Hello everyone,
I hope there is someone here who can help me...
We are about to sign the contract for our new build project. We are constructing an L-shaped bungalow with 120 sqm (1,292 sq ft) on the ground floor. According to the development plan, a roof pitch of 40° is required, so we have decided to convert a 20 sqm (215 sq ft) room in the attic. The remaining attic area will be used as storage space and will also be insulated.
We have since consulted the Homeowners Protection Association, who pointed out a few things to us. Unfortunately, these also result in considerable additional costs, so I would like to know your opinion. Are these measures absolutely necessary, or would a slightly simpler solution be sufficient? Specifically, I have the following questions:
1. The slab and strip foundations are made of reinforced concrete, insulated with extruded polystyrene rigid foam boards (WLG 035). The Homeowners Protection Association recommended using a load-bearing, approved perimeter insulation beneath the slab—such as CS 5000. They also emphasized the importance of side perimeter insulation (edge insulation). We were offered edge insulation at slab level (no insulation beneath the slab, but with an 18 cm (7 inches) floor build-up) and masonry insulation using moisture-resistant PUR rigid foam insulation, 14 cm (5.5 inches) thick, WLG 024. Additional costs: €4,900.
2. The Homeowners Protection Association advises us to heavily insulate the surfaces (walls and door) of the upper hallway (separating the attic storage area) and to ensure a door sweep on the hallway door to the storage room to prevent heat from the ground floor entering the storage space. We were offered to achieve airtightness with a climate membrane with an sd-value of 0.2 - 5.0 m, brand Isover Vario KM. Additional costs: €1,100.
3. We were told that nowadays the front door is still not very well insulated compared to the masonry. Our offer includes a standard door, 2.01 m (6 ft 7 in) tall, costing €3,200. Alternatively, an aluminum front door "Cotherm," 10 cm (4 inches) thick, was offered. Additional costs: €3,000.
4. Lastly, a question about the roof structure and the type of wood used. The roof framing in the offer is standard made from wood grade S10. The Homeowners Protection Association recommended using structural solid timber instead. Additional costs: €1,620.
That’s it for now. I would be very grateful for a well-informed opinion on what would be best for us. I understand that the above-listed upgrades represent an improvement over the standard. I just want to know if they are absolutely necessary and sensible. I don’t want to save money in the wrong place!
Thanks a lot for your help!!
The unfortunately very inexperienced Shikara
I hope there is someone here who can help me...
We are about to sign the contract for our new build project. We are constructing an L-shaped bungalow with 120 sqm (1,292 sq ft) on the ground floor. According to the development plan, a roof pitch of 40° is required, so we have decided to convert a 20 sqm (215 sq ft) room in the attic. The remaining attic area will be used as storage space and will also be insulated.
We have since consulted the Homeowners Protection Association, who pointed out a few things to us. Unfortunately, these also result in considerable additional costs, so I would like to know your opinion. Are these measures absolutely necessary, or would a slightly simpler solution be sufficient? Specifically, I have the following questions:
1. The slab and strip foundations are made of reinforced concrete, insulated with extruded polystyrene rigid foam boards (WLG 035). The Homeowners Protection Association recommended using a load-bearing, approved perimeter insulation beneath the slab—such as CS 5000. They also emphasized the importance of side perimeter insulation (edge insulation). We were offered edge insulation at slab level (no insulation beneath the slab, but with an 18 cm (7 inches) floor build-up) and masonry insulation using moisture-resistant PUR rigid foam insulation, 14 cm (5.5 inches) thick, WLG 024. Additional costs: €4,900.
2. The Homeowners Protection Association advises us to heavily insulate the surfaces (walls and door) of the upper hallway (separating the attic storage area) and to ensure a door sweep on the hallway door to the storage room to prevent heat from the ground floor entering the storage space. We were offered to achieve airtightness with a climate membrane with an sd-value of 0.2 - 5.0 m, brand Isover Vario KM. Additional costs: €1,100.
3. We were told that nowadays the front door is still not very well insulated compared to the masonry. Our offer includes a standard door, 2.01 m (6 ft 7 in) tall, costing €3,200. Alternatively, an aluminum front door "Cotherm," 10 cm (4 inches) thick, was offered. Additional costs: €3,000.
4. Lastly, a question about the roof structure and the type of wood used. The roof framing in the offer is standard made from wood grade S10. The Homeowners Protection Association recommended using structural solid timber instead. Additional costs: €1,620.
That’s it for now. I would be very grateful for a well-informed opinion on what would be best for us. I understand that the above-listed upgrades represent an improvement over the standard. I just want to know if they are absolutely necessary and sensible. I don’t want to save money in the wrong place!
Thanks a lot for your help!!
The unfortunately very inexperienced Shikara
Hello,
Since it is likely that a general contractor will handle the build, I recommend having the building services planning (heating, domestic hot water generation, ventilation, etc.) done by an independent consultant. Otherwise, there is a risk of ending up with a system that is not very efficient. It is not uncommon to find significant errors already in the energy-saving regulation calculations.
Overall, it is advisable to have the construction accompanied by an external expert.
Best regards
Shikara schrieb:Often, there are many ways to achieve the same goal 😉 What has greater long-term value normally costs more; otherwise, it would not make sense. Generally, if the budget is fixed, it is wiser to reduce the floor area somewhat and invest the saved funds in better quality.
....We recently had a consultation with the Homeowners’ Protection Association, who pointed out several issues to us. Unfortunately, these lead to considerable additional costs, so I would like to know what you think. Are these measures absolutely necessary, or is it sufficient to build one "step" less?
Shikara schrieb:This saves x cubic meters of external wall at the same clear room height. However, it must be absolutely ensured that water does not negate the insulation effect.
.
1. The foundation slab and strip footings are made of reinforced concrete, insulated with extruded polystyrene rigid foam boards, thermal conductivity rating (WLG) 035. The Homeowners’ Protection Association recommended that the insulation under the slab should be a load-bearing, approved perimeter insulation, e.g., CS 5000.
Shikara schrieb:Not every insulation product on the market is necessarily needed 😉 Energy balance calculations would be needed to assess this properly.
Additionally, they emphasized the importance of lateral perimeter insulation (edge insulation). We are now offered edge insulation at the slab level (without insulation under the slab but with an 18 cm (7 inch) floor buildup) plus masonry insulation with moisture-resistant rigid PUR foam insulation, thickness 14 cm (5.5 inches), WLG 024. Additional cost: 4,900 €
Shikara schrieb:Costs often reflect the appearance. What is trendy does not necessarily perform better in terms of energy. It is important to focus on a low U-value of the entire door assembly here.
....
3. We were told that entrance doors are still generally not very well insulated compared to the masonry. Our offer includes a 2.01 m (6.6 ft) door costing 3,200 €. Alternatively, we have now been offered an aluminum entrance door “Cotherm”, thickness 10 cm (4 inches). Additional cost: 3,000 €
Shikara schrieb:The roof structure mainly has a static function. KVH is not necessarily required for this.
....4. Finally, a question about the roof structure and the type of timber used. Our roof frame is offered as standard using wood graded S10. The Homeowners’ Protection Association recommended using construction-grade solid wood (KVH). Additional cost: 1,620 €
Since it is likely that a general contractor will handle the build, I recommend having the building services planning (heating, domestic hot water generation, ventilation, etc.) done by an independent consultant. Otherwise, there is a risk of ending up with a system that is not very efficient. It is not uncommon to find significant errors already in the energy-saving regulation calculations.
Overall, it is advisable to have the construction accompanied by an external expert.
Best regards
B
Bauexperte9 Feb 2011 12:19Hello,
Regarding the trades involved in the construction, the statements from the representatives – similar to those from consumer advice services – should be evaluated with some nuance. They have each received training based on the “statements” of so-called experts from the federal and state levels and thereby, I assume unintentionally, unsettle most prospective homeowners. However, sometimes “less” can mean “more,” so in your place, I would consult an independent site manager (contact details can be easily found online or through the frequently mentioned organizations here) or an expert appraiser based on the information in your construction contract (BB). They will be able to answer your questions comparing the info from your construction contract with the statements from the Homeowners Protection Association to your satisfaction and help alleviate the fear (which is completely normal when building for the first time) of making an “irreversible” decision.
Kind regards
Shikara schrieb:...as a supplement to €uro’s answer – the Homeowners Protection Association is definitely a good contact for reviewing contractual conditions; in short, the general framework.
...In the meantime, we went for a consultation at the Homeowners Protection Association, which pointed out some issues to us. Unfortunately, these cause considerable additional costs...
Regarding the trades involved in the construction, the statements from the representatives – similar to those from consumer advice services – should be evaluated with some nuance. They have each received training based on the “statements” of so-called experts from the federal and state levels and thereby, I assume unintentionally, unsettle most prospective homeowners. However, sometimes “less” can mean “more,” so in your place, I would consult an independent site manager (contact details can be easily found online or through the frequently mentioned organizations here) or an expert appraiser based on the information in your construction contract (BB). They will be able to answer your questions comparing the info from your construction contract with the statements from the Homeowners Protection Association to your satisfaction and help alleviate the fear (which is completely normal when building for the first time) of making an “irreversible” decision.
Kind regards
@€uro and Bauexperte
Thank you for your responses. I can see it’s not that simple after all. But I didn’t expect it to be easy either. We have already talked to so many professionals and people who think they are professionals that my head is starting to spin. Unfortunately, we need to get moving now since we have scheduled the start of construction for 01.04. The building inspector from the Homeowners’ Protection Association will also supervise our build as an external expert. Everything else feels too uncertain since neither my husband nor I have the time or qualifications to check everything thoroughly. The building inspector is also an architect and seems very competent. Let’s hope we made a good choice with him.
Thanks again for your replies!
It will work out *g*
Best regards
Shikara
Thank you for your responses. I can see it’s not that simple after all. But I didn’t expect it to be easy either. We have already talked to so many professionals and people who think they are professionals that my head is starting to spin. Unfortunately, we need to get moving now since we have scheduled the start of construction for 01.04. The building inspector from the Homeowners’ Protection Association will also supervise our build as an external expert. Everything else feels too uncertain since neither my husband nor I have the time or qualifications to check everything thoroughly. The building inspector is also an architect and seems very competent. Let’s hope we made a good choice with him.
Thanks again for your replies!
It will work out *g*
Best regards
Shikara
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