ᐅ Construction Project – Ventilation System, Heating – Your Experiences?
Created on: 16 Dec 2019 19:17
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Nicon1001N
Nicon100116 Dec 2019 19:17Hello everyone,
After researching prefab houses in this forum over two years ago and coming across several posts that introduced me to the option of a solid (masonry) house, we have now decided to build such a solid house. We purchased the corresponding plot in Rhineland-Palatinate this month. We have successfully completed the first meeting with the architect (who was recommended to us by several friends). The meeting was very pleasant, and we were able to present our ideas. The next step is for him to create an initial design, which we will then review to see if it meets our preferences and to discuss any changes we want.
Since I have spent a lot of time in the last two years reading forums and many construction websites, I have come across many opinions and have already asked the architect for his thoughts on some issues. I want to pose these questions to you as well to get some additional feedback specific to my case. By the way, the building project will be a one-and-a-half-story single-family house with a pitched roof and 145-150 sqm (1560-1615 sq ft) of living space, without a basement.
1. We would like to have a central ventilation system. He advises against it due to the high costs (apparently around 18,000 - 20,000) and recommends the traditional use of windows. Is this cost range of 18,000 - 20,000 realistic? I had read something about around 12,000.
2. Regarding the heating system... we would like 3-4 sqm (32-43 sq ft) of solar thermal collectors for domestic hot water. Personally, I would probably have chosen a gas condensing boiler for the underfloor heating. He recommends an air-source heat pump. I have read that these can consume a lot of electricity, plus I wouldn’t be thrilled about even a slight humming noise outside. I’m probably not too satisfied with the gas condensing boiler either. The ground here is heavily rocky (slate mountain range). He considers any drilling into the ground risky due to possible rapidly increasing costs. He also doesn’t favor horizontal ground loop collectors, because they might cause problems with plant roots. Somehow it feels like everything has its downsides. What heating types do you have? What were the costs, and how satisfied are you? How are the running costs?
3. We love the clinker brick look. We would like to cover the entire façade with genuine clinker bricks. He advised us to preferably involve companies from North Rhine-Westphalia or Northern Germany, where it is common and they have expertise. I agree with that. What is the current cost per sqm for clinker bricks? Has anyone recently had this done? How long did it take? Clinker slips (thin facing bricks) are not an option for us.
4. If possible, we want to aim for KfW 55 standard (energy-efficient building standard). With the ventilation system and solar thermal, I think we are pretty well set in that direction. Then there is of course the question of the building material. He recommends monolithic Poroton blocks. But one could also use presumably cheaper pumice blocks if it really is a clinker brick masonry. Would pumice plus clinker be sufficient for KfW 55? External thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS, known as WDVS in German) are not planned. What is the price difference between Poroton and pumice?
If you have any questions, I will gladly try to answer them.
Thanks in advance, and please don’t be too harsh on me.
After researching prefab houses in this forum over two years ago and coming across several posts that introduced me to the option of a solid (masonry) house, we have now decided to build such a solid house. We purchased the corresponding plot in Rhineland-Palatinate this month. We have successfully completed the first meeting with the architect (who was recommended to us by several friends). The meeting was very pleasant, and we were able to present our ideas. The next step is for him to create an initial design, which we will then review to see if it meets our preferences and to discuss any changes we want.
Since I have spent a lot of time in the last two years reading forums and many construction websites, I have come across many opinions and have already asked the architect for his thoughts on some issues. I want to pose these questions to you as well to get some additional feedback specific to my case. By the way, the building project will be a one-and-a-half-story single-family house with a pitched roof and 145-150 sqm (1560-1615 sq ft) of living space, without a basement.
1. We would like to have a central ventilation system. He advises against it due to the high costs (apparently around 18,000 - 20,000) and recommends the traditional use of windows. Is this cost range of 18,000 - 20,000 realistic? I had read something about around 12,000.
2. Regarding the heating system... we would like 3-4 sqm (32-43 sq ft) of solar thermal collectors for domestic hot water. Personally, I would probably have chosen a gas condensing boiler for the underfloor heating. He recommends an air-source heat pump. I have read that these can consume a lot of electricity, plus I wouldn’t be thrilled about even a slight humming noise outside. I’m probably not too satisfied with the gas condensing boiler either. The ground here is heavily rocky (slate mountain range). He considers any drilling into the ground risky due to possible rapidly increasing costs. He also doesn’t favor horizontal ground loop collectors, because they might cause problems with plant roots. Somehow it feels like everything has its downsides. What heating types do you have? What were the costs, and how satisfied are you? How are the running costs?
3. We love the clinker brick look. We would like to cover the entire façade with genuine clinker bricks. He advised us to preferably involve companies from North Rhine-Westphalia or Northern Germany, where it is common and they have expertise. I agree with that. What is the current cost per sqm for clinker bricks? Has anyone recently had this done? How long did it take? Clinker slips (thin facing bricks) are not an option for us.
4. If possible, we want to aim for KfW 55 standard (energy-efficient building standard). With the ventilation system and solar thermal, I think we are pretty well set in that direction. Then there is of course the question of the building material. He recommends monolithic Poroton blocks. But one could also use presumably cheaper pumice blocks if it really is a clinker brick masonry. Would pumice plus clinker be sufficient for KfW 55? External thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS, known as WDVS in German) are not planned. What is the price difference between Poroton and pumice?
If you have any questions, I will gladly try to answer them.
Thanks in advance, and please don’t be too harsh on me.
Regarding points 1 and 2, I can share some insights.
1. Central ventilation costs around 12,000 (currency), it shouldn’t be more than that. Very cool!
2. Go with gas. Affordable and reliable. Air-to-water heat pumps are also good, but much more expensive without any real advantages. On the contrary, noise is always an issue with them.
1. Central ventilation costs around 12,000 (currency), it shouldn’t be more than that. Very cool!
2. Go with gas. Affordable and reliable. Air-to-water heat pumps are also good, but much more expensive without any real advantages. On the contrary, noise is always an issue with them.
An architect doesn’t just draw attractive houses; they also plan buildings from a technical perspective. Therefore, I recommend reconsidering your choice of architect if their preferred heating system differs from that of the client – this may indicate less experience with the desired technology.
Facing bricks and brick slips are essentially the same material – one is cut, the other used whole. If you don’t want an external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS), the facing layer doesn’t need to be self-supporting and can therefore be easily glued on. Using full-thickness bricks for the same overall U-value will only increase the wall thickness. If you read carefully, you’ll also notice that brick slips tend to lead to fewer processing disagreements between clients and contractors. From a practical standpoint, brick slips are often the better choice.
Price differences between porous bricks and pumice blocks vary and don’t really concern you unless you plan to purchase the bricks yourself and supply them to the structural contractor. However, the contractor will likely include their own margin on the bricks. In my experience (having lived in northern Rhineland-Palatinate, a region known for pumice), contractors who primarily work with pumice also frequently use porous bricks, often deciding based on current market prices. This applies to both structural builders and design-build contractors, and even to developers. Since you mentioned both prefab and solid construction houses: prefab solid walls are available from some porous brick manufacturers as well as some lightweight aggregate block producers. I am not sure about Rheinhessen and the Palatinate, but in the Westerwald and Eifel/Pellenz regions, it is common for general contractors to build with autoclaved aerated concrete (AAC) blocks or pumice blocks, with porous bricks ranking third. If the architect has a preference for a certain type of masonry, they usually specify corresponding products for openings, roller shutter boxes, ceilings, and sometimes stairs as well – supported by contractors who share the same preferences.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Facing bricks and brick slips are essentially the same material – one is cut, the other used whole. If you don’t want an external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS), the facing layer doesn’t need to be self-supporting and can therefore be easily glued on. Using full-thickness bricks for the same overall U-value will only increase the wall thickness. If you read carefully, you’ll also notice that brick slips tend to lead to fewer processing disagreements between clients and contractors. From a practical standpoint, brick slips are often the better choice.
Price differences between porous bricks and pumice blocks vary and don’t really concern you unless you plan to purchase the bricks yourself and supply them to the structural contractor. However, the contractor will likely include their own margin on the bricks. In my experience (having lived in northern Rhineland-Palatinate, a region known for pumice), contractors who primarily work with pumice also frequently use porous bricks, often deciding based on current market prices. This applies to both structural builders and design-build contractors, and even to developers. Since you mentioned both prefab and solid construction houses: prefab solid walls are available from some porous brick manufacturers as well as some lightweight aggregate block producers. I am not sure about Rheinhessen and the Palatinate, but in the Westerwald and Eifel/Pellenz regions, it is common for general contractors to build with autoclaved aerated concrete (AAC) blocks or pumice blocks, with porous bricks ranking third. If the architect has a preference for a certain type of masonry, they usually specify corresponding products for openings, roller shutter boxes, ceilings, and sometimes stairs as well – supported by contractors who share the same preferences.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
11ant schrieb:
An architect doesn’t just draw attractive houses; they also plan buildings technically. Unfortunately, this is a common misunderstanding. An architect is only involved in building services engineering (MEP) to the extent that they “coordinate” the necessary planning. This ultimately means that they collect the plans from each technical discipline, incorporate them into their construction documentation, and possibly point out obvious issues.
Certainly, most experienced architects acquire enough knowledge over time to provide basic advice, but by definition, this is not their role. This is also reflected in their fee structure, where the costs of building services are not fully included in the billable expenses.
For building services, there is a specialized MEP planner (also remunerated according to HOAI); however, in the single-family home sector, few are willing or able to afford this, so the responsibility usually falls on the homeowners and tradespeople.
D
Daniel-Sp16 Dec 2019 23:42Heating:
We have a modulating air-to-water heat pump from Novelan, installed indoors. Model LICV 8.2R1/3. Naturally, I can hear it in the utility room, and it's very quiet in the kitchen, only noticeable when listening carefully through the door. In the living room, which is directly adjacent to the utility room (timber frame construction), it is not audible. It can also be heard near the outdoor air outlets. Our neighbors haven’t noticed anything, and we don’t spend time outside in winter anyway. The initial investment was high, but I couldn’t get approval for gas from my "government." We have had a separate electricity meter for only six weeks, and since then, we have used about 200 kWh of electricity for heating and hot water and produced approximately 1,000 kWh of heat. I’m quite satisfied with that. The house is KfW 40 standard, 146 sqm (1,571 sq ft) without a basement, NAT - 12, living room at 22°C (72°F) or higher, my wife gets cold quickly...
If possible, I would avoid solar thermal and prefer photovoltaic systems.
Your architect’s statement about the trench collector only applies to tree plantings. Low-rooting plants are apparently not a problem.
Get informed about ring trench collectors on the HTdialog forum. You’ll find reliable information there. Ask your architect how often they have commissioned a ring trench collector. That will help you assess the credibility of their statement.
We have a modulating air-to-water heat pump from Novelan, installed indoors. Model LICV 8.2R1/3. Naturally, I can hear it in the utility room, and it's very quiet in the kitchen, only noticeable when listening carefully through the door. In the living room, which is directly adjacent to the utility room (timber frame construction), it is not audible. It can also be heard near the outdoor air outlets. Our neighbors haven’t noticed anything, and we don’t spend time outside in winter anyway. The initial investment was high, but I couldn’t get approval for gas from my "government." We have had a separate electricity meter for only six weeks, and since then, we have used about 200 kWh of electricity for heating and hot water and produced approximately 1,000 kWh of heat. I’m quite satisfied with that. The house is KfW 40 standard, 146 sqm (1,571 sq ft) without a basement, NAT - 12, living room at 22°C (72°F) or higher, my wife gets cold quickly...
If possible, I would avoid solar thermal and prefer photovoltaic systems.
Your architect’s statement about the trench collector only applies to tree plantings. Low-rooting plants are apparently not a problem.
Get informed about ring trench collectors on the HTdialog forum. You’ll find reliable information there. Ask your architect how often they have commissioned a ring trench collector. That will help you assess the credibility of their statement.
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