Hello everyone!
My wife and I have been searching for a home for quite some time. Since we haven’t found anything suitable yet, we are currently considering building a new house more seriously. The plot of land is not an issue, and we have an architect friend who would design the house (according to his information, we should budget around €1250 per m² (about $116 per sq ft) of living space plus 12% additional building costs).
Our "dream house" should have a living area of 150-170 m² (about 1,615-1,830 sq ft), 4 rooms (bedroom, 2 children’s rooms, and an office), a small conservatory, a pitched roof, and meet KfW 80 or 70 energy standards — these are the main points.
Since we currently earn around €2900 net (about $3,190) per month and don’t want to work only to pay off the house for 30 years, we are considering building a large part of it ourselves.
We could either build a solid masonry house or a timber frame construction. With a masonry house, we could save around €20,000 (about $22,000) by laying the tiles and laminate flooring ourselves and doing the painting. For the timber frame house, there would be an additional saving of €10,000 (about $11,000) if we install the insulation ourselves.
My father is confident that we could also build the shell by ourselves. He is a very skilled craftsman and has already built two extensions and a garage (so far, nothing has collapsed). I’m just concerned that many regulations and requirements have changed over the past few years.
Is it really possible to build the foundation and shell by ourselves, and how much could we realistically save? I would leave the roof, windows, and doors to the professionals—mainly because of the warranty. The electrical work could be done by my father-in-law, who is an electrical engineer.
Is it feasible to skip insulation if we use thicker building blocks?
I still have so many questions, but I’ll stop here for now.
I hope you can help me.
Thanks!
Best regards
My wife and I have been searching for a home for quite some time. Since we haven’t found anything suitable yet, we are currently considering building a new house more seriously. The plot of land is not an issue, and we have an architect friend who would design the house (according to his information, we should budget around €1250 per m² (about $116 per sq ft) of living space plus 12% additional building costs).
Our "dream house" should have a living area of 150-170 m² (about 1,615-1,830 sq ft), 4 rooms (bedroom, 2 children’s rooms, and an office), a small conservatory, a pitched roof, and meet KfW 80 or 70 energy standards — these are the main points.
Since we currently earn around €2900 net (about $3,190) per month and don’t want to work only to pay off the house for 30 years, we are considering building a large part of it ourselves.
We could either build a solid masonry house or a timber frame construction. With a masonry house, we could save around €20,000 (about $22,000) by laying the tiles and laminate flooring ourselves and doing the painting. For the timber frame house, there would be an additional saving of €10,000 (about $11,000) if we install the insulation ourselves.
My father is confident that we could also build the shell by ourselves. He is a very skilled craftsman and has already built two extensions and a garage (so far, nothing has collapsed). I’m just concerned that many regulations and requirements have changed over the past few years.
Is it really possible to build the foundation and shell by ourselves, and how much could we realistically save? I would leave the roof, windows, and doors to the professionals—mainly because of the warranty. The electrical work could be done by my father-in-law, who is an electrical engineer.
Is it feasible to skip insulation if we use thicker building blocks?
I still have so many questions, but I’ll stop here for now.
I hope you can help me.
Thanks!
Best regards
B
Bauexperte9 Oct 2014 13:27Hello,
For example, we have built for clients both in Rösrath (2009) and Bergisch Gladbach (2012). In 2009, the price per sqm was still €1,250.00 (already with underfloor heating, but still a gas condensing boiler—so not today’s KfW 70 standard), in 2012 it was already €1,400.00 (also with underfloor heating, still gas condensing boiler—so still not the current KfW 70), and today it’s around €1,550.00 (KfW 70 is standard); all figures refer to standard building shell, without extras like a ventilation system. By January 1, 2015, prices will rise another 3–5%; some trades have already increased costs as of October 1, 2014. On January 1, 2016, costs will increase significantly, as the new energy-saving regulations must then be fully implemented.
Online calculators are not a reliable source; they never have been. But in my experience, the figures from your architect are also not accurate—unless he offers the lowest energy-saving standard I can imagine. Whether you can be happy with that is for you to decide; if KfW loans are involved, it will not be easy for you and the price per sqm will jump significantly.
Edit: Prices per sqm relate exclusively to the Düsseldorf-Cologne region.
Regards, Bauexperte
MelixFagath schrieb:
Earlier, I used an online calculator for the cost per square meter. It gave me an even lower price per square meter. The average value is supposedly €1200 per sqm. Where do you get your costs from? Of course, it depends on the quality of all components, but can you tell me what is included in these €1600 per sqm?
For example, we have built for clients both in Rösrath (2009) and Bergisch Gladbach (2012). In 2009, the price per sqm was still €1,250.00 (already with underfloor heating, but still a gas condensing boiler—so not today’s KfW 70 standard), in 2012 it was already €1,400.00 (also with underfloor heating, still gas condensing boiler—so still not the current KfW 70), and today it’s around €1,550.00 (KfW 70 is standard); all figures refer to standard building shell, without extras like a ventilation system. By January 1, 2015, prices will rise another 3–5%; some trades have already increased costs as of October 1, 2014. On January 1, 2016, costs will increase significantly, as the new energy-saving regulations must then be fully implemented.
Online calculators are not a reliable source; they never have been. But in my experience, the figures from your architect are also not accurate—unless he offers the lowest energy-saving standard I can imagine. Whether you can be happy with that is for you to decide; if KfW loans are involved, it will not be easy for you and the price per sqm will jump significantly.
Edit: Prices per sqm relate exclusively to the Düsseldorf-Cologne region.
Regards, Bauexperte
Bauexperte schrieb:
Good morning,
NRW is large, but even in the districts of Minden-Lübecke, Hello Bauexperte,
I have to insist on the second "b".
Lübbecke
Best regards
I don’t know how much physical and mental strain you can handle... but if your back doesn’t give out at some point, your mind will eventually start to resent the construction. This usually leads to you withdrawing from everything, and even if not physically, then at least emotionally distancing yourself from your partner and family, since they’ll all seem responsible for how bad you feel. On the other hand, you might be criticized for not having time for home life and yourself anymore...
But enough sugarcoating :
You won’t save 20,000 by doing the flooring and painting yourself. Try it—extending your workday after hours—but you should have a buffer in case you simply can’t or don’t want to continue.
During our three-week vacation, we only painted indoors...
But enough sugarcoating :
You won’t save 20,000 by doing the flooring and painting yourself. Try it—extending your workday after hours—but you should have a buffer in case you simply can’t or don’t want to continue.
During our three-week vacation, we only painted indoors...
D
DerBjoern10 Oct 2014 09:05I agree with ypg. Taking on so much to do yourself is quite something. We did the painting, flooring, kitchen assembly (Ikea), and the entire exterior area ourselves. Last Christmas, the house was at a stage where we started preparing for the painting (we spent the whole Christmas sanding and filling). Just the preparations for wallpapering (walls and ceilings) easily took about a week. Despite four weeks of vacation and working every evening and weekend, we weren’t finished inside by the move-in date in mid-February. I still haven’t completed everything today. In some rooms, baseboards are still missing, the laundry chute is not yet enclosed or usable, the attic flooring (board planks) isn’t fully done, and there are still construction lamps hanging here and there, etc. etc.
At the end of March, I started on the exterior. Foundations, graveling, paving, building the carport, building the storage room, landscaping the garden, wooden terrace, etc. Just grading the heights properly everywhere was a big effort, despite the level ground. One side had to be fully supported with retaining L-walls because the house is 50cm (20 inches) above street level, and I wanted the garden to be as level as possible. Just installing about 30 meters (100 feet) of L-walls takes 2 to 3 weekends. It all costs a lot of time. And you don’t think about this beforehand. Right now, I’m at the point of finishing the storage room in the carport. Then in the next few weeks, I’ll plant some trees and a hedge. After that, I’ll be roughly done outside. Then I can finish the remaining work inside the house and hopefully be done by the end of the year.
I can confirm that. Especially when you’re standing outside alone with a shovel in the rain in front of a 10m³ (350 ft³) pile of gravel, in that moment, your partner is to blame. For the big pile, the bad weather, and the shovel being about 3cm (1 inch) too small for your height.
Counting on help from friends can quickly go wrong. I did everything mostly by myself, with some help from my father and father-in-law. At the start, you might get help from friends on a Saturday now and then. But quite soon, nobody offers help selflessly anymore.
If I hopefully finish by Christmas, I will have invested one full year’s worth of every Friday afternoon, whole Saturdays, many Sundays, all public holidays, many evenings, and over 40 vacation days just on the house. And I built it READY TO MOVE IN without the painting and flooring! I only did the painting, flooring, carport, and exterior landscaping myself...
Regarding potential savings: You’ll never save that much on painting and flooring. I saved a few thousand compared to the offer from my general contractor. But for the exterior, including the carport, I saved quite a lot of money, around 15,000.
At the end of March, I started on the exterior. Foundations, graveling, paving, building the carport, building the storage room, landscaping the garden, wooden terrace, etc. Just grading the heights properly everywhere was a big effort, despite the level ground. One side had to be fully supported with retaining L-walls because the house is 50cm (20 inches) above street level, and I wanted the garden to be as level as possible. Just installing about 30 meters (100 feet) of L-walls takes 2 to 3 weekends. It all costs a lot of time. And you don’t think about this beforehand. Right now, I’m at the point of finishing the storage room in the carport. Then in the next few weeks, I’ll plant some trees and a hedge. After that, I’ll be roughly done outside. Then I can finish the remaining work inside the house and hopefully be done by the end of the year.
That means you take the blame for everything, even if not physically, then with a lot of emotional distancing from your partner and family, because after all, they’re all to blame for you feeling bad.
I can confirm that. Especially when you’re standing outside alone with a shovel in the rain in front of a 10m³ (350 ft³) pile of gravel, in that moment, your partner is to blame. For the big pile, the bad weather, and the shovel being about 3cm (1 inch) too small for your height.
Counting on help from friends can quickly go wrong. I did everything mostly by myself, with some help from my father and father-in-law. At the start, you might get help from friends on a Saturday now and then. But quite soon, nobody offers help selflessly anymore.
If I hopefully finish by Christmas, I will have invested one full year’s worth of every Friday afternoon, whole Saturdays, many Sundays, all public holidays, many evenings, and over 40 vacation days just on the house. And I built it READY TO MOVE IN without the painting and flooring! I only did the painting, flooring, carport, and exterior landscaping myself...
Regarding potential savings: You’ll never save that much on painting and flooring. I saved a few thousand compared to the offer from my general contractor. But for the exterior, including the carport, I saved quite a lot of money, around 15,000.
Umbau-Susi10 Oct 2014 09:17During the GDR era, many people, out of necessity, built their houses mostly by themselves.
In healthcare, we clearly saw a trend. By the time the house was finished, the self-builder had often suffered a herniated disc, a heart attack, or no longer had anyone to move into the new house with. In the worst cases, the wife would move in alone because he had only survived the house construction by 14 days.
Often, several of these factors occurred together.
Sylvia
In healthcare, we clearly saw a trend. By the time the house was finished, the self-builder had often suffered a herniated disc, a heart attack, or no longer had anyone to move into the new house with. In the worst cases, the wife would move in alone because he had only survived the house construction by 14 days.
Often, several of these factors occurred together.
Sylvia
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