Hello Dear Home Building Forum Community,
First of all, Happy New Year!
It is still quite early since we are not yet sure if either of the two properties will definitely work out, but I have a fundamental question and would like to gather some feedback.
So, option 1:
- Existing property with approximately 700 m² (8,400 sq ft) plot, just under 160 m² (1,720 sq ft) living space, built in 1940, garage, partially basemented. It seems to be in relatively good condition, but the layout is not ideal for our plans and we would need to invest a lot in the coming years (more/larger windows, extension, different walls, new staircase, underfloor heating). Short-term livability would probably be possible, even the kitchen with appliances could be taken over.
Option 2:
- Newly built semi-detached house, 400 m² (4,300 sq ft) plot, 150 m² (1,615 sq ft) living space, adaptable floor plan, modern upscale finish, flooring in living areas and painting still require DIY work, kitchen is an additional cost but there is a 1000 EUR kitchen voucher (wow! ).
The location is similar, although I prefer location 1, and my partner prefers location 2.
Financially, both options are quite similar; the nominal amount is higher for option 2 initially, but with option 1, a lot still needs to be invested, which from my perspective balances it out.
My question is more about risk.
Where do you see the greater risks for possible additional costs/efforts, or total losses?
For example, can a building inspector really identify all flaws in such an old property?
On the other hand, I have already learned from reading the forum how much can go wrong during house construction, and how unforeseen additional costs, necessary refinancing, etc., can threaten entire livelihoods.
I appreciate opinions, experiences, advice, and any other tips.
Thank you in advance for your contributions.
Best regards
Tolentino
First of all, Happy New Year!
It is still quite early since we are not yet sure if either of the two properties will definitely work out, but I have a fundamental question and would like to gather some feedback.
So, option 1:
- Existing property with approximately 700 m² (8,400 sq ft) plot, just under 160 m² (1,720 sq ft) living space, built in 1940, garage, partially basemented. It seems to be in relatively good condition, but the layout is not ideal for our plans and we would need to invest a lot in the coming years (more/larger windows, extension, different walls, new staircase, underfloor heating). Short-term livability would probably be possible, even the kitchen with appliances could be taken over.
Option 2:
- Newly built semi-detached house, 400 m² (4,300 sq ft) plot, 150 m² (1,615 sq ft) living space, adaptable floor plan, modern upscale finish, flooring in living areas and painting still require DIY work, kitchen is an additional cost but there is a 1000 EUR kitchen voucher (wow! ).
The location is similar, although I prefer location 1, and my partner prefers location 2.
Financially, both options are quite similar; the nominal amount is higher for option 2 initially, but with option 1, a lot still needs to be invested, which from my perspective balances it out.
My question is more about risk.
Where do you see the greater risks for possible additional costs/efforts, or total losses?
For example, can a building inspector really identify all flaws in such an old property?
On the other hand, I have already learned from reading the forum how much can go wrong during house construction, and how unforeseen additional costs, necessary refinancing, etc., can threaten entire livelihoods.
I appreciate opinions, experiences, advice, and any other tips.
Thank you in advance for your contributions.
Best regards
Tolentino
Tolentino schrieb:
The plot is really a dream.But the house is a nightmare. You will never be able to economically convert three worker apartments with an external staircase into a single-family home in a sensible way; demolishing the building is the only option. Is the plot still a dream at the purchase price (factoring in demolition costs and the house’s residual value, which is basically zero)? If not, keep looking.https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Just the plot in that location and size would probably cost around 350-400 thousand euros. I could still afford that, but with demolition and rebuilding, it’s beyond my budget.
Yes, I spent an hour looking at the photos and talking with my father-in-law. He also says: Even without an extension, just renovating the existing part will cost me about 100 thousand euros if I can’t do everything as a DIY project. We are slowly coming to the realization that it probably isn’t meant to be.
A shame about the nice plot, but oh well.
Yes, I spent an hour looking at the photos and talking with my father-in-law. He also says: Even without an extension, just renovating the existing part will cost me about 100 thousand euros if I can’t do everything as a DIY project. We are slowly coming to the realization that it probably isn’t meant to be.
A shame about the nice plot, but oh well.
Tassimat schrieb:
If you offer 400,000 EUR, then you would have 200,000 EUR left for the renovation. That could work. I had thought about something like that as well, but now that I have the site plan, it looks to me like the property has been built over the boundaries. There is just a brief comment: "No reliable land registry documents."
What do you think about that?
Is it safe to say that this option is off the table?
Tassimat schrieb:
Is the house a slow seller, do you know? Well, the listing has been online for about two months. That could already be considered a slow seller in Berlin...
P
Pinkiponk6 Jan 2020 11:35In my opinion, it really depends on what kind of people you are. Are you more perfectionists, urban-minded, aesthetes who want everything to look flawless, adaptable, and tolerant of neighbors and their needs (option 2), or can you initially live with some visual imperfections (option 1)?
So far, I’m leaning towards option 1 for the following reasons:
- We currently live in a property built in 1945 where some of the heating pipes are installed visibly on the wall. It doesn’t bother us, and we live just as comfortably as if they were concealed inside the walls. In return, we have a detached single-family house, a large plot, a good location, and neighbors are further away.
- I think about what can be changed and what can’t. A large plot, the location, no neighbors or potential neighborhood conflicts, a high degree of autonomy and freedom in designing both interior and exterior, the option to rent out a granny flat/apartment, and more – nobody can take these away from you. Everything else can be changed over time with motivation and yes, money.
- I am not a fan of semi-detached houses or terraced/row houses.
- You can start by negotiating the price. You might be positively surprised. Or you can get quotes for the changes you want to make, and it may not be as expensive as you think. That was mostly our experience with our house. Maybe you can then use those quotes to negotiate the price down.
So far, I’m leaning towards option 1 for the following reasons:
- We currently live in a property built in 1945 where some of the heating pipes are installed visibly on the wall. It doesn’t bother us, and we live just as comfortably as if they were concealed inside the walls. In return, we have a detached single-family house, a large plot, a good location, and neighbors are further away.
- I think about what can be changed and what can’t. A large plot, the location, no neighbors or potential neighborhood conflicts, a high degree of autonomy and freedom in designing both interior and exterior, the option to rent out a granny flat/apartment, and more – nobody can take these away from you. Everything else can be changed over time with motivation and yes, money.
- I am not a fan of semi-detached houses or terraced/row houses.
- You can start by negotiating the price. You might be positively surprised. Or you can get quotes for the changes you want to make, and it may not be as expensive as you think. That was mostly our experience with our house. Maybe you can then use those quotes to negotiate the price down.
Tassimat schrieb:
Is the house a hard sell, do you know? You can hardly be serious with that question: ground floor designed as a suite with a bathroom acting as a walk-through room!!!; not only the other floors, but actually most of the neighboring rooms can only be accessed from the outside or at least more easily from outside; the house is basically like a motorhome without any passage between the driver’s cabin and the living area – simply creepy. Hard sell, very hard sell, hardest sell imaginable. Whether it would be a fair price, whether given away or slightly more or less, largely depends on whether three separate residential units and their holiday rentals are permitted at this location. That’s exactly where the catch lies and what creates the sales pressure: many cities are now introducing regulations against short-term rentals ("Airbnb bans"). As a renovation project converting it to a single-family home, the building is structurally unsuitable; the condition and aesthetics are only minor considerations far off to the side, and even the location’s value here surprisingly falls almost completely into the background (as mentioned: as a holiday rental with cash cow potential, yes, but for family occupancy not even worth the garbage bin).
Tolentino schrieb:
Only for what is to be done in the existing part, I have to reckon with 100,000 EUR, The demolition won’t be that expensive. But based on experience, owners of rundown properties in good locations are rarely willing to negotiate. So, straighten your crown and keep looking.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
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