Hello, we are still in the planning phase, and I would like to benefit from the experiences of those who have already been through this.
A very important point in our considerations is the kitchen. Almost all the design ideas and floor plans we find tend to feature rather small kitchens, open-plan, sometimes under 10 sqm (100 sq ft), with the dining area in the living room naturally being sufficiently large.
Personally, I’m not a fan of the open kitchen concept. I want a closed kitchen. Also, I want the option to have a dining table in the kitchen that can seat four people. The dining corner doesn’t have to be very large. However, I want the possibility to have breakfast in the kitchen so that I don’t end up with a messy living room every morning after eating with two small children.
But a kitchen of 10 sqm (100 sq ft) probably won’t be enough for this.
If you have a dining table in your kitchen, how big is it, and how large is your entire kitchen? I’m also happy to be inspired by photos.
Or am I overestimating the importance of being able to eat in the kitchen?
A very important point in our considerations is the kitchen. Almost all the design ideas and floor plans we find tend to feature rather small kitchens, open-plan, sometimes under 10 sqm (100 sq ft), with the dining area in the living room naturally being sufficiently large.
Personally, I’m not a fan of the open kitchen concept. I want a closed kitchen. Also, I want the option to have a dining table in the kitchen that can seat four people. The dining corner doesn’t have to be very large. However, I want the possibility to have breakfast in the kitchen so that I don’t end up with a messy living room every morning after eating with two small children.
But a kitchen of 10 sqm (100 sq ft) probably won’t be enough for this.
If you have a dining table in your kitchen, how big is it, and how large is your entire kitchen? I’m also happy to be inspired by photos.
Or am I overestimating the importance of being able to eat in the kitchen?
You are basically right, of course; maybe we are currently focusing too much on the square meters.
While placing furniture in all the other rooms wouldn't be a problem, this is very specifically about the kitchen and my fixed idea of having a table in there.
For the kitchen, I don’t need a table with 5-6 seats. It should simply be a small table where four of us can have breakfast in the morning, or where a child can later do homework or draw if they want to... It doesn’t have to be large, but I want a kitchen with a seating area for us. I’m used to it and don’t want to give it up.
I’m thinking of something substantial. A table that is easy to maintain, simply wipeable, and chairs that are easy to clean.
I definitely want an L-shaped kitchen, but I’m not sure if this L-shape can be realized in the “guest” room because of the entrance door to the room and the door leading to the garden? I don’t have the spatial awareness to judge that just from a plan.
While placing furniture in all the other rooms wouldn't be a problem, this is very specifically about the kitchen and my fixed idea of having a table in there.
For the kitchen, I don’t need a table with 5-6 seats. It should simply be a small table where four of us can have breakfast in the morning, or where a child can later do homework or draw if they want to... It doesn’t have to be large, but I want a kitchen with a seating area for us. I’m used to it and don’t want to give it up.
I’m thinking of something substantial. A table that is easy to maintain, simply wipeable, and chairs that are easy to clean.
I definitely want an L-shaped kitchen, but I’m not sure if this L-shape can be realized in the “guest” room because of the entrance door to the room and the door leading to the garden? I don’t have the spatial awareness to judge that just from a plan.
Do you know the dimensions of the room? Then it’s easy to see if it’s even possible.
Kitchen depth 60cm (24 inches) – passage xx cm – table 200cm (79 inches)
I would say that to walk through comfortably, the passage should be more than 100cm (39 inches). That makes a minimum room width of 360cm (142 inches).
Kitchen depth 60cm (24 inches) – passage xx cm – table 200cm (79 inches)
I would say that to walk through comfortably, the passage should be more than 100cm (39 inches). That makes a minimum room width of 360cm (142 inches).
Mizit schrieb:
The question is not silly at all. No, I haven’t done that yet. I haven’t bought a kitchen or a bistro table, so at best I can calculate how big each piece of furniture could theoretically be. But I also don’t know the sizes or swing areas of the doors. I think we’ll have to discuss that again with an architect.I’m quite shocked reading this: you are facing some problems that are older than this thread, and yet you haven’t even bought a few sheets of 5 millimeter graph paper (about 0.2 inches) to sketch out your problem.
You put everything into those square meters, but you don’t actually know how much fits into one square meter and what doesn’t.
I’m really surprised. By the time I listed how much space everything consumes, you should have started drawing. Don’t you have any drawings on graph paper at all???
Mizit schrieb:
It should just be a small table where the four of us can have breakfast in the morning.Your homework is to check the size of such a table or how much area a table for 4 people occupies.
A table that seats one person on each side is not suitable to place against a wall.
Then get familiar with the dimensions of a standard kitchen. It doesn’t matter if the eventual furniture is 58 or 59 centimeters (23 or 23.2 inches) deep; there will usually be a 10–15 centimeter (4–6 inch) installation gap needed in any case. You usually plan with a standard cabinet of 60 centimeters (24 inches) width/depth.
Check Ikea’s website or better yet, visit Ikea in person: Ikea is a great example for furnishing small spaces.
Take a tape measure and measure distances between the table and the kitchen units, then assess whether the dimensions actually work.
If you find yourself banging your backside somewhere, then the space is too tight.
Ikea also offers an online planner where, I believe, you can include tables and chairs in the layout.
Mizit schrieb:
Or we reduce the almost 11 square meter (about 118 square feet) kitchen to about 7–8 (that should be enough for a small room with a sofa bed?), but give those 3 square meters to the living room? Although shifting those walls would affect load-bearing walls...What do you gain from freeing up 3 square meters (about 32 square feet) in the living room? I think the main issue here is the kitchen?
7–8 square meters (about 75–86 square feet) may or may not be enough, but it could be. Draw it out and see! Please!
P.S. You really need to engage more with the house plans to understand what you are actually getting.
Simply narrow the passage from the existing kitchen to the dining area to about one meter (approximately 3 feet 3 inches) and shift it toward the longer leg of the L-shaped kitchen layout. Then move the door to the hallway according to the planned layout (where the short leg of the L is). Above the door to the hallway, there should be enough space for a narrow but long table.
The long side of the table would be placed against the wall, where no one sits. Two people would sit along the other long side, and one person on each of the short sides. With the room dimensions, this could be calculated more precisely, but I assume that 0.6 meters (2 feet) for the kitchen unit depth, 1 meter (3 feet 3 inches) for the passage, and 0.7 meters (2 feet 4 inches) for the table width would be roughly sufficient.
It will be a bit tight when someone is sitting along the long side of the table, but once the children are old enough and no longer make a mess with crumbs, the table can also be taken out if necessary.
The long side of the table would be placed against the wall, where no one sits. Two people would sit along the other long side, and one person on each of the short sides. With the room dimensions, this could be calculated more precisely, but I assume that 0.6 meters (2 feet) for the kitchen unit depth, 1 meter (3 feet 3 inches) for the passage, and 0.7 meters (2 feet 4 inches) for the table width would be roughly sufficient.
It will be a bit tight when someone is sitting along the long side of the table, but once the children are old enough and no longer make a mess with crumbs, the table can also be taken out if necessary.
Maria16 schrieb:
Simply narrow the passage from the existing kitchen to the dining area to about one meter (and shift it toward the long leg of the L-shaped kitchen), then move the door to the hallway according to the plans (where the short leg of the L is). Above the hallway door, there should then be space for a narrow but long table.I had a similar idea.
Our kitchen layout is similar, although we have just over 14 square meters (about 4 x 3 meters (13 x 10 feet)). Our general contractor works with an architect who designs each house layout individually and does not rely on standard plans (so the kitchen layout was also customized, as we wanted from the start to have a table for four people in the kitchen).
At the spot where the wall opening is, we installed a sliding door to the living room. Since your kitchen is narrower than ours, the sliding door would have to be narrower than the current opening (standard door size).
Also, the approach suggested by @Maria16 to shift the hallway door makes sense, as the narrow kitchen only allows for a table in the corner created by her adjustment. With a 3-meter (10-foot) width, other options would be possible.
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