Hello, my name is Stephan,
I am new here and would like to ask for your advice. We currently have two options and are unsure which one is better!?
1) Used residential house built in 1957 on a plot of about 900 sqm (9700 sq ft).
130 sqm (1400 sq ft) living space, plus basement and the option to convert the attic.
Purchase price 150,000 euros, the clay tile roof is still in very good condition, possibly a dry ridge vent could be added.
A new electrical distribution board with residual current device (RCD) and breakers, electrical wiring, fresh water pipes made of copper, as well as new wooden windows and shutters were installed in 1993. The guest toilet and bathroom were also renovated in 1993. Rockwool insulation was blown into the double-layer masonry and into the sloping roof of the first floor and dormers in 2002.
The following measures must or should be carried out:
1. Replacement of the old oil heating system and removal of the oil tanks, replacing it with a new gas condensing boiler, partial installation of radiators in some basement rooms and the attic. The gas line must be installed by the utility company.
2. Walling up the heating niches with aerated concrete blocks (Ytong) and adding radiator covers.
3. Insulation of the roller shutter boxes.
4. Removal of the old plastered sloping ceilings on the first floor and installing proper thickness insulation after doubling the rafters, new drywall panels, wallpapering.
5. Conversion of the attic with two Velux windows, doubling rafters, insulation, drywall, wallpapering.
6. Electrical wiring still needs to be installed in the attic, and all rooms on the first floor should have separate circuit protection.
7. Removal of the three-chamber septic system and an unused water cistern.
8. Complete renovation of the entire west side of the house: the plaster is cracking in many places and also detaching from the window reveals. Some patchwork plastering was done by the current owner. The plaster must be completely removed down to the masonry and redone.
9. Removal of the basement stairs, walling up the basement entrance, application of bitumen slurry and bitumen.
10. Floor coverings: tiles in the hallway, parquet in the living room and bedroom, laminate in the attic.
11. New interior doors.
For all of this, I have calculated a total of 255,000 euros including purchase price, realtor fees, transfer tax, and notary fees.
My concern is the heating costs, as I have no idea how this house compares in energy efficiency to a new build.
2) The alternative would be a 170 sqm (1830 sq ft) new build without a basement, located 8.5 km (5.3 miles) outside the city on a plot of nearly 600 sqm (6500 sq ft).
The total cost here would be 290,000 euros. The disadvantage is the somewhat longer commute, no basement, only a utility room. The advantage is everything is new and built to our specifications.
Financing-wise, the monthly cost would be about 65 euros higher than buying and renovating the used property.
I look forward to your opinions.
Best regards,
Stephan
I am new here and would like to ask for your advice. We currently have two options and are unsure which one is better!?
1) Used residential house built in 1957 on a plot of about 900 sqm (9700 sq ft).
130 sqm (1400 sq ft) living space, plus basement and the option to convert the attic.
Purchase price 150,000 euros, the clay tile roof is still in very good condition, possibly a dry ridge vent could be added.
A new electrical distribution board with residual current device (RCD) and breakers, electrical wiring, fresh water pipes made of copper, as well as new wooden windows and shutters were installed in 1993. The guest toilet and bathroom were also renovated in 1993. Rockwool insulation was blown into the double-layer masonry and into the sloping roof of the first floor and dormers in 2002.
The following measures must or should be carried out:
1. Replacement of the old oil heating system and removal of the oil tanks, replacing it with a new gas condensing boiler, partial installation of radiators in some basement rooms and the attic. The gas line must be installed by the utility company.
2. Walling up the heating niches with aerated concrete blocks (Ytong) and adding radiator covers.
3. Insulation of the roller shutter boxes.
4. Removal of the old plastered sloping ceilings on the first floor and installing proper thickness insulation after doubling the rafters, new drywall panels, wallpapering.
5. Conversion of the attic with two Velux windows, doubling rafters, insulation, drywall, wallpapering.
6. Electrical wiring still needs to be installed in the attic, and all rooms on the first floor should have separate circuit protection.
7. Removal of the three-chamber septic system and an unused water cistern.
8. Complete renovation of the entire west side of the house: the plaster is cracking in many places and also detaching from the window reveals. Some patchwork plastering was done by the current owner. The plaster must be completely removed down to the masonry and redone.
9. Removal of the basement stairs, walling up the basement entrance, application of bitumen slurry and bitumen.
10. Floor coverings: tiles in the hallway, parquet in the living room and bedroom, laminate in the attic.
11. New interior doors.
For all of this, I have calculated a total of 255,000 euros including purchase price, realtor fees, transfer tax, and notary fees.
My concern is the heating costs, as I have no idea how this house compares in energy efficiency to a new build.
2) The alternative would be a 170 sqm (1830 sq ft) new build without a basement, located 8.5 km (5.3 miles) outside the city on a plot of nearly 600 sqm (6500 sq ft).
The total cost here would be 290,000 euros. The disadvantage is the somewhat longer commute, no basement, only a utility room. The advantage is everything is new and built to our specifications.
Financing-wise, the monthly cost would be about 65 euros higher than buying and renovating the used property.
I look forward to your opinions.
Best regards,
Stephan
Without claiming to be an expert: the most cost-effective way to reduce heating costs is insulating the top floor ceiling, which can probably be done as a DIY project. If possible, also insulate the roof slopes.
The second option would be insulating the basement ceiling from below—this might also be possible to do yourself.
Heating system improvements are certainly worthwhile.
Windows from 1993—this depends largely on the window area. If there are still any block elements made of cement or similar materials, or large panoramic windows, it might be more beneficial than if they are standard windows (in that case, it might not be cost-effective). What condition are the roof windows in? The front door? Other exterior doors?
Facade insulation is likely to have the biggest impact, but whether it’s cost-effective depends on your calculations.
Determine the wall construction, see if you can apply external wall insulation (ETICS / external thermal insulation composite system), and calculate the difference. This will give you a rough idea of what the project might cost. Whether it’s financially worthwhile is uncertain.
You can achieve about 80 to 120 W/m²K without going overboard.
With roof and basement ceiling insulation, you could certainly save a significant amount.
The second option would be insulating the basement ceiling from below—this might also be possible to do yourself.
Heating system improvements are certainly worthwhile.
Windows from 1993—this depends largely on the window area. If there are still any block elements made of cement or similar materials, or large panoramic windows, it might be more beneficial than if they are standard windows (in that case, it might not be cost-effective). What condition are the roof windows in? The front door? Other exterior doors?
Facade insulation is likely to have the biggest impact, but whether it’s cost-effective depends on your calculations.
Determine the wall construction, see if you can apply external wall insulation (ETICS / external thermal insulation composite system), and calculate the difference. This will give you a rough idea of what the project might cost. Whether it’s financially worthwhile is uncertain.
You can achieve about 80 to 120 W/m²K without going overboard.
With roof and basement ceiling insulation, you could certainly save a significant amount.
Hello,
Thank you for your reply. The house does not have any skylights, only two dormers. The front door is wooden and was also installed in 1993. Otherwise, the patio door and windows were replaced in 1993 as well. External thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS) are unfortunately not an option, as I would then have to redo the roof overhang. For both positions, we would definitely be looking at around 55,000 euros (about 60,000 USD), if not more.
Is it possible to determine how good or poor the condition of the exterior wall is? I am especially interested in this with the blown-in Rockwool insulation.
A friend of mine had a similar post-war house from 1947 with about 130 m² (1,400 sq ft) renovated and now only has heating costs around 1,200 euros (about 1,300 USD), with insulation of the intermediate floor, sloped roof areas, basement insulation, new triple glazing, and a new heating system with solar thermal, cavity walls not blown-in.
Best regards
Stephan
Thank you for your reply. The house does not have any skylights, only two dormers. The front door is wooden and was also installed in 1993. Otherwise, the patio door and windows were replaced in 1993 as well. External thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS) are unfortunately not an option, as I would then have to redo the roof overhang. For both positions, we would definitely be looking at around 55,000 euros (about 60,000 USD), if not more.
Is it possible to determine how good or poor the condition of the exterior wall is? I am especially interested in this with the blown-in Rockwool insulation.
A friend of mine had a similar post-war house from 1947 with about 130 m² (1,400 sq ft) renovated and now only has heating costs around 1,200 euros (about 1,300 USD), with insulation of the intermediate floor, sloped roof areas, basement insulation, new triple glazing, and a new heating system with solar thermal, cavity walls not blown-in.
Best regards
Stephan
Do you have a cavity that could be filled with insulation? If so, you can calculate it quite easily, and if that’s the case, it probably makes the most sense.
A cost saving of 5%?! What does that even mean—5% of what? Total heating costs? The heat loss difference between window A and window B? What exactly was compared here? This sounds like vague nonsense from people just trying to get clicks.
For double-glazed windows, the U-value ranges from about 1.7 to 1.2 W/m²K, and for triple-glazed from 1.1 to 0.65 W/m²K (of course, these values also depend on the type of window—the proportion of glass versus frame). The saving here, purely related to the window, ranges by a factor of 1.1 to 2.6… and that corresponds to how much one window saves compared to another. However, this is negligible when you have 10 m² (108 ft²) of window area and 200 m² (2,153 ft²) of wall area.
Of course, the same applies to statements in the opposite direction.
A cost saving of 5%?! What does that even mean—5% of what? Total heating costs? The heat loss difference between window A and window B? What exactly was compared here? This sounds like vague nonsense from people just trying to get clicks.
For double-glazed windows, the U-value ranges from about 1.7 to 1.2 W/m²K, and for triple-glazed from 1.1 to 0.65 W/m²K (of course, these values also depend on the type of window—the proportion of glass versus frame). The saving here, purely related to the window, ranges by a factor of 1.1 to 2.6… and that corresponds to how much one window saves compared to another. However, this is negligible when you have 10 m² (108 ft²) of window area and 200 m² (2,153 ft²) of wall area.
Of course, the same applies to statements in the opposite direction.
EveundGerd7 May 2015 22:54Without consulting a professional who is knowledgeable in the field, I would not tackle either the windows or the additional insulation. Windows and walls need to be compatible.
Especially when renovating an older building, people often encounter problems with moisture in the house.
From my own experience (built in 1964, 240 sqm (2,583 sq ft) of living space, 2 full floors on a 1,000 sqm (10,764 sq ft) sloped site), I can share the following: surprises can be expensive. Some tasks may then be postponed because they are not yet urgent. .....Even after 20 years, we have not finished remodeling, renovating, and expanding. There is always plenty to do in an old house, at least if you plan to do some of the work yourself and adapt according to your budget. You will certainly have to make some compromises as well.
We sold our “old” house and are building new! Twenty years was enough for us. The new owner is now continuing where we eventually lost interest.
Especially when renovating an older building, people often encounter problems with moisture in the house.
From my own experience (built in 1964, 240 sqm (2,583 sq ft) of living space, 2 full floors on a 1,000 sqm (10,764 sq ft) sloped site), I can share the following: surprises can be expensive. Some tasks may then be postponed because they are not yet urgent. .....Even after 20 years, we have not finished remodeling, renovating, and expanding. There is always plenty to do in an old house, at least if you plan to do some of the work yourself and adapt according to your budget. You will certainly have to make some compromises as well.
We sold our “old” house and are building new! Twenty years was enough for us. The new owner is now continuing where we eventually lost interest.
Similar topics