are doing a lot of the work ourselves, and we know that we cannot extend it further — the situation here is a bit unusual, as strictly speaking this is only officially buildable land for a short time window.
A brief introduction: I am 36 years old and co-owner of an IT company. My partner is 31 and works as a lecturer. About two years ago, we found our dream plot — a little over 2800sqm (about 0.7 acres), with direct forest access and located in the third row. All neighboring plots are, as far as possible, already built on, mostly with former weekend houses or residential homes.
First, the questionnaire:
Building plan / restrictions?
No, there is no building plan, so we are following common local building standards. The neighboring house has two full stories, which we are using as a reference.
Plot size
2800sqm (about 0.7 acres)
Slope
Slight slope; we are on a ridge of the Ore Mountains. The building site has a height difference of max. 60cm (about 2 feet) from northeast to southwest. The entire plot slopes about 1.80m (6 feet) downward to the south along the west boundary. Rocky ground starting at 2.5m (8 feet) depth.
Plot ratio / floor area ratio
No exact figures known; according to the lawyer from the building permit office, we are well within limits.
Building envelope, building line and boundary
None
Boundary setbacks
Do you mean setback distances and boundary construction? If so: 3m (10 feet) all around; boundary construction for sheds and garages is theoretically permitted.
Number of parking spaces
1–2 under the porch + double garage.
Number of floors
2
Roof type
Half-hipped roof (Dutch hip roof).
Architectural style
Hmm... not sure?
Orientation
South-southwest
Maximum height/limits
None
Other requirements
Homeowners’ needs
We want our house to welcome us. Warm wood, natural building materials, lots of light and air — high ceilings, large beams. It should blend well with the environment, be warm and cozy.
Style, roof type, building type
Log house made from glue-laminated beams (probably Finnlog).
Basement, floors
Fully basemented with two full floors.
Number of residents, age
Currently 2 people. Children may come, parents as well.
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor
Currently about 300sqm (about 3200 sqft). This seems quite large, but looking at individual rooms (living/dining area) I don’t know where else to put the sound system. Maybe the planning is off or our space expectations are. We don’t have a TV; the fireplace is the central element.
Office: family use or home office?
An office is planned, but only as a fallback. I don’t want to work from home and only need space for private files and a desk.
Guest bedrooms per year
Variable, currently very few. Hopefully many more with the house — then we can accommodate them.
Open or closed architecture
Mixed. I prefer open, but an open void above the living area is not possible if you don’t want all cooking smells in the bedroom.
Traditional or modern construction
Hmm... solid wood house? Traditional.
Open kitchen, cooking island
An open, large kitchen with a big island where more than two people can cook comfortably. No seating in the kitchen, but a huge workspace.
Number of dining seats
10
Fireplace
Yes, a large soapstone stove.
Music / stereo wall
I am considering installating a Sonos system with a music room in the basement.
Balcony, roof terrace
No; we have a garden for that.
Garage, carport
Both; at least the entrance canopy is large enough for one car.
Vegetable garden, greenhouse
We want a greenhouse, a swimming pond, and a fire pit.
Other wishes / special features / daily routine, including reasons why or why not
House design
Who designed it:
The design was created with an architect, based on our drafts.
What do you particularly like? Why?
High ceilings and visible ceiling beams on the upper floor, separated area upstairs for us, the fireplace room as a second retreat, the single-story “extension” for the dining room, the large kitchen, the fireplaces... and especially the abundant wood.
What don’t you like? Why?
The gable windows should get an added triangular top to maximize light. The current window layout feels a bit outdated. We actually wanted an open void, but this can’t be sensibly integrated. Heating is a constant issue and never fully resolved.
The worst: the master bathroom fixtures. We want a large bathtub and a double shower. Either the bathroom is too small or we lack imagination. It doesn’t look cozy...
Preferred heating system: currently unfortunately natural gas. Solid fuel heating is out for various reasons: a wood gasifier is too expensive and labor-intensive; pellet or woodchip stoves are not economical, plus we can’t reliably get deliveries in winter when the road is snowed in. Natural gas is about 100m (330 feet) away; we are still waiting for connection cost estimates. Heat pumps only make financial sense with geothermal; however, installation and technology would then be more expensive than a current compact car. We do not want oil heating or liquefied gas tanks.
If you have to omit something, which details/extensions
-can you omit:
-can you not omit:
Why is the design like it is now? For example:
The architect received a draft from us, every room was discussed beforehand (use, size, contents), and the design was revised multiple times. We like that it implements nearly everything we wanted and that the house does not look too bulky — due to the half-hipped roof and the gables, it does not seem so on the plans at least.
What is your most important / basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
Apart from the effort for plastering: is the floor plan practical? For example: washing machine on the first floor where laundry occurs, bathroom for the children...
Now some free text — our notes:
Some things are already different from the plans:
We have also been thinking about other things:
I think that’s it. Thanks for your opinions!
We have been planning and actively reading for over a year now. As our plans become more concrete, we would like to present our design and get your feedback.
First of all: Yes, the house is big. It is our dream, we are doing a lot of the work ourselves, and we know that we cannot extend it further — the situation here is a bit unusual, as strictly speaking this is only officially buildable land for a short time window.
A brief introduction: I am 36 years old and co-owner of an IT company. My partner is 31 and works as a lecturer. About two years ago, we found our dream plot — a little over 2800sqm (about 0.7 acres), with direct forest access and located in the third row. All neighboring plots are, as far as possible, already built on, mostly with former weekend houses or residential homes.
First, the questionnaire:
Building plan / restrictions?
No, there is no building plan, so we are following common local building standards. The neighboring house has two full stories, which we are using as a reference.
Plot size
2800sqm (about 0.7 acres)
Slope
Slight slope; we are on a ridge of the Ore Mountains. The building site has a height difference of max. 60cm (about 2 feet) from northeast to southwest. The entire plot slopes about 1.80m (6 feet) downward to the south along the west boundary. Rocky ground starting at 2.5m (8 feet) depth.
Plot ratio / floor area ratio
No exact figures known; according to the lawyer from the building permit office, we are well within limits.
Building envelope, building line and boundary
None
Boundary setbacks
Do you mean setback distances and boundary construction? If so: 3m (10 feet) all around; boundary construction for sheds and garages is theoretically permitted.
Number of parking spaces
1–2 under the porch + double garage.
Number of floors
2
Roof type
Half-hipped roof (Dutch hip roof).
Architectural style
Hmm... not sure?
Orientation
South-southwest
Maximum height/limits
None
Other requirements
Homeowners’ needs
We want our house to welcome us. Warm wood, natural building materials, lots of light and air — high ceilings, large beams. It should blend well with the environment, be warm and cozy.
Style, roof type, building type
Log house made from glue-laminated beams (probably Finnlog).
Basement, floors
Fully basemented with two full floors.
Number of residents, age
Currently 2 people. Children may come, parents as well.
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor
Currently about 300sqm (about 3200 sqft). This seems quite large, but looking at individual rooms (living/dining area) I don’t know where else to put the sound system. Maybe the planning is off or our space expectations are. We don’t have a TV; the fireplace is the central element.
Office: family use or home office?
An office is planned, but only as a fallback. I don’t want to work from home and only need space for private files and a desk.
Guest bedrooms per year
Variable, currently very few. Hopefully many more with the house — then we can accommodate them.
Open or closed architecture
Mixed. I prefer open, but an open void above the living area is not possible if you don’t want all cooking smells in the bedroom.
Traditional or modern construction
Hmm... solid wood house? Traditional.
Open kitchen, cooking island
An open, large kitchen with a big island where more than two people can cook comfortably. No seating in the kitchen, but a huge workspace.
Number of dining seats
10
Fireplace
Yes, a large soapstone stove.
Music / stereo wall
I am considering installating a Sonos system with a music room in the basement.
Balcony, roof terrace
No; we have a garden for that.
Garage, carport
Both; at least the entrance canopy is large enough for one car.
Vegetable garden, greenhouse
We want a greenhouse, a swimming pond, and a fire pit.
Other wishes / special features / daily routine, including reasons why or why not
House design
Who designed it:
The design was created with an architect, based on our drafts.
What do you particularly like? Why?
High ceilings and visible ceiling beams on the upper floor, separated area upstairs for us, the fireplace room as a second retreat, the single-story “extension” for the dining room, the large kitchen, the fireplaces... and especially the abundant wood.
What don’t you like? Why?
The gable windows should get an added triangular top to maximize light. The current window layout feels a bit outdated. We actually wanted an open void, but this can’t be sensibly integrated. Heating is a constant issue and never fully resolved.
The worst: the master bathroom fixtures. We want a large bathtub and a double shower. Either the bathroom is too small or we lack imagination. It doesn’t look cozy...
Preferred heating system: currently unfortunately natural gas. Solid fuel heating is out for various reasons: a wood gasifier is too expensive and labor-intensive; pellet or woodchip stoves are not economical, plus we can’t reliably get deliveries in winter when the road is snowed in. Natural gas is about 100m (330 feet) away; we are still waiting for connection cost estimates. Heat pumps only make financial sense with geothermal; however, installation and technology would then be more expensive than a current compact car. We do not want oil heating or liquefied gas tanks.
If you have to omit something, which details/extensions
-can you omit:
-can you not omit:
Why is the design like it is now? For example:
The architect received a draft from us, every room was discussed beforehand (use, size, contents), and the design was revised multiple times. We like that it implements nearly everything we wanted and that the house does not look too bulky — due to the half-hipped roof and the gables, it does not seem so on the plans at least.
What is your most important / basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
Apart from the effort for plastering: is the floor plan practical? For example: washing machine on the first floor where laundry occurs, bathroom for the children...
Now some free text — our notes:
Some things are already different from the plans:
- All windows can be opened.
- Sliding doors open outwards, not inwards.
- All dormer windows will not be rectangular but have added triangular tops.
- Between the hallway and living area there is no central post; instead, a large double door is planned.
- The basement has a technical room beside the stairs, designed as a through room. In my opinion, this is a poor solution; we probably also need to plan a separate boiler room.
- Where the embankment is drawn, doors will be installed. This will allow the large rooms to get natural daylight and be usable living space.
- The stair step projecting into the hallway is bad and will definitely be removed.
We have also been thinking about other things:
- The hallway upstairs is planned as a “library.” To bring in light, we intend to use two light wells with diameters of 30–35cm (12–14 inches). The advantage: it will never be completely dark at night when someone needs to use the bathroom.
- The fireplace will be a soapstone stove; no plan exists yet. Strictly speaking, it will not stand against a wall but form the wall itself. We also planned a second connection in the fireplace room; originally we wanted a tunnel fireplace but were convinced it’s not a good idea as a room divider.
- The children’s rooms are not ideal — one faces north, the other south. We could make two narrow, elongated rooms and a corridor so both face south, but we consider that clearly suboptimal.
- All doors on the ground floor will be 1m (3.3 feet) wide to at least accommodate wheelchair access reasonably.
I think that’s it. Thanks for your opinions!
As expected, your contributions have indeed had some impact. On one hand, we share some of the criticism; on the other, when trying the new design within the existing exterior walls, we understand why we arrived at this solution in the first place. Therefore, we first took up the suggestion to redesign the staircase and entrance area; the rest will more or less have to follow from that. To make this staircase more elegant and fitting for the house, we set the premise that we will not accept a steep or uncomfortable staircase. With a height of 332cm (131 inches), we assumed a step height of 17.45cm (7 inches) and a tread depth of 28.1cm (11 inches), resulting in 18 to 19 steps, depending on whether the top step is counted.
I have attached two images that we can envision. There is always a door under the staircase, but we have at least 2.20m (7 ft 3 in) of space, so enlarging the doors should not be a problem — another good point. Both staircases allow a practical open space underneath, which we like. Regarding lighting, it is still borderline, but should be manageable.
Upstairs, we wanted from the beginning to separate the children’s and parents’ areas. Our previous solution only connects the bathrooms to keep plumbing routes simple. However, the large hallway offers enough space for a family bathroom with a bathtub (let’s be honest, the children will probably use it more). The downside is that this bathroom is directly adjacent to our bedroom, so it might be necessary to insulate the dividing wall significantly better. The wall insulation will be done with 100mm (4 inches) of wood fiber insulation, which is said to provide better acoustic insulation than mineral wool.
With the new staircase, we could enlarge the north room as a kind of compensation for the south-facing view. Another idea was to place both children’s rooms on the south side, but that would eliminate the separate parents’ area completely. Dividing the dormer results in noticeably smaller rooms, which is possible but seems unfair given the available space.
One more note about the basement:
Yes, the room is acoustically well proportioned by design — but not intended as a home theater, since neither of us are movie fans. We don’t even own a TV. The sloping area will, of course, have large terrace doors, also 3.8m (12 ft 6 in) wide, similar to those upstairs. Therefore, much more light comes in than it may appear. The basement layout has also been revised; I hope to upload a drawing here, though I probably just didn’t bring it with me.
I have attached two images that we can envision. There is always a door under the staircase, but we have at least 2.20m (7 ft 3 in) of space, so enlarging the doors should not be a problem — another good point. Both staircases allow a practical open space underneath, which we like. Regarding lighting, it is still borderline, but should be manageable.
Upstairs, we wanted from the beginning to separate the children’s and parents’ areas. Our previous solution only connects the bathrooms to keep plumbing routes simple. However, the large hallway offers enough space for a family bathroom with a bathtub (let’s be honest, the children will probably use it more). The downside is that this bathroom is directly adjacent to our bedroom, so it might be necessary to insulate the dividing wall significantly better. The wall insulation will be done with 100mm (4 inches) of wood fiber insulation, which is said to provide better acoustic insulation than mineral wool.
With the new staircase, we could enlarge the north room as a kind of compensation for the south-facing view. Another idea was to place both children’s rooms on the south side, but that would eliminate the separate parents’ area completely. Dividing the dormer results in noticeably smaller rooms, which is possible but seems unfair given the available space.
One more note about the basement:
Yes, the room is acoustically well proportioned by design — but not intended as a home theater, since neither of us are movie fans. We don’t even own a TV. The sloping area will, of course, have large terrace doors, also 3.8m (12 ft 6 in) wide, similar to those upstairs. Therefore, much more light comes in than it may appear. The basement layout has also been revised; I hope to upload a drawing here, though I probably just didn’t bring it with me.
How about a straight staircase?
The staircase is often a central element in the design. What is important to you?
Does it have to be located in the hallway area, or—as in the example—can it be within the dining area? Especially if there is a large living space separated nearby, it’s great to connect the upper floor more closely to daily life via the stairs. Additionally, this location automatically keeps it out of the dirty or entry zone. It’s really a matter of personal preference.
Should it be possible to separate the floors later in life, or is this unimportant? This is an important consideration, as it can restrict the staircase design significantly and reduce options.
Can the staircase be curved with angled steps, or should it have only straight steps (either a landing or a straight flight)?
Should it start in the entrance/dirt zone, or would you prefer not?
The staircase is often a central element in the design. What is important to you?
Does it have to be located in the hallway area, or—as in the example—can it be within the dining area? Especially if there is a large living space separated nearby, it’s great to connect the upper floor more closely to daily life via the stairs. Additionally, this location automatically keeps it out of the dirty or entry zone. It’s really a matter of personal preference.
Should it be possible to separate the floors later in life, or is this unimportant? This is an important consideration, as it can restrict the staircase design significantly and reduce options.
Can the staircase be curved with angled steps, or should it have only straight steps (either a landing or a straight flight)?
Should it start in the entrance/dirt zone, or would you prefer not?
keychain schrieb:
From the beginning, we wanted to separate the children's and parents' areas on the upper floor. Our current solution only connects the bathrooms to keep the plumbing runs simple. A good planner can route the pipes from one end of the house to the other and vice versa. In such large houses, having two plumbing shafts is not unusual—so what? While plumbing is important and it’s nice if pipes don’t run down the middle of the living room, you shouldn’t overdo it by trying to minimize the plumbing runs excessively.
kaho674 schrieb:
The staircase is often the central element in planning. What is important to you?
Does it have to be located in the hallway, or can it, like in the example, be within the dining area? Especially if there is a large living area separated off, it’s great when the upper floor is connected more closely to daily life via the staircase. Also, this way it’s automatically outside the dirt zone. Just a matter of personal taste.
Should it be possible to separate the floors in old age, or is that unimportant? This point should be carefully considered, as it restricts the staircase design and leaves fewer options.
Can it be curved with angled steps, or should only straight steps (with a landing or straight staircase) be used?
Can it start in the entrance / dirt zone, or is that better avoided?We want a staircase that matches the house’s atmosphere. That wasn’t the case with the first version—it had the desired landing, but both the step layout and the entire staircase design were very inconvenient. I find all three new options much less cramped.
So far, the staircase has been in the hallway to provide some acoustic separation from the living room. We can’t estimate how much noise passes through a solid wood door into the children’s room when we’re sitting there in the evening talking with friends—the second door seemed reasonable. But it also makes sense that the living, cooking, and dining area should be somewhat separated from the rest of the house, as there’s no direct connection. If the staircase is integrated into the living/dining room, the benefit would be that it feels more like a unified space, I think.
A curved staircase is welcome, but the steps shouldn’t become particularly narrow on one side, as that reduces the sense of spaciousness and makes it uncomfortable. I don’t think a delicate or especially elegant staircase would fit either—the house’s atmosphere is rather rustic and cozy. Maybe something like a luxury farmhouse style? Lots of solid wood, roughly finished rustic stone surfaces, something along those lines.
I don’t want the staircase location to depend on the dirt zone, since I’m the first who doesn’t take off shoes and walks through the house—bad habit and all. That’s why the entire ground floor, especially the pathways from the front door to the terrace, is planned with a durable flooring. We also have a dog, and possibly another one in the future, so the whole ground floor effectively becomes a “dirt zone.”
Separating floors in old age is not a concern for me. One of the ideas is actually to live only on the ground floor in old age. Yes, the upper floor has a nicer view, but I can do without that; it would become a guest area reserved for visiting children, grandchildren, or dust. The ground floor area is large enough if I can no longer manage stairs. More likely, we would move and find something else. The garden and the large house aren’t really age-appropriate anyway.
You’ve made more changes to your floor plan—I’ll make a second post to keep things clear.
The wiring is no longer an issue. Initially, the ground floor ceiling was supposed to have exposed beams, which would have complicated things significantly. We decided against that and can now run most of the wiring easily within the stud walls and the ceiling. So, only exterior walls and the necessary posts are off-limits. However, this means your proposed changes to the kitchen don’t really work – first, the kitchen island is fixed at 4 meters (13 feet) and can’t really be changed, and second, we have to take that one post into account.
We discussed the pantry earlier and decided against it. There is a large storage room in the basement, and the kitchen is so spacious that we don’t need extra intermediate storage. We can better use that space for the kitchen, a coffee corner, or something else.
If we integrate the staircase into the living room, where will the stairs to the basement be? Presumably, you wouldn’t want that in the living room. Would there be a second staircase in the hallway?
We discussed the pantry earlier and decided against it. There is a large storage room in the basement, and the kitchen is so spacious that we don’t need extra intermediate storage. We can better use that space for the kitchen, a coffee corner, or something else.
If we integrate the staircase into the living room, where will the stairs to the basement be? Presumably, you wouldn’t want that in the living room. Would there be a second staircase in the hallway?
H
HausaufGrund13 Jun 2018 14:19This is what I meant about the staircase separating the living area from the entrance hall. (Images attached)
The staircase is marked in yellow; in front of it, an open space could be left as an atrium to create a stronger connection between the floors (green).
It might even be possible to plan for an elevator here.
Upstairs, there could be a nice gallery.
With the sliding doors on the ground floor leading to the staircase, you can optionally include the entrance area with the study and guest room as part of the living space—or not (also considering the basement stairway).
For me, the library would be located downstairs, to the left of the living room, separated from the rest of the living area by a sliding door.
The guest room on the ground floor could, if desired, be designed with an ensuite bathroom (as an option).
Whether you go up the stairs on the right or left is a matter of personal preference.
I would take the stairs on the left bottom side, so the “noisy” children do not have to pass by my bedroom door when they want to go to the ground floor. ^^
On the upper floor, on the south side, I would plan a rooftop terrace accessible from the bathrooms.
The architect can take care of the drainage system. P ;
In the master bathroom, I have planned a sauna. A large sliding door between the bedroom and bathroom allows both rooms to be combined into a spacious suite when needed.
A laundry chute could start in the hallway on the upper floor, possibly in the upper right corner near the north-facing children’s bedroom, and run down to the basement, concealed by the built-in closet on the ground floor.
At the moment, the master bathroom is designed as a private ensuite. If preferred (for example, if someone wants to sleep longer), it could be redesigned with access to the hallway or similar.
Based on your description with the larger windows in the basement, I would place exercise equipment there, and use the other rooms upstairs to be more spacious instead.
Of course, this is just a suggestion to help imagine a different layout—I am not an architect.
A new staircase location always opens up new possibilities for room arrangements.
With this staircase position, it might even be possible to separate the upper floor from the ground floor.
Have you ever discussed a straight staircase placement for this floor plan with your architect?
But all of this depends heavily on personal taste. This idea just came to me yesterday when I saw your floor plan.
I can personally imagine it working well.
I have no idea if any of this appeals to you, but I thought I’d take the time to sketch something out, especially since your timeline seems tight.
Best regards
The staircase is marked in yellow; in front of it, an open space could be left as an atrium to create a stronger connection between the floors (green).
It might even be possible to plan for an elevator here.
Upstairs, there could be a nice gallery.
With the sliding doors on the ground floor leading to the staircase, you can optionally include the entrance area with the study and guest room as part of the living space—or not (also considering the basement stairway).
For me, the library would be located downstairs, to the left of the living room, separated from the rest of the living area by a sliding door.
The guest room on the ground floor could, if desired, be designed with an ensuite bathroom (as an option).
Whether you go up the stairs on the right or left is a matter of personal preference.
I would take the stairs on the left bottom side, so the “noisy” children do not have to pass by my bedroom door when they want to go to the ground floor. ^^
On the upper floor, on the south side, I would plan a rooftop terrace accessible from the bathrooms.
The architect can take care of the drainage system. P ;
In the master bathroom, I have planned a sauna. A large sliding door between the bedroom and bathroom allows both rooms to be combined into a spacious suite when needed.
A laundry chute could start in the hallway on the upper floor, possibly in the upper right corner near the north-facing children’s bedroom, and run down to the basement, concealed by the built-in closet on the ground floor.
At the moment, the master bathroom is designed as a private ensuite. If preferred (for example, if someone wants to sleep longer), it could be redesigned with access to the hallway or similar.
Based on your description with the larger windows in the basement, I would place exercise equipment there, and use the other rooms upstairs to be more spacious instead.
Of course, this is just a suggestion to help imagine a different layout—I am not an architect.
A new staircase location always opens up new possibilities for room arrangements.
With this staircase position, it might even be possible to separate the upper floor from the ground floor.
Have you ever discussed a straight staircase placement for this floor plan with your architect?
But all of this depends heavily on personal taste. This idea just came to me yesterday when I saw your floor plan.
I can personally imagine it working well.
I have no idea if any of this appeals to you, but I thought I’d take the time to sketch something out, especially since your timeline seems tight.
Best regards
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