ᐅ What is feasible on the existing plot and within the budget
Created on: 8 Mar 2019 13:12
N
neigschmeckt
Hello everyone,
somehow I’m stuck in a planning chaos and hope to get a few tips from you regarding the planning approach and/or ideas for implementation…
In particular, a cost estimate would probably help me with regard to the basement design. Or how many square meters of house we can afford. Can we save money if, instead of a living basement, we plan the garage in the basement and enlarge the house footprint to accommodate a guest room/office and utility room?
What is the most cost-effective way to achieve my desired level access to the large terrace and garden from the ground floor (living/dining/kitchen)? There should be enough space to at least partially accommodate an embankment with a slope.
Any ideas for the placement of the garage? I especially can’t quite visualize the slope.
We still have a total budget of 500,000 € (land already owned). It has to be somehow feasible with this budget to build a family house (not just standard equipped) with more than 130 sqm plus basement, garage and outdoor area in Baden-Württemberg, right?
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: approx. 769 sqm (access and final measurement still pending)
Slope: yes, 2 or 3 meters (6.5 or 10 feet) gradient
Floor area ratio: 0.4 (max. 0.6)
Floor space index: -
Building window, building line and boundary: 2.5 m (8 ft) setback from boundary
Edge development: garages, if connected to the main building; street-side 1 m (3 ft) distance
Number of parking spaces: 2
Number of floors: -
Roof shape: single-pitched (SD), half-hipped (vSD), gabled roof (WD) 30 - 40°: max ridge height 8.0 m (26 ft)
dormer roof (ZD), gable dormer (gD) 10 – 25°: max ridge height 8.0 m (26 ft)
flat roof (FD) 0 -5°: max parapet height 6.8 m (22 ft)
Architectural style: -
Orientation: parallel to the street or rotated 90°, see plan
Maximum heights/limits: height measured from reference height (highest point on our plot); max ridge height 8 m (26 ft) (for flat roof max parapet height 6.8 m (22 ft))
Additional requirements:
Client requirements:
Style: modern, but practicality on the outside more important than aesthetics!
Roof type: doesn’t matter, just no knee wall under 1.50 m (5 ft)
Building type: any
Basement, floors: initial idea is a living basement with a self-contained apartment; alternatively living basement with guest room/office or utility basement with integrated garage?? This is already part of the planning problem
Number of people, age: 36 and 38 + 1.5 years
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
GF: (level access with garden connection or large terrace) 50 sqm (540 sqft) for open living/dining/kitchen; the rest depends on wishes such as guest toilet or shower bathroom, entrance area/wardrobe as a mudroom to avoid dirt being brought into the house, circulation area for stairs and guest toilet not in the dirty area right at the front door; small office/spare guest room, possibly a pantry for vacuum cleaner, broom, etc.
UF: bathroom with double vanity, bathtub for two (180 x 80 cm (71 x 31 inches)), bright floor-tiled shower 1 x 1.2 m (3 x 4 ft) with glass door; one large (>15 sqm (160 sqft)) and one smaller (about 12-15 sqm (130-160 sqft)) children’s bedrooms; master bedroom, walk-in closet (accessible from the corridor), small hallway (no wasted space for large hallway, prefer bigger rooms), possibly utility room for washing machine, dryer, ironing and drying rack
Office: Family use or home office?: both; both adults work about one day a week from home.
Overnight guests per year: around 1-2 guests every 2 months, possibly increasing due to childcare
Open or closed architecture: open!
Conservative or modern construction: rather modern, many floor-to-ceiling windows, light light light…
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen!!! Preferably with an island (possibly not enough space); important: sink and work surface not against a wall and not facing away from living-dining area!! (Wish side-by-side fridge, tall oven)
Number of dining seats: 4-6 (more than 6 only with extendable table and chairs to be fetched)
Fireplace: possibly preparation
Music/speaker wall: no
Balcony, roof terrace: because of the slope garage roof on basement level as roof terrace for the ground floor
Garage, carport: double—preferably large garage. Two cars used only on weekends MUST fit in garage with some space for tools and repairs. For one daily-use car garage or carport (convenient getting in/out and short, low-stair access paths to house entrance, preferably under cover). One more daily car somewhere else (e.g. parking space in front of garage or similar)
Utility garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special features/daily routine, also reasons why this or that should or should not be:
level access from kitchen/dining/living to garden is a must, alternatively large roof terrace leading to garden!
Future wishes: possibility to add a pool; smart home retrofit
House design
Designed by:
-builder’s planner
-architect
-do-it-yourself
What do you like especially? Why?
What do you dislike? Why?
Price estimate by architect/planner:
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 500,000 € for house including everything, also earthworks, kitchen, outdoor area (possibly in installments) and double garage
Preferred heating technology: gas not connected, therefore air-source heat pump, preferably with photovoltaics
If you had to forego some details/extensions
-You could live without: for now the third garage or carport for daily vehicle or oversized double/large garage, if planning allows later realization; self-contained apartment, living basement (if office on ground floor and utility room upstairs), basement (if slope allows and house footprint increases), stair-low access to the house, fireplace
-You cannot do without: 50 sqm open living/dining/kitchen, open living, mudroom, floor-to-ceiling windows, electric shutters,
somehow I’m stuck in a planning chaos and hope to get a few tips from you regarding the planning approach and/or ideas for implementation…
In particular, a cost estimate would probably help me with regard to the basement design. Or how many square meters of house we can afford. Can we save money if, instead of a living basement, we plan the garage in the basement and enlarge the house footprint to accommodate a guest room/office and utility room?
What is the most cost-effective way to achieve my desired level access to the large terrace and garden from the ground floor (living/dining/kitchen)? There should be enough space to at least partially accommodate an embankment with a slope.
Any ideas for the placement of the garage? I especially can’t quite visualize the slope.
We still have a total budget of 500,000 € (land already owned). It has to be somehow feasible with this budget to build a family house (not just standard equipped) with more than 130 sqm plus basement, garage and outdoor area in Baden-Württemberg, right?
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: approx. 769 sqm (access and final measurement still pending)
Slope: yes, 2 or 3 meters (6.5 or 10 feet) gradient
Floor area ratio: 0.4 (max. 0.6)
Floor space index: -
Building window, building line and boundary: 2.5 m (8 ft) setback from boundary
Edge development: garages, if connected to the main building; street-side 1 m (3 ft) distance
Number of parking spaces: 2
Number of floors: -
Roof shape: single-pitched (SD), half-hipped (vSD), gabled roof (WD) 30 - 40°: max ridge height 8.0 m (26 ft)
dormer roof (ZD), gable dormer (gD) 10 – 25°: max ridge height 8.0 m (26 ft)
flat roof (FD) 0 -5°: max parapet height 6.8 m (22 ft)
Architectural style: -
Orientation: parallel to the street or rotated 90°, see plan
Maximum heights/limits: height measured from reference height (highest point on our plot); max ridge height 8 m (26 ft) (for flat roof max parapet height 6.8 m (22 ft))
Additional requirements:
Client requirements:
Style: modern, but practicality on the outside more important than aesthetics!
Roof type: doesn’t matter, just no knee wall under 1.50 m (5 ft)
Building type: any
Basement, floors: initial idea is a living basement with a self-contained apartment; alternatively living basement with guest room/office or utility basement with integrated garage?? This is already part of the planning problem
Number of people, age: 36 and 38 + 1.5 years
Space requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
GF: (level access with garden connection or large terrace) 50 sqm (540 sqft) for open living/dining/kitchen; the rest depends on wishes such as guest toilet or shower bathroom, entrance area/wardrobe as a mudroom to avoid dirt being brought into the house, circulation area for stairs and guest toilet not in the dirty area right at the front door; small office/spare guest room, possibly a pantry for vacuum cleaner, broom, etc.
UF: bathroom with double vanity, bathtub for two (180 x 80 cm (71 x 31 inches)), bright floor-tiled shower 1 x 1.2 m (3 x 4 ft) with glass door; one large (>15 sqm (160 sqft)) and one smaller (about 12-15 sqm (130-160 sqft)) children’s bedrooms; master bedroom, walk-in closet (accessible from the corridor), small hallway (no wasted space for large hallway, prefer bigger rooms), possibly utility room for washing machine, dryer, ironing and drying rack
Office: Family use or home office?: both; both adults work about one day a week from home.
Overnight guests per year: around 1-2 guests every 2 months, possibly increasing due to childcare
Open or closed architecture: open!
Conservative or modern construction: rather modern, many floor-to-ceiling windows, light light light…
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen!!! Preferably with an island (possibly not enough space); important: sink and work surface not against a wall and not facing away from living-dining area!! (Wish side-by-side fridge, tall oven)
Number of dining seats: 4-6 (more than 6 only with extendable table and chairs to be fetched)
Fireplace: possibly preparation
Music/speaker wall: no
Balcony, roof terrace: because of the slope garage roof on basement level as roof terrace for the ground floor
Garage, carport: double—preferably large garage. Two cars used only on weekends MUST fit in garage with some space for tools and repairs. For one daily-use car garage or carport (convenient getting in/out and short, low-stair access paths to house entrance, preferably under cover). One more daily car somewhere else (e.g. parking space in front of garage or similar)
Utility garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special features/daily routine, also reasons why this or that should or should not be:
level access from kitchen/dining/living to garden is a must, alternatively large roof terrace leading to garden!
Future wishes: possibility to add a pool; smart home retrofit
House design
Designed by:
-builder’s planner
-architect
-do-it-yourself
What do you like especially? Why?
What do you dislike? Why?
Price estimate by architect/planner:
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 500,000 € for house including everything, also earthworks, kitchen, outdoor area (possibly in installments) and double garage
Preferred heating technology: gas not connected, therefore air-source heat pump, preferably with photovoltaics
If you had to forego some details/extensions
-You could live without: for now the third garage or carport for daily vehicle or oversized double/large garage, if planning allows later realization; self-contained apartment, living basement (if office on ground floor and utility room upstairs), basement (if slope allows and house footprint increases), stair-low access to the house, fireplace
-You cannot do without: 50 sqm open living/dining/kitchen, open living, mudroom, floor-to-ceiling windows, electric shutters,
N
neigschmeckt9 Mar 2019 14:21Addition regarding the warning about the garage flooding during heavy rain: this issue also concerns us. However, I imagine we can find a solution. The driveway definitely doesn’t need to be completely paved over. There won’t be everyday vehicles going in and out regularly. A narrow driveway would be sufficient here. Perhaps even grass pavers laid only in the tire tracks. Or am I once again imagining this too simply?
@11ant
Edit to the post above:
1. I shifted your suggested height by half a meter. That’s what happens when you reply in passing... please adjust your suggestion to 209.5 for the correction. But we would still be 1 meter below our planned basement height.
2. I confused the mentioned fear of sloping roofs with roof windows. My view is quite similar, though. We live in an attic with knee walls between 1.20–1.30 meters (3.9–4.3 feet) and 1 meter (3.3 feet). So we know what we’re talking about. Generally, I like the sloped ceiling for the feeling of space, provided you’re not dependent on a double casement window and the room is large enough to accommodate furniture.
@11ant
Edit to the post above:
1. I shifted your suggested height by half a meter. That’s what happens when you reply in passing... please adjust your suggestion to 209.5 for the correction. But we would still be 1 meter below our planned basement height.
2. I confused the mentioned fear of sloping roofs with roof windows. My view is quite similar, though. We live in an attic with knee walls between 1.20–1.30 meters (3.9–4.3 feet) and 1 meter (3.3 feet). So we know what we’re talking about. Generally, I like the sloped ceiling for the feeling of space, provided you’re not dependent on a double casement window and the room is large enough to accommodate furniture.
I’m glad that your fear of sloped ceilings is not as pronounced as I had initially expected: currently, it is quite common among homeowners (also in other forums) to have the unrealistic expectation of wanting standing and storage height down to the very last corner of every paid square meter.
On a slope, you can’t really avoid having some sympathy for pitched roofs, especially if the house is to blend reasonably well into the landscape; being able to look over the ridge of the neighboring valley house also requires a certain roof pitch, because otherwise your view would stop at their eaves. The greater the difference between the roof pitch and the slope angle (with the slope angle being the larger value), the stronger this “effect” becomes.
If you want, you can set your ground floor level to 210 instead of 209.5, but I find 210.5 less likely (although I have a good spatial imagination; if I can compare it to a specific plan from you, my opinion might still adjust slightly).
I still advise you to be sparing with every single decimeter of modeling and especially not to underestimate its domino effect (@Zaba12: could you check whether the Google Earth image of your street is up to date enough to already show the alarming land use caused by the L-block cascades?).
At the very least, the slope of your embankments toward the neighboring valley property would drain towards it, which must be avoided.
Regarding the comment about rainwater and the garage: for the roof terrace to be usable, it would have to be located a full floor below the ground floor. Lowering the garage does not make this possible: if it ended up below the current ground level, water would bend along the slope into the driveway, and you would then have to install a huge cistern under the drip edge in front of the garage door. So, I see your garage floor better placed in such a way that, projected from the uphill garage door edge to the street, it is at least slightly higher. If you want to look over the garage, even 210.5 for the ground floor might be tight (the building height limit would probably allow it, but this would mean excessive backfilling, and your wish for a garden without severe height breaks would hardly still be feasible). But I stress “hardly” and not “impossible”—by now you should probably realize what I meant by the architect needing to be a clever fox.
The rules for terrain modeling are probably best known here by @Escroda, and @Zaba12 has the freshest personal experience (but also the recent cost shock). In my assessment, the regional building code will define things clearly enough so that no federal law (or judicial law) will have to step in to fill any gaps.
However, I advise you to direct your call to fellow thinkers especially strongly towards suggestions for alternative building placements.
I consider the idea of self-donating labor for the excavation a good one—but keep in mind that a) the volume of soil cannot be reused 1:1 and b) the moving itself “costs.”
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
On a slope, you can’t really avoid having some sympathy for pitched roofs, especially if the house is to blend reasonably well into the landscape; being able to look over the ridge of the neighboring valley house also requires a certain roof pitch, because otherwise your view would stop at their eaves. The greater the difference between the roof pitch and the slope angle (with the slope angle being the larger value), the stronger this “effect” becomes.
If you want, you can set your ground floor level to 210 instead of 209.5, but I find 210.5 less likely (although I have a good spatial imagination; if I can compare it to a specific plan from you, my opinion might still adjust slightly).
I still advise you to be sparing with every single decimeter of modeling and especially not to underestimate its domino effect (@Zaba12: could you check whether the Google Earth image of your street is up to date enough to already show the alarming land use caused by the L-block cascades?).
At the very least, the slope of your embankments toward the neighboring valley property would drain towards it, which must be avoided.
Regarding the comment about rainwater and the garage: for the roof terrace to be usable, it would have to be located a full floor below the ground floor. Lowering the garage does not make this possible: if it ended up below the current ground level, water would bend along the slope into the driveway, and you would then have to install a huge cistern under the drip edge in front of the garage door. So, I see your garage floor better placed in such a way that, projected from the uphill garage door edge to the street, it is at least slightly higher. If you want to look over the garage, even 210.5 for the ground floor might be tight (the building height limit would probably allow it, but this would mean excessive backfilling, and your wish for a garden without severe height breaks would hardly still be feasible). But I stress “hardly” and not “impossible”—by now you should probably realize what I meant by the architect needing to be a clever fox.
The rules for terrain modeling are probably best known here by @Escroda, and @Zaba12 has the freshest personal experience (but also the recent cost shock). In my assessment, the regional building code will define things clearly enough so that no federal law (or judicial law) will have to step in to fill any gaps.
However, I advise you to direct your call to fellow thinkers especially strongly towards suggestions for alternative building placements.
I consider the idea of self-donating labor for the excavation a good one—but keep in mind that a) the volume of soil cannot be reused 1:1 and b) the moving itself “costs.”
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
You can’t compare older basement apartments with modern ones. The older ones are much more like traditional cellars. I myself lived for years in a basement apartment built in 1984.
The garden can be landscaped and divided into several zones.
Barbecue/dining preferably near the kitchen
Playing area rather in the shade
Pool preferably on the south side
The garden can be landscaped and divided into several zones.
Barbecue/dining preferably near the kitchen
Playing area rather in the shade
Pool preferably on the south side
Zaba12 schrieb:
Something like that @11ant? Thanks, but I meant to show in the aerial view how much garden area is actually used for that, for grading the terrain with slopes or steps. A slope of 1:1.5 means that a one-meter (3.3 feet) height adjustment requires a 1.5-meter (5 feet) wide strip just for the slope; this does not yet include the drainage, which will need to be managed before the property boundary. This isn’t just a cost issue—the earthworks for height adjustments also reduce the available space.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
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