ᐅ Creating a Plan for Insulating an Old Building – How to Proceed?
Created on: 30 Aug 2022 10:30
T
Tobibi
Hello,
I’m currently trying to make a plan for how to best improve the insulation of our house. I hope I can write everything down clearly so that some of you might be able to give me tips or suggest different approaches.
We bought a large house from 1982, about 200 sqm (2,150 sq ft) of living space. There is an approximately 6-year-old heat pump for heating and hot water, and a small wood stove in the living room. The ground floor and first floor have underfloor heating, while three basement rooms and a converted room above the garage have radiators. These radiators have a separate heating circuit with their own flow temperature and are rarely used, actually not at all in the basement.
In the main bedroom on the first floor, the previous owner opened the ceiling a few years ago, creating a high space that goes up to the roof ridge. The roof was insulated at that time, but I don’t have any documentation on how well. The rest of the house remains in its original condition, so basically uninsulated.
The walls are solid brick. The wooden windows have double glazing. Many windows and the front door do not seal well, allowing noticeable drafts at some windows. The top floor ceiling is not concrete but made of joists, covered underneath on the first floor with drywall and boards on top. Between the joists, there appears to be rock wool insulation packed in.
We have a 9 kWp photovoltaic system with battery storage, which the previous owner also installed. As it currently stands, the electricity from the photovoltaic system cannot be used for the heat pump, only for other household electricity. There is a separate meter with a heating electricity contract. Surplus electricity is fed back into the grid.
I recently received the heating electricity bill, showing that from March 2021 to March 2022—one full year—we used about 12,500 kWh for heating and hot water, which I find quite high. I definitely want to take action, especially since electricity prices are rising sharply. I’m not an experienced DIYer, but I can assist and have very helpful father and father-in-law who have a lot of skills. So, some things could be done ourselves, although time is always a factor.
A no-brainer seems to be replacing the window seals and adjusting them so they close tightly again. I am already in contact with a company for this.
Next, I’m thinking about insulating the roller shutter boxes. I would probably get a company to do this as well.
I’m considering insulating the basement ceiling with insulation boards that can be glued or fixed with plugs. If there are instructions available, we would rather do that ourselves. Or should I focus on insulating the top floor ceiling or installing insulation between the rafters? Or both? Probably not at the same time—maybe one this year and the other in a year or two. What would be the better order?
Would it make sense to modify the photovoltaic system so that the electricity can be used for the heat pump? I would have to hire an electrician for that, which costs money. But then the electricity would be usable for heating, and there would be only one basic fee. On the other hand, the yield in winter is not very good, and I would lose the cheaper heating electricity tariff. I once tracked generated, fed-in, self-used, and purchased electricity over a longer period and basically concluded that the conversion might not be worthwhile. But now electricity prices are rising dramatically.
Insulating the facade and/or installing new windows is honestly too expensive for me right now. On the other hand, we will need to have the entire exterior repainted next year or the year after. That costs several thousand when done professionally, which would almost offset the cost of external wall insulation. But presumably, these two should go together—insulation and new windows—because doing only one is not sensible and could cause problems with condensation.
So, that turned out to be quite a long message. I hope it’s understandable. How would you proceed? If I forgot anything, just ask. I might also add a follow-up later.
Best regards,
Tobi
I’m currently trying to make a plan for how to best improve the insulation of our house. I hope I can write everything down clearly so that some of you might be able to give me tips or suggest different approaches.
We bought a large house from 1982, about 200 sqm (2,150 sq ft) of living space. There is an approximately 6-year-old heat pump for heating and hot water, and a small wood stove in the living room. The ground floor and first floor have underfloor heating, while three basement rooms and a converted room above the garage have radiators. These radiators have a separate heating circuit with their own flow temperature and are rarely used, actually not at all in the basement.
In the main bedroom on the first floor, the previous owner opened the ceiling a few years ago, creating a high space that goes up to the roof ridge. The roof was insulated at that time, but I don’t have any documentation on how well. The rest of the house remains in its original condition, so basically uninsulated.
The walls are solid brick. The wooden windows have double glazing. Many windows and the front door do not seal well, allowing noticeable drafts at some windows. The top floor ceiling is not concrete but made of joists, covered underneath on the first floor with drywall and boards on top. Between the joists, there appears to be rock wool insulation packed in.
We have a 9 kWp photovoltaic system with battery storage, which the previous owner also installed. As it currently stands, the electricity from the photovoltaic system cannot be used for the heat pump, only for other household electricity. There is a separate meter with a heating electricity contract. Surplus electricity is fed back into the grid.
I recently received the heating electricity bill, showing that from March 2021 to March 2022—one full year—we used about 12,500 kWh for heating and hot water, which I find quite high. I definitely want to take action, especially since electricity prices are rising sharply. I’m not an experienced DIYer, but I can assist and have very helpful father and father-in-law who have a lot of skills. So, some things could be done ourselves, although time is always a factor.
A no-brainer seems to be replacing the window seals and adjusting them so they close tightly again. I am already in contact with a company for this.
Next, I’m thinking about insulating the roller shutter boxes. I would probably get a company to do this as well.
I’m considering insulating the basement ceiling with insulation boards that can be glued or fixed with plugs. If there are instructions available, we would rather do that ourselves. Or should I focus on insulating the top floor ceiling or installing insulation between the rafters? Or both? Probably not at the same time—maybe one this year and the other in a year or two. What would be the better order?
Would it make sense to modify the photovoltaic system so that the electricity can be used for the heat pump? I would have to hire an electrician for that, which costs money. But then the electricity would be usable for heating, and there would be only one basic fee. On the other hand, the yield in winter is not very good, and I would lose the cheaper heating electricity tariff. I once tracked generated, fed-in, self-used, and purchased electricity over a longer period and basically concluded that the conversion might not be worthwhile. But now electricity prices are rising dramatically.
Insulating the facade and/or installing new windows is honestly too expensive for me right now. On the other hand, we will need to have the entire exterior repainted next year or the year after. That costs several thousand when done professionally, which would almost offset the cost of external wall insulation. But presumably, these two should go together—insulation and new windows—because doing only one is not sensible and could cause problems with condensation.
So, that turned out to be quite a long message. I hope it’s understandable. How would you proceed? If I forgot anything, just ask. I might also add a follow-up later.
Best regards,
Tobi
x0rzx0rz schrieb:
How did you determine / measure that?Search on YouTube for "thermal imaging camera reveals" and open the video with the bottle. You can see it there. Otherwise, my garden shed, which no longer gets cold after heating. Or my multi-family house, which will probably start construction next year. Or the now signed cooperation with Lafarge, who will integrate the product into their new Airium. There is way too much to write.KarstenausNRW schrieb:
I am open and interested. I have also requested the documents.
However, the documents are:
a) unprofessional
b) both substantively and formally incorrect, and this product should not be marketed in Germany with these documents (sorry, but that is how it is, and we’ll see what comes of it—a non-compliant CE marking is no trivial matter)
c) inconsistent depending on the source (information from Germany / Switzerland / Thailand / Poland)
Additionally, I really don’t like that the ownership company in Switzerland (Alpha...) appears from initial research to be more of a mailbox company than a legitimate business.
Furthermore, I find it strange that a revolutionary product that has been on the market for almost seven years neither holds a patent nor has been widely promoted. There is absolutely no information online about the technology or its applications. Ceramic vacuum nanospheres are not available even from leading producers; they are usually filled with gases (or, in medical applications, with active agents). Yes, there are nanospheres produced for coatings. But who manufactures these marvels? This is pure high tech. Vacuum panels—which operate on a very similar principle—only have insulation values of 0.005, which is 50 times worse than the PSCoating. This fact alone makes the product unbelievable, not to mention all the other serious negative points.
Something is definitely very wrong here.
Out of curiosity, I will inquire with a few contacts to find out what information is available about the product and its certificates. Vacuum panels are basically evacuated porous rock. They cannot perform better. Even if I demonstrated the setup here live, people would just accuse me of rigged thermometers, counters, or something else.
The world apparently isn’t ready for such a product.
I’m out now. I will take the time to answer professional, technical, and objective questions, but anything that is nothing more than nitpicking or doubt from people who haven’t tried it will be ignored.
The same goes for questions about the formulation or similar issues.
K
KarstenausNRW23 Dec 2022 20:03Just a few questions left:
1. Why is the product still described and sold in 2020 with a 0.093 value? Does it improve overnight? The 4Eco still offers it with the same specification.
Why is a Swiss patent being advertised when none of the involved companies hold a patent in Switzerland?
Well, I wrote that PScoat is supposed to be 50 times better. And that for a product made of acrylic resins with added beads. I just don’t understand any of this...
1. Why is the product still described and sold in 2020 with a 0.093 value? Does it improve overnight? The 4Eco still offers it with the same specification.
Why is a Swiss patent being advertised when none of the involved companies hold a patent in Switzerland?
Adam2112 schrieb:
Vacuum panels are basically evacuated porous rock. So they can’t be better.
Well, I wrote that PScoat is supposed to be 50 times better. And that for a product made of acrylic resins with added beads. I just don’t understand any of this...
KarstenausNRW schrieb:
I don’t understand any of this...No wonder, you didn’t order the sample pack... uh...KarstenausNRW schrieb:
Just a few more questions:
1. Why is the product described and sold in 2020 with a value of 0.093? Does it improve overnight? The 4Eco still lists it like this.
Why advertise a Swiss patent when none of the companies involved hold a patent in Switzerland?
Well, I wrote that PScoat is supposed to be 50 times better. And that for a product made from acrylic resins with added beads. I don’t understand any of this... En1745 applies to a composite wall. And 0.09 for a wall corresponds to Passive House standards.
K
KarstenausNRW23 Dec 2022 22:28I thought the 1745 covers the topic "Masonry and masonry products – methods for determining thermal insulation values."
So, the thermal conductivity for the product was determined according to EN 1745:2004. Nothing more, nothing less.
Thermal conductivity is also indicated in the line within the document. And this was specifically determined according to the EN standard. Not a composite wall.
Please remain professional.
So, the thermal conductivity for the product was determined according to EN 1745:2004. Nothing more, nothing less.
Thermal conductivity is also indicated in the line within the document. And this was specifically determined according to the EN standard. Not a composite wall.
Please remain professional.