ᐅ New Single-Family Home Construction in Southern Germany
Created on: 18 Nov 2020 00:43
W
WilderSueden
Hello everyone,
after jumping straight into the basement discussion thread, I want to use this one as an introduction and idea-sharing thread. Some things might seem a bit chaotic at first, but that will surely clear up.
We are expecting our first child in February. Since two rooms are obviously too few for the long term, we need something larger. The housing market here in Konstanz is notoriously difficult, so we didn’t spend much time searching here. Thanks to Corona home office, we focused on areas a bit further away right from the start. Initially, we looked mostly at existing properties, but due to the poor condition of what’s on offer, we unexpectedly ended up deciding to build. We were actually lucky to get a plot in a new development area around Stockach-Pfullendorf. The site started being developed this week and will probably be buildable from summer onward.
Here are some key details:
- He/I am 33, work in the software industry, based in Konstanz, from a rural area
- She is 41, a teacher in the Hegau region, from a city that basically doesn’t exist
- One child on the way, no further children planned and unlikely due to her age
- Currently living in about 65sqm (700 sq ft) with 2.5 rooms in a lovely apartment building…
- Basically, we don’t want anything too fancy—no extensive smart home automation, no luxury mansion with marble and so on. Just something solid and nice. We are not building to fulfill a lifelong dream but to avoid renovating an old house worth half a million euros. Plain wallpaper texture and laminate flooring would be fine for us if the quality is good.
- Accordingly, we don’t mind using a “standard” floor plan from a prefabricated house builder or a typical model home.
- That said, since we are building, it should be energy efficient and we don’t want to use concepts that might soon be politically outdated or unsupported.
- Do-it-yourself work only to a limited extent, as we are neither professionals nor do we have relevant contacts. Also, the new house is a bit further away, so working on it in the evening is unlikely. A weekend of painting before moving in is no problem, and after moving in, doing the carport, terrace, and garden ourselves is also fine.
- The construction partner must be reliable.
Plot and financials:
- Plot roughly 700sqm (7,535 sq ft) at 98€ per sqm → 70,000€, fairly rectangular
- 120,000€ equity (with some reserve left)
- Financing and ownership entirely in my name (unmarried and no joint assets intended)
- Planned overall budget about 500,000€
- Target monthly payment 1,500€
- Accordingly, loan to be repaid in 25 years with that rate, with some extra repayments planned mid-term aiming for about 20 years total
Budget breakdown:
- Plot 70,000€
- Ancillary plot costs 5,000€
- Other construction-related fees 60,000€
- Basement 50,000€
- Kitchen 10,000€
- Driveway, carport, terrace as DIY 15,000€
-----
210,000€
Leaves about 290,000€ in the budget for the house itself, which is probably quite tight for what we have planned. The budget still needs to be adjusted with a buffer.
So far, our wishlist looks roughly like this:
- Not excessively large, more like 120–130sqm (1,290–1,400 sq ft)
- Efficient, modern house
- Photovoltaic system (possibly with battery storage)
- Underfloor heating with heat pump
- Home office for me on the ground floor (makes sense since I mostly work from home)
- Bedroom upstairs, one office for her that also serves as a guest room and reserve nursery
- Large open-plan kitchen/living area
- Basement
- Cistern
- Carport for two cars and one trailer
Our first contact about building was through an ad from the local Town & Country partner. The consultant was friendly, and the show house in Geisingen looked quite nice, but somehow it all felt a bit too conservative. Built according to the Energy Saving Ordinance 2016, standard gas heating. Sure, upgrades are possible, but I’m not sure if a heat pump makes sense under that regulation anymore. The fact that the show house had cracks in the plaster here and there isn’t exactly reassuring either. But the base price is lower. Current status: two meetings, visited the show house, haven’t requested the scope of services yet.
Then we looked a bit into prefab houses. Most offer KfW55 standard, which is closer to what we want and would be a good base for going to KfW40+ since a photovoltaic system is already planned (probably just with battery preparation though). Visited the park in Villingen-Schwenningen. Had a long chat with Schwabenhaus; the consultant seemed to want to downplay costs and was very keen to sell a ground-source heat pump with boreholes. The upgrade options for the promotional houses looked likely to increase costs significantly. Visited Heldhaus, liked it quite a lot but their cost outline overshoots the budget by roughly 100,000€.
Today we had an appointment with Schwörerhaus. The floor plan of one of their promotional houses fits pretty well. Basement plus KfW40+ seems somewhat challenging in combination. Otherwise, a generally good impression; the briefly reviewed scope of services doesn’t give the impression the house would be unpleasant to live in. Let’s see what the first offer will look like. I don’t get the feeling there’s much that could go wrong there.
Next week we have an appointment with Weberhaus. We found a floor plan we really like. The price is initially the highest, but their examples include KfW40+ standard and smart home automation upfront.
Our goal is to narrow down the number of companies we continue with to a maximum of two by Christmas and then decide on a construction partner early next year. In spring, the baby will take priority, not just house planning.
I’ve already posted some thoughts about the basement and possible basement substitutes. The insulation costs for the basement seem to fully consume the additional subsidies, so the photovoltaic battery would have to be paid out of pocket again. One idea on the drive back from the appointment was whether it makes sense to build the house initially to KfW55 standard without extra insulation. The difference in heating costs is relatively small. Then install just the conduit pipes for photovoltaics with battery preparation. A few years later, add a battery once prices drop. That would also likely bring the house closer to the planned budget than going for KfW40+.
These are my thoughts so far. Have I missed anything important?
after jumping straight into the basement discussion thread, I want to use this one as an introduction and idea-sharing thread. Some things might seem a bit chaotic at first, but that will surely clear up.
We are expecting our first child in February. Since two rooms are obviously too few for the long term, we need something larger. The housing market here in Konstanz is notoriously difficult, so we didn’t spend much time searching here. Thanks to Corona home office, we focused on areas a bit further away right from the start. Initially, we looked mostly at existing properties, but due to the poor condition of what’s on offer, we unexpectedly ended up deciding to build. We were actually lucky to get a plot in a new development area around Stockach-Pfullendorf. The site started being developed this week and will probably be buildable from summer onward.
Here are some key details:
- He/I am 33, work in the software industry, based in Konstanz, from a rural area
- She is 41, a teacher in the Hegau region, from a city that basically doesn’t exist
- One child on the way, no further children planned and unlikely due to her age
- Currently living in about 65sqm (700 sq ft) with 2.5 rooms in a lovely apartment building…
- Basically, we don’t want anything too fancy—no extensive smart home automation, no luxury mansion with marble and so on. Just something solid and nice. We are not building to fulfill a lifelong dream but to avoid renovating an old house worth half a million euros. Plain wallpaper texture and laminate flooring would be fine for us if the quality is good.
- Accordingly, we don’t mind using a “standard” floor plan from a prefabricated house builder or a typical model home.
- That said, since we are building, it should be energy efficient and we don’t want to use concepts that might soon be politically outdated or unsupported.
- Do-it-yourself work only to a limited extent, as we are neither professionals nor do we have relevant contacts. Also, the new house is a bit further away, so working on it in the evening is unlikely. A weekend of painting before moving in is no problem, and after moving in, doing the carport, terrace, and garden ourselves is also fine.
- The construction partner must be reliable.
Plot and financials:
- Plot roughly 700sqm (7,535 sq ft) at 98€ per sqm → 70,000€, fairly rectangular
- 120,000€ equity (with some reserve left)
- Financing and ownership entirely in my name (unmarried and no joint assets intended)
- Planned overall budget about 500,000€
- Target monthly payment 1,500€
- Accordingly, loan to be repaid in 25 years with that rate, with some extra repayments planned mid-term aiming for about 20 years total
Budget breakdown:
- Plot 70,000€
- Ancillary plot costs 5,000€
- Other construction-related fees 60,000€
- Basement 50,000€
- Kitchen 10,000€
- Driveway, carport, terrace as DIY 15,000€
-----
210,000€
Leaves about 290,000€ in the budget for the house itself, which is probably quite tight for what we have planned. The budget still needs to be adjusted with a buffer.
So far, our wishlist looks roughly like this:
- Not excessively large, more like 120–130sqm (1,290–1,400 sq ft)
- Efficient, modern house
- Photovoltaic system (possibly with battery storage)
- Underfloor heating with heat pump
- Home office for me on the ground floor (makes sense since I mostly work from home)
- Bedroom upstairs, one office for her that also serves as a guest room and reserve nursery
- Large open-plan kitchen/living area
- Basement
- Cistern
- Carport for two cars and one trailer
Our first contact about building was through an ad from the local Town & Country partner. The consultant was friendly, and the show house in Geisingen looked quite nice, but somehow it all felt a bit too conservative. Built according to the Energy Saving Ordinance 2016, standard gas heating. Sure, upgrades are possible, but I’m not sure if a heat pump makes sense under that regulation anymore. The fact that the show house had cracks in the plaster here and there isn’t exactly reassuring either. But the base price is lower. Current status: two meetings, visited the show house, haven’t requested the scope of services yet.
Then we looked a bit into prefab houses. Most offer KfW55 standard, which is closer to what we want and would be a good base for going to KfW40+ since a photovoltaic system is already planned (probably just with battery preparation though). Visited the park in Villingen-Schwenningen. Had a long chat with Schwabenhaus; the consultant seemed to want to downplay costs and was very keen to sell a ground-source heat pump with boreholes. The upgrade options for the promotional houses looked likely to increase costs significantly. Visited Heldhaus, liked it quite a lot but their cost outline overshoots the budget by roughly 100,000€.
Today we had an appointment with Schwörerhaus. The floor plan of one of their promotional houses fits pretty well. Basement plus KfW40+ seems somewhat challenging in combination. Otherwise, a generally good impression; the briefly reviewed scope of services doesn’t give the impression the house would be unpleasant to live in. Let’s see what the first offer will look like. I don’t get the feeling there’s much that could go wrong there.
Next week we have an appointment with Weberhaus. We found a floor plan we really like. The price is initially the highest, but their examples include KfW40+ standard and smart home automation upfront.
Our goal is to narrow down the number of companies we continue with to a maximum of two by Christmas and then decide on a construction partner early next year. In spring, the baby will take priority, not just house planning.
I’ve already posted some thoughts about the basement and possible basement substitutes. The insulation costs for the basement seem to fully consume the additional subsidies, so the photovoltaic battery would have to be paid out of pocket again. One idea on the drive back from the appointment was whether it makes sense to build the house initially to KfW55 standard without extra insulation. The difference in heating costs is relatively small. Then install just the conduit pipes for photovoltaics with battery preparation. A few years later, add a battery once prices drop. That would also likely bring the house closer to the planned budget than going for KfW40+.
These are my thoughts so far. Have I missed anything important?
W
WilderSueden19 Dec 2020 21:32My main concern with decentralized ventilation is that it requires a vent in every room, and I’m not sure if that is really good from an acoustic point of view. Although we are building on the edge of a village, far from busy roads, I still don’t know if it’s necessary. Fan noise is also somewhat of an issue, but I think high-quality fans can make a big difference. Another point is that I have mostly heard about decentralized ventilation in connection with large houses (i.e., centralized ventilation would have to be per housing unit) and low-cost providers. His main concern with centralized systems is germs and dirt in the ventilation, but personally, I’m less worried about that. I also believe that the general contractor’s personal preference for manual ventilation plays a role in favoring the simpler solution.
@ypg There are many house designs, including many we would consider building. Since we have mainly looked at providers with ready-made plans so far, these are quite diverse. They all have an open-plan kitchen and living area in an L-shape and a study or home office on the ground floor, usually in the northwest corner. However, the local general contractor’s planner tends to put it in the east-southeast corner. I actually like that better because you can see the delivery person right away when they arrive 😉. If we go ahead with them, I would definitely start a separate thread to discuss floor plans. Discussing the floor plan of a prefab builder didn’t seem very useful to me, as major changes are prohibitively expensive anyway.
@ypg There are many house designs, including many we would consider building. Since we have mainly looked at providers with ready-made plans so far, these are quite diverse. They all have an open-plan kitchen and living area in an L-shape and a study or home office on the ground floor, usually in the northwest corner. However, the local general contractor’s planner tends to put it in the east-southeast corner. I actually like that better because you can see the delivery person right away when they arrive 😉. If we go ahead with them, I would definitely start a separate thread to discuss floor plans. Discussing the floor plan of a prefab builder didn’t seem very useful to me, as major changes are prohibitively expensive anyway.
W
WilderSueden19 Dec 2020 23:28Perhaps a few thoughts on the topic of house concepts, floor plans, and building partners. In the thread by @wullewuu, the discussion is quite heated again, with people recommending architects. At some point, the question will probably come up here as well as to why we have so far mostly looked at prefabricated homes or standard house models. Many factors play a role in this, the main ones being that initially we did not plan to build at all but rather wanted to buy something, and my personal mistrust of architects as a profession. The—perhaps somewhat naive—assumption that a pre-designed house is more affordable certainly also plays a part.
Building a pre-designed house is, of course, much closer to buying an existing property than designing freely. Instead of considering where to place the stairs or where a window should be, you browse a catalog and choose a floor plan. At this point, I don’t really believe our needs are so unique that they couldn’t be met by a standard house model. When I mentioned in my last post that we would build various floor plans, it should be understood more as we would buy a house with that floor plan and be happy with it. To me, a house designed by an architect always seemed something exclusive, for people who either really build something unique or consider themselves so special that they think an architect needs to add some special corner or feature to make the house exclusive (see also deliberate creases and bends in car bodywork). Actually, we just want to build a very normal house on a rectangular, nearly flat plot of land, like thousands of others do every year. It doesn’t really make sense to pay an expensive architect to draw a floor plan that you can find in one way or another in 15 different catalogs. (At that time, I didn’t realize you could also spend a lot of money on architects even with prefabricated houses 😉 ).
My rather negative impression of architects so far certainly doesn’t help. Honestly, who comes up with the idea of designing an elevator that can only be reached via stairs? Who thinks of windows that go from floor to ceiling, 2m (6.5 feet) wide, but only open a tiny little slot—and in a building without air conditioning, no less? I think you understand what I mean: architects are the people who either design outrageously expensive villas, make football stadiums look like bird nests (very innovative...), or produce huge monstrosities that anyone normal could plan better. And they always have their hands out for money. Not exactly the kind of background that encourages you to go to an architect when you want to build.
However, over the last few weeks, it has become clear that it’s not quite so simple. Changing the front door position from north to east with a prefabricated home builder is almost the same as rotating the whole house by 90 degrees. Apparently, everyone lives on the south side of the street… or it simply doesn’t matter. Prefabricated houses typically are not handed over fully finished but come without floors and without painting. If you add vinyl flooring to the offer, you get click vinyl for about 140€/m² (13 dollars per square foot) (hopefully gold-plated on the underside) with a thick cork layer installed on top of the expensive low-temperature underfloor heating. Prefabricated houses are quick to assemble, but it takes months on the waiting list before a truck arrives with the materials. And there are still many tasks to be done on-site even though clearly they should be included in the house.
In short, everything is very confusing at the moment, and decisions are difficult. Maybe the local general contractor is actually a good entry point for individual planning. Since it has mostly been about making a rough cost estimate so far, the designs are still not very customized, but if you don’t want to estimate costs in a vacuum, you at least need a rough design. Several appointments will probably be needed to refine it before submitting an application. The advantage would be that in the end, the cost is not about deviations from a standard design but the design itself. And the building planner, as an engineer, would benefit from not being affected by my preconceived notions about architects. Let’s see what the estimate reveals, but definitely, we don’t want to contribute to financing 15 model homes.
(I hope I’m not confusing anyone too much with this. But I think sometimes it’s good to put your thoughts into words, and maybe someone finds it interesting.)
Building a pre-designed house is, of course, much closer to buying an existing property than designing freely. Instead of considering where to place the stairs or where a window should be, you browse a catalog and choose a floor plan. At this point, I don’t really believe our needs are so unique that they couldn’t be met by a standard house model. When I mentioned in my last post that we would build various floor plans, it should be understood more as we would buy a house with that floor plan and be happy with it. To me, a house designed by an architect always seemed something exclusive, for people who either really build something unique or consider themselves so special that they think an architect needs to add some special corner or feature to make the house exclusive (see also deliberate creases and bends in car bodywork). Actually, we just want to build a very normal house on a rectangular, nearly flat plot of land, like thousands of others do every year. It doesn’t really make sense to pay an expensive architect to draw a floor plan that you can find in one way or another in 15 different catalogs. (At that time, I didn’t realize you could also spend a lot of money on architects even with prefabricated houses 😉 ).
My rather negative impression of architects so far certainly doesn’t help. Honestly, who comes up with the idea of designing an elevator that can only be reached via stairs? Who thinks of windows that go from floor to ceiling, 2m (6.5 feet) wide, but only open a tiny little slot—and in a building without air conditioning, no less? I think you understand what I mean: architects are the people who either design outrageously expensive villas, make football stadiums look like bird nests (very innovative...), or produce huge monstrosities that anyone normal could plan better. And they always have their hands out for money. Not exactly the kind of background that encourages you to go to an architect when you want to build.
However, over the last few weeks, it has become clear that it’s not quite so simple. Changing the front door position from north to east with a prefabricated home builder is almost the same as rotating the whole house by 90 degrees. Apparently, everyone lives on the south side of the street… or it simply doesn’t matter. Prefabricated houses typically are not handed over fully finished but come without floors and without painting. If you add vinyl flooring to the offer, you get click vinyl for about 140€/m² (13 dollars per square foot) (hopefully gold-plated on the underside) with a thick cork layer installed on top of the expensive low-temperature underfloor heating. Prefabricated houses are quick to assemble, but it takes months on the waiting list before a truck arrives with the materials. And there are still many tasks to be done on-site even though clearly they should be included in the house.
In short, everything is very confusing at the moment, and decisions are difficult. Maybe the local general contractor is actually a good entry point for individual planning. Since it has mostly been about making a rough cost estimate so far, the designs are still not very customized, but if you don’t want to estimate costs in a vacuum, you at least need a rough design. Several appointments will probably be needed to refine it before submitting an application. The advantage would be that in the end, the cost is not about deviations from a standard design but the design itself. And the building planner, as an engineer, would benefit from not being affected by my preconceived notions about architects. Let’s see what the estimate reveals, but definitely, we don’t want to contribute to financing 15 model homes.
(I hope I’m not confusing anyone too much with this. But I think sometimes it’s good to put your thoughts into words, and maybe someone finds it interesting.)
WilderSueden schrieb:
and the advice is to consult an architect.No, you misunderstood that. Only if someone becomes very uncertain and needs to constantly ask about the pros and cons, or even just for peace of mind, should they spend an hour or more with a professional—not a salesperson.
And yes: this also applies to the floor plan design.
WilderSueden schrieb:
Otherwise, there is also the point that I have so far only come across decentralized ventilation systems in connection with large houses (meaning centralized ventilation would have to be per living unit) and low-cost providers. [...] And I think the general contractor’s personal preference for manual ventilation also plays a role in favoring the simpler solution. In a building with multiple living units, I wouldn’t immediately call it decentralized if each unit has its own separate centralized ventilation system. I think you’re overall getting the complex confusion mixed up. Whether or not to use mechanical ventilation with heat recovery—and if so, whether centralized or decentralized—is a question you first need to clarify for yourself. After that, you should apply my mantra about Steinemann systems also to mechanical ventilation and avoid working with a builder who can only do one method but not the other.
WilderSueden schrieb:
A house designed by an architect has always seemed somewhat exclusive to me, [...] Somehow it doesn’t seem obvious to pay an expensive architect to design a floor plan that you can find in one form or another in 15 different catalogues anyway. Even with a simple rectangular house on a slab foundation, it’s helpful to have a planner and construction manager who can save you from unsightly boxed-in pipes and similar issues. They are useful even if the floor plan isn’t a groundbreaking new composition. Choose an architect for the other 97% of their expertise, not just the floor plan design.
WilderSueden schrieb:
That doesn’t help given that my impression of architects so far has been rather negative. Honestly, who thinks to design an elevator that can only be reached via stairs? This is neither a privilege nor a peculiarity of the architect profession—that the biggest “stars” in the spotlight are often not the best experts. You don’t become a great showman by getting bogged down in trivial things like technical knowledge. However, wishing ill upon an entire profession because of a few poor performers won’t get you anywhere. You must forbid your fears from dictating the guidelines for your home build!
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
WilderSueden schrieb:
My main issueI think your main problem is that you are equating apartment construction with house building.
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