ᐅ Ventilated rainscreen facade instead of ETICS (external thermal insulation composite system)?
Created on: 17 Oct 2016 19:17
D
DasLamm
Hello,
has anyone had a ventilated rainscreen facade (VHF) installed on their house?
So far, a traditional external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) was planned (for an older building), but I have never been particularly enthusiastic about it (especially not with EPS insulation). Ventilated facades are said to offer many advantages, mainly in terms of building physics and design possibilities. However, of course, they come at a significantly higher cost (we are still waiting for a detailed quote in our case).
A large part of the additional cost seems to come from the necessary substructure and the actual facade cladding. Although I could also live with a classic plaster facade, I simply find the overall construction much "cleaner" (meaning the separation of the insulation layer from the weather protection layer or cladding).
Does anyone have concrete experience, especially regarding the extra costs? How about DIY work? Could something like the substructure be done by oneself?
Some of the companies that provided quotes for an ETICS locally mentioned that this is very rarely done in the private sector due to the high costs, with ETICS being almost the standard. Is that really the case? I personally only know of one case with a VHF (new build, wood cladding). Perhaps there are also only a few contractors who can offer this professionally. I don’t think every painter/plasterer can do it properly...
has anyone had a ventilated rainscreen facade (VHF) installed on their house?
So far, a traditional external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) was planned (for an older building), but I have never been particularly enthusiastic about it (especially not with EPS insulation). Ventilated facades are said to offer many advantages, mainly in terms of building physics and design possibilities. However, of course, they come at a significantly higher cost (we are still waiting for a detailed quote in our case).
A large part of the additional cost seems to come from the necessary substructure and the actual facade cladding. Although I could also live with a classic plaster facade, I simply find the overall construction much "cleaner" (meaning the separation of the insulation layer from the weather protection layer or cladding).
Does anyone have concrete experience, especially regarding the extra costs? How about DIY work? Could something like the substructure be done by oneself?
Some of the companies that provided quotes for an ETICS locally mentioned that this is very rarely done in the private sector due to the high costs, with ETICS being almost the standard. Is that really the case? I personally only know of one case with a VHF (new build, wood cladding). Perhaps there are also only a few contractors who can offer this professionally. I don’t think every painter/plasterer can do it properly...
Ok, a gable end is of course "easier" to do.
In my case, it would be an entire facade, about 200 sqm (2150 sq ft) :-(
That takes quite a lot of time.
The first estimate from a specialist company: about twice as expensive as an equivalent external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) (which would cost around 100 € / sqm). Financially, that is simply never viable.
Without possible DIY work, it is unfortunately not an option for me.
Let's see what I decide in the spring... Nothing will happen this year anyway.
In my case, it would be an entire facade, about 200 sqm (2150 sq ft) :-(
That takes quite a lot of time.
The first estimate from a specialist company: about twice as expensive as an equivalent external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) (which would cost around 100 € / sqm). Financially, that is simply never viable.
Without possible DIY work, it is unfortunately not an option for me.
Let's see what I decide in the spring... Nothing will happen this year anyway.
Hello,
For ideological reasons, we are planning a solid construction with 50cm (20 inches) brick walls and, for aesthetic reasons, an exterior wooden facade.
What is the current practice for ventilated curtain walls in new buildings? Is it possible to fix the battens with mineral wool insulation directly onto an unplastered brick wall, in order to avoid using thermal plaster or similar layers?
Another question is whether a single insulation layer is sufficient here. That is, a horizontal battening with mineral wool insulation followed immediately by the ventilation layer.
Is it necessary to install a protective membrane over the mineral wool?
The outermost visible layer will be a horizontally installed tongue-and-groove battening.
Best regards
For ideological reasons, we are planning a solid construction with 50cm (20 inches) brick walls and, for aesthetic reasons, an exterior wooden facade.
What is the current practice for ventilated curtain walls in new buildings? Is it possible to fix the battens with mineral wool insulation directly onto an unplastered brick wall, in order to avoid using thermal plaster or similar layers?
Another question is whether a single insulation layer is sufficient here. That is, a horizontal battening with mineral wool insulation followed immediately by the ventilation layer.
Is it necessary to install a protective membrane over the mineral wool?
The outermost visible layer will be a horizontally installed tongue-and-groove battening.
Best regards
K
Knallkörper10 Dec 2017 19:42I would consider this carefully for a new build. A wooden facade is not particularly durable. There should be at least a solid 50cm (20 inches) base as structural protection for the wood.
G
garfunkel11 Dec 2017 22:08I agree, wood as a facade requires a lot of maintenance and regularly incurs costs. If the budget allows, it’s better to choose fiber cement boards like Eternit or similar materials. Once installed, they require little maintenance for a long time, and follow-up costs are quite low.
As far as I know, no plaster is needed in that case. However, I am not an expert.
I once read that insulation thickness above 50mm (2 inches) becomes less cost-effective. Using a U-value calculator, the U-value for most masonry walls (about 50cm (20 inches) thick) is roughly halved with 50mm (2 inches) of insulation. With 150mm (6 inches) of insulation, the U-value is reduced to about one quarter. Ultimately, you can calculate this yourself and decide what you find necessary and affordable.
Cross insulation probably has some advantages, but I’m not sure if they are as significant on walls as they are on roofs.
As far as I know, no plaster is needed in that case. However, I am not an expert.
I once read that insulation thickness above 50mm (2 inches) becomes less cost-effective. Using a U-value calculator, the U-value for most masonry walls (about 50cm (20 inches) thick) is roughly halved with 50mm (2 inches) of insulation. With 150mm (6 inches) of insulation, the U-value is reduced to about one quarter. Ultimately, you can calculate this yourself and decide what you find necessary and affordable.
Cross insulation probably has some advantages, but I’m not sure if they are as significant on walls as they are on roofs.
garfunkel schrieb:
Insulating in a staggered stud pattern definitely has an advantage, but I’m not sure how significant it is. It might be less noticeable on walls than on roofs. What do you mean by that?
garfunkel schrieb:
I once read that insulation thicknesses above 50mm (2 inches) become less cost-effective. Using a U-value calculator, for most solid masonry walls (~50cm (20 inches) thick), adding 50mm (2 inches) of insulation roughly halves the U-value. With 150mm (6 inches) of insulation, the U-value is reduced to about a quarter. That sounds like a very interesting source. Overall insulation thicknesses of 12 to 16cm (5 to 6.3 inches) seem to be the most common, especially where people rely on U-value calculators for guidance.
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