Hello,
for our planned new build, I would like to automate as much as my budget allows. A central control system (touchscreen/app) for blinds, underfloor heating, and possibly indoor/outdoor lighting. Since I’m not familiar with this topic, I have two basic questions:
1). What approximate costs should I expect if about 170sqm (1,830 sqft) of living space including bathroom, toilet, hallway, 4 living rooms, and garage are to be automated? Of course, I understand you can’t give me an exact estimate.
2). How should I best approach my planning? Since I assume my budget won’t cover everything at once, I want to at least make all necessary preparations during construction. That way, I can add features later without having to open up walls. Sort of like preparing the roof for solar panels in advance…
Looking forward to your answers
for our planned new build, I would like to automate as much as my budget allows. A central control system (touchscreen/app) for blinds, underfloor heating, and possibly indoor/outdoor lighting. Since I’m not familiar with this topic, I have two basic questions:
1). What approximate costs should I expect if about 170sqm (1,830 sqft) of living space including bathroom, toilet, hallway, 4 living rooms, and garage are to be automated? Of course, I understand you can’t give me an exact estimate.
2). How should I best approach my planning? Since I assume my budget won’t cover everything at once, I want to at least make all necessary preparations during construction. That way, I can add features later without having to open up walls. Sort of like preparing the roof for solar panels in advance…
Looking forward to your answers
S
Sebastian7923 Aug 2016 08:39Most providers understand home automation as simply controlling heating and ventilation via an app, and at most, programmable roller shutters – that's basically it.
And of course, if you are proficient with KNX and can advise clients, there is a lot of money to be made.
Many people also believe that KNX consists of attractive control panels and that you control a lot through them. Actually, KNX is more about the art of visible omission – and not everyone can handle that approach. Unfortunately, many electricians don’t implement it this way either – KNX is installed, but designed and equipped in a conventional manner.
And of course, if you are proficient with KNX and can advise clients, there is a lot of money to be made.
Many people also believe that KNX consists of attractive control panels and that you control a lot through them. Actually, KNX is more about the art of visible omission – and not everyone can handle that approach. Unfortunately, many electricians don’t implement it this way either – KNX is installed, but designed and equipped in a conventional manner.
Grym schrieb:
So, I thought it wasn’t worth preparing? Then I’ll just do a "normal" electrical installation, lay the KNX bus cable everywhere, and gradually replace the components over the next 10 years?If you do a KNX installation and also plan ahead by laying the bus cable everywhere there might be a switch, then it is worth it. Later on, you can quickly rewire something, or add another button or similar here and there.
But if you install conventional wiring, then the bus cable next to it is as useful as a fifth wheel.
Of course, you could then reluctantly install flush-mounted actuators, but that would cost many times more than a proper KNX installation initially, and with flush-mounted actuators, you have fewer possibilities.
Conclusion:
With a KNX installation, it pays off to think about where something might be needed later and to lay the bus cable and possibly additional power cables accordingly. With a conventional installation, a bus cable is unnecessary...
BeHaElJa schrieb:
I’m of the (unpopular) opinion that it’s all just hype That was also thought with computers, mobile communications, and many other things that are now everyday essentials. In industry and commercial sectors, nothing works anymore without bus systems.
Marko958 schrieb:
But is KNX really cheaper? After all, the electrician has to install everything in a star topology, which he normally wouldn’t do. This costs more material and a lot more labor time. Or am I wrong?
I would like to use KNX to centrally control the blinds and for the nicer switches, but I’m afraid it will be too expensive.I posted a chart further up where you can see from when KNX becomes more cost-effective. When you bring a capable partner on board and avoid unnecessary extras, KNX is not as expensive as it is often claimed to be.
BeHaElJa schrieb:
I also have heating and electric blinds. The heating is so slow that I can’t really adjust anything, and the blinds have regular switches – I don’t know if they were more expensive than KNX.
I don’t really need KNX for either.The heating in a modern house regulates itself with or without KNX or any other bus system—provided you have a heating system with some intelligence built-in and the rest of the house is sensibly constructed and configured. You definitely don’t need KNX for this... it’s a different story in an older building.
Your blind switches probably weren’t more expensive... probably much cheaper... but they can likely only do up/down on the blinds. Here, a bus system offers much more potential.
It’s similar to phones... some only need a phone for calls, while others use a smartphone to listen to music, surf the internet, and write messages.
Your regular switches are like a rotary dial phone. KNX blind switches are more like a smartphone.
But to each their own.
Sebastian79 schrieb:
Most providers understand home automation as controlling heating/ventilation via an app and at most programmable blinds – that’s it.Not only the providers... often even the homeowners don’t want anything more.
S
Sebastian7923 Aug 2016 11:13I also doubt that KNX can be compared to smartphones, PCs, or cars – but it doesn’t really matter.
It’s like with plasma TVs – the best technology gets talked down and fades away due to unfortunate circumstances.
KNX probably won’t disappear, but it will remain a niche product because it is firmly perceived as "expensive" and a "gadget" in people’s minds.
It’s like with plasma TVs – the best technology gets talked down and fades away due to unfortunate circumstances.
KNX probably won’t disappear, but it will remain a niche product because it is firmly perceived as "expensive" and a "gadget" in people’s minds.
KNX has the opposite effect of smartphones.
Smartphones have made us constantly stare at screens and forget everything else around us.
Everyday life with KNX is different because the technology is not visible, and you don’t have to keep looking at screens or operate controls all the time.
KNX handles 90% of the work in the background.
Lights turn on and off automatically, so we rarely have to use switches. The blinds go up in the morning and down in the evening... rooms are shaded when there is sunlight.
The ventilation adjusts automatically, increasing or decreasing depending on the air quality.
When you sleep, you won’t be woken by blinds going up—unless you want to be.
At night, lights in passage areas come on dimmed and then turn off again.
And so on...
Yes, you don’t have to use it—you can operate everything manually while passing by... but it’s not just that... you get functions that you wouldn’t even dream of with conventional installations.
Smartphones have made us constantly stare at screens and forget everything else around us.
Everyday life with KNX is different because the technology is not visible, and you don’t have to keep looking at screens or operate controls all the time.
KNX handles 90% of the work in the background.
Lights turn on and off automatically, so we rarely have to use switches. The blinds go up in the morning and down in the evening... rooms are shaded when there is sunlight.
The ventilation adjusts automatically, increasing or decreasing depending on the air quality.
When you sleep, you won’t be woken by blinds going up—unless you want to be.
At night, lights in passage areas come on dimmed and then turn off again.
And so on...
Yes, you don’t have to use it—you can operate everything manually while passing by... but it’s not just that... you get functions that you wouldn’t even dream of with conventional installations.
S
Sebastian7923 Aug 2016 11:49It's always a question of whether that's what you actually want... I simply enjoy interaction. And I also like to change my preferences quite rapidly...
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