ᐅ Notary contract. What should be considered? What to include in the contract?
Created on: 6 Aug 2014 20:03
W
Witalja
Hello dear users,
As we are about to purchase an existing property, I would like to ask which points we should consider in the notarized purchase agreement and what tips you might have regarding what to include in the contract to ensure we are fully protected. I have read, among other things, that existing defects should be listed. But what advantage does that bring if, for example, item X is defective and I am already aware of it and still decide to buy the property under these conditions? Or is it more about the fact that defects not listed are considered unknown, so that you keep the option open to challenge something later if needed?
We have now noticed the following: During the viewing, we were told that all windows had been completely replaced. However, this is not entirely true. The frame of the living room window was not replaced and looks quite worn (only the glass panes were replaced). There is also a pipe in the garden that leads to the well but unfortunately is not working (we had not seen this before). Additionally, the doorbell does not work, probably due to the outdated telephone system. We only recently received this information from the current tenant. How should we best communicate this?
I look forward to your suggestions. 🙂
As we are about to purchase an existing property, I would like to ask which points we should consider in the notarized purchase agreement and what tips you might have regarding what to include in the contract to ensure we are fully protected. I have read, among other things, that existing defects should be listed. But what advantage does that bring if, for example, item X is defective and I am already aware of it and still decide to buy the property under these conditions? Or is it more about the fact that defects not listed are considered unknown, so that you keep the option open to challenge something later if needed?
We have now noticed the following: During the viewing, we were told that all windows had been completely replaced. However, this is not entirely true. The frame of the living room window was not replaced and looks quite worn (only the glass panes were replaced). There is also a pipe in the garden that leads to the well but unfortunately is not working (we had not seen this before). Additionally, the doorbell does not work, probably due to the outdated telephone system. We only recently received this information from the current tenant. How should we best communicate this?
I look forward to your suggestions. 🙂
B
Bauexperte7 Aug 2014 10:39Hello,
What you describe are "normal" signs of wear and tear; I don’t see that you have grounds to hold this against the seller. You either buy at the offered price or another interested party will.
To be honest, I don’t fully understand your reasoning. When selling our private property (with an appraisal), I politely turned away interested parties like you and wished them success in their further search.
Best regards, Bauexperte
Witalja schrieb:A used property "can"—if renovated after purchase—often end up costing more overall than a comparable new build. If the plot is not in a highly sought-after location, this is usually reflected clearly in the sale price.
Thank you for your responses. I just find it unfortunate that he didn’t point out any defects or mention them explicitly, since he should be aware of the issues raised. The doorbell is the least of the problems, but I will confront him about the window frame not being replaced. In my opinion, that represents a significant loss in value because it is a very large window and replacing it would be costly.
What you describe are "normal" signs of wear and tear; I don’t see that you have grounds to hold this against the seller. You either buy at the offered price or another interested party will.
Witalja schrieb:You will inevitably take it on, because it remains a used property and tastes simply differ. A carpet, its condition, or replacement is not something that belongs in the purchase deed. If there are no serious defects or an appraisal, Yvonne is right: the deed states "bought as seen," and that’s it. It’s comparable to buying a car; once it reaches a certain age, the upholstery wears down from daily use as well 😉
The tenants also said that the carpet is still from the landlord. I can include a clause about this in the contract, right?! We plan to do quite a bit of work on the house and I don’t want to take on someone else’s effort.
To be honest, I don’t fully understand your reasoning. When selling our private property (with an appraisal), I politely turned away interested parties like you and wished them success in their further search.
Best regards, Bauexperte
Hello Witalja,
In negotiations like these, the focus is not really on the window frame (and definitely not on the carpet—you should avoid that topic altogether if you don’t want to be laughed at), but rather on determining the current price for the property that will be accepted.
First, you need to figure out what you’re willing to pay for the property and still be able to sleep peacefully if you win the bid. This is an overall question; it is definitely not about a minor issue like a faulty window frame. If you win the bid, you will have the property tied to you—including all known defects. And also including defects that are discovered later but do not qualify as fraudulent concealment or where fraudulent concealment cannot be proven. Live with it; you have to weigh the risks beforehand, and if your hand starts shaking in the notary’s office, maybe that’s a sign that renting has its advantages.
If you really like the property, take a building inspector with you if you have no expertise. This will cost you a certain amount, but it will save you future trouble or give you an overview of the expected costs. After that, make your offer and see what happens.
One thing I can promise you: if there are several interested parties and you bring up the carpet issue, your negotiation is over. Exactly as the building expert described. If you’re lucky.
Best regards,
Dirk Grafe
In negotiations like these, the focus is not really on the window frame (and definitely not on the carpet—you should avoid that topic altogether if you don’t want to be laughed at), but rather on determining the current price for the property that will be accepted.
First, you need to figure out what you’re willing to pay for the property and still be able to sleep peacefully if you win the bid. This is an overall question; it is definitely not about a minor issue like a faulty window frame. If you win the bid, you will have the property tied to you—including all known defects. And also including defects that are discovered later but do not qualify as fraudulent concealment or where fraudulent concealment cannot be proven. Live with it; you have to weigh the risks beforehand, and if your hand starts shaking in the notary’s office, maybe that’s a sign that renting has its advantages.
If you really like the property, take a building inspector with you if you have no expertise. This will cost you a certain amount, but it will save you future trouble or give you an overview of the expected costs. After that, make your offer and see what happens.
One thing I can promise you: if there are several interested parties and you bring up the carpet issue, your negotiation is over. Exactly as the building expert described. If you’re lucky.
Best regards,
Dirk Grafe
Thank you for the active participation. 😀
I have already made an offer to the seller. That’s why the issue with the window frame bothers me, because otherwise I would have offered about €500-1000 less. Because if I sell someone a car and tell them all tires are new, but actually only two tires were changed, I don’t think that’s right.
I understand that the seller is not obliged to list all defects, and won’t, which is legitimate, but personally I prefer the honest approach when information is provided. No more, no less. 😉
Regarding the carpet: It was a question if I can insist on moving into an “emptied house”?
If someone offered me a price X and made it a condition that I have to remove the carpet from two rooms, honestly, I wouldn’t have found that unreasonable. But it’s seen differently, and that’s fine.
Construction expert, I’m definitely not a nitpicker and I believe I know what type of person you are talking about. Those kind of people see more defects than actually exist, just to push the price down. But personally, I prefer to pay a bit more and keep my dignity, rather than come across like someone else.
I have weighed the risk a long time ago and I’m willing to take it, regardless of the flaws.
Dirk Grafe schrieb:
...
First, you have to figure out for yourself how much you’re willing to pay for the property and still be able to sleep at night if you win the bid. It’s an overall question; it’s really not about a lousy window frame. If you win the bid, you have the property tied to you – including all known defects. And also including defects discovered later that do not qualify as “fraudulent misrepresentation” or where proof of fraudulent misrepresentation is not possible. Live with it. You have to weigh the risk beforehand, and if your hand shakes in the notary’s office, maybe that should be interpreted as a sign that renting also has its advantages.
...
I have already made an offer to the seller. That’s why the issue with the window frame bothers me, because otherwise I would have offered about €500-1000 less. Because if I sell someone a car and tell them all tires are new, but actually only two tires were changed, I don’t think that’s right.
I understand that the seller is not obliged to list all defects, and won’t, which is legitimate, but personally I prefer the honest approach when information is provided. No more, no less. 😉
Regarding the carpet: It was a question if I can insist on moving into an “emptied house”?
If someone offered me a price X and made it a condition that I have to remove the carpet from two rooms, honestly, I wouldn’t have found that unreasonable. But it’s seen differently, and that’s fine.
Construction expert, I’m definitely not a nitpicker and I believe I know what type of person you are talking about. Those kind of people see more defects than actually exist, just to push the price down. But personally, I prefer to pay a bit more and keep my dignity, rather than come across like someone else.
I have weighed the risk a long time ago and I’m willing to take it, regardless of the flaws.
Witalja schrieb:
... because otherwise I would have offered him about €500-1000 less. ...If someone had offered me an amount about “€500-1000 less” (because of a window), I would have responded with a cheeky counteroffer to take all the wall-mounted bathroom accessories, including the automatically lowering toilet seats 😀.
And of course, I wouldn’t want to deal with the dismantling—meaning “bye, find yourself another house”!
You can’t just deduct €1000 from the price of a used property. It’s simply ridiculous!
You wouldn’t expect to get paid for the 40-year-old maple tree in the garden, which now is worth more than five high-quality windows.
That’s not how buying and selling a used property works!
Witalja schrieb:
Thanks for the active participation. 😀
I have already made an offer to the seller.Then it’s basically a done deal; offering less afterward will be difficult.
Best regards
Dirk Grafe
ypg, you are mistaken. The house was actually already sold, but since I happened to offer 2000€ more, as I later found out, the contract was awarded to me.
And I would be glad if all bathroom accessories were removed. Even if the toilet is made of marble, everything will be taken out anyway.
Dirk, that may be true, but I will contact the seller this evening.
And I would be glad if all bathroom accessories were removed. Even if the toilet is made of marble, everything will be taken out anyway.
Dirk, that may be true, but I will contact the seller this evening.
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