ᐅ Shower bases not installed according to manufacturer’s instructions
Created on: 29 Sep 2020 17:29
R
Rosema7
Hello,
our shower trays are from a German brand manufacturer.
We specifically chose them because they are floor-level and serviceable (accessible for maintenance).
By "serviceable," I mean that if we ever dislike the color of the shower tray or if it gets damaged (a crack / something falls in, etc.), we could replace it more easily than with a traditional installation. (Simply put)
To do this, the shower trays should only have been installed after the screed was poured.
The supports for the shower trays would be set, aligned, and the drain connections adjusted, etc.
Then the screed poured,
shower trays installed,
and tiling done.
This results in an almost seamless transition between tiles and shower tray.
The tray can be removed more easily later if replacement is needed, compared to when it is fixed under the screed with the edge firmly sealed.
In our case, this was done as follows (simplified):
Supports + shower tray + drain, etc. installed,
screed poured (which naturally fixed the trays in place),
then tiles laid.
However, since the screed ended up slightly higher (according to the plumbing company: the screed contractor is responsible),
the tiles also ended up higher.
Now you can see the edge of the tiles where they meet the shower tray.
Therefore, a stainless steel strip was installed around the tile edge at the transition to the shower tray (Walk-in).
This stainless steel strip is now about 0.5 to 1 cm (around 0.2 to 0.4 inches) higher than the tray (it reaches 1 cm (about 0.4 inches) towards the wall).
Guests who visit us always say: “That’s great, at least nothing spills out of the shower tray.”
But this is not true.
First, the shower tray is very large and second, it already has a slope built in,
so water never runs towards the edges.
In terms of appearance, the result is not as desired (a seamless transition between tile and shower tray).
The manufacturer is not familiar with this type of installation (we asked, but they always remain very reserved – they just refer to the plumbing company who installed it – which definitely is not going to tell us what is correct).
We have withheld a large part of the payment because we were not satisfied with the installation of this shower tray.
They promised in writing that they would remove the tiles around the tray again, grind down the screed to a lower level, and then re-tile around the shower tray.
We should wait one year first because of “settling of the shower tray/floor.”
Tiles of the same brand were kept reserved.
QUESTION:
The year is almost up.
Would you have this redone / fixed?
Could it make things worse?
If we leave it as it is, we definitely will not pay the withheld amount.
Besides, the (very expensive) shower trays were not installed as specified in the manufacturer’s installation instructions, meaning they are no longer serviceable. (However, we paid a premium for this “innovation” in the price of the shower trays.)
The plumbing company and (unfortunately) the manufacturer say: There are no mandatory requirements. The installation instructions are a guideline but not compulsory. Is that correct?
You buy specialized materials, and then the plumbing company installs them in a traditional way, probably because they have only ever done the standard installations before and do not know this method at all.
Unfortunately, you always learn afterwards. Had we known earlier, we would have addressed this. But with a master craftsman / professional company, you expect them to know how to do it properly.
What matters to us now:
We don’t want to have three tradespeople (tiler, screed contractor, plumbing company) back in the house with the risk that something gets damaged (stairs, parquet flooring, etc.) or that the shower tray and its surroundings end up worse than before.
Do these stainless steel strips rust over time?
So far, they look fine, but we worry they might start to rust eventually since they are around the shower and constantly exposed to moisture.
If we leave things as they are, we will not pay the withheld amount.
Then the plumbing company can recover it from the tiling and screed trades.
The plumbing company claims they are not responsible.
But shouldn’t the plumbing trade installing the shower tray also ensure and check that everything is properly prepared (in our case: that the screed is at the correct height, etc.) before the next trade (tiling) starts? Then corrections could have been made earlier.
We also have household insurance – if things go really wrong, we might even have this clarified, since the shower trays are no longer serviceable and that option was lost to us.
There is still time. Due to the current situation, no three trades will come to our house this year or probably next year anyway.
So we are just gathering information on whether it makes sense to have it fixed at all.
Frankly, we are tired of it.
And we would like to know your opinion on the “serviceability” issue.
Also, whether tradespeople are not supposed to follow the manufacturer’s installation instructions, especially considering that “serviceability” is a very specific feature of these (expensive) shower trays.
Thank you very much for your help.
Rosema7
our shower trays are from a German brand manufacturer.
We specifically chose them because they are floor-level and serviceable (accessible for maintenance).
By "serviceable," I mean that if we ever dislike the color of the shower tray or if it gets damaged (a crack / something falls in, etc.), we could replace it more easily than with a traditional installation. (Simply put)
To do this, the shower trays should only have been installed after the screed was poured.
The supports for the shower trays would be set, aligned, and the drain connections adjusted, etc.
Then the screed poured,
shower trays installed,
and tiling done.
This results in an almost seamless transition between tiles and shower tray.
The tray can be removed more easily later if replacement is needed, compared to when it is fixed under the screed with the edge firmly sealed.
In our case, this was done as follows (simplified):
Supports + shower tray + drain, etc. installed,
screed poured (which naturally fixed the trays in place),
then tiles laid.
However, since the screed ended up slightly higher (according to the plumbing company: the screed contractor is responsible),
the tiles also ended up higher.
Now you can see the edge of the tiles where they meet the shower tray.
Therefore, a stainless steel strip was installed around the tile edge at the transition to the shower tray (Walk-in).
This stainless steel strip is now about 0.5 to 1 cm (around 0.2 to 0.4 inches) higher than the tray (it reaches 1 cm (about 0.4 inches) towards the wall).
Guests who visit us always say: “That’s great, at least nothing spills out of the shower tray.”
But this is not true.
First, the shower tray is very large and second, it already has a slope built in,
so water never runs towards the edges.
In terms of appearance, the result is not as desired (a seamless transition between tile and shower tray).
The manufacturer is not familiar with this type of installation (we asked, but they always remain very reserved – they just refer to the plumbing company who installed it – which definitely is not going to tell us what is correct).
We have withheld a large part of the payment because we were not satisfied with the installation of this shower tray.
They promised in writing that they would remove the tiles around the tray again, grind down the screed to a lower level, and then re-tile around the shower tray.
We should wait one year first because of “settling of the shower tray/floor.”
Tiles of the same brand were kept reserved.
QUESTION:
The year is almost up.
Would you have this redone / fixed?
Could it make things worse?
If we leave it as it is, we definitely will not pay the withheld amount.
Besides, the (very expensive) shower trays were not installed as specified in the manufacturer’s installation instructions, meaning they are no longer serviceable. (However, we paid a premium for this “innovation” in the price of the shower trays.)
The plumbing company and (unfortunately) the manufacturer say: There are no mandatory requirements. The installation instructions are a guideline but not compulsory. Is that correct?
You buy specialized materials, and then the plumbing company installs them in a traditional way, probably because they have only ever done the standard installations before and do not know this method at all.
Unfortunately, you always learn afterwards. Had we known earlier, we would have addressed this. But with a master craftsman / professional company, you expect them to know how to do it properly.
What matters to us now:
We don’t want to have three tradespeople (tiler, screed contractor, plumbing company) back in the house with the risk that something gets damaged (stairs, parquet flooring, etc.) or that the shower tray and its surroundings end up worse than before.
Do these stainless steel strips rust over time?
So far, they look fine, but we worry they might start to rust eventually since they are around the shower and constantly exposed to moisture.
If we leave things as they are, we will not pay the withheld amount.
Then the plumbing company can recover it from the tiling and screed trades.
The plumbing company claims they are not responsible.
But shouldn’t the plumbing trade installing the shower tray also ensure and check that everything is properly prepared (in our case: that the screed is at the correct height, etc.) before the next trade (tiling) starts? Then corrections could have been made earlier.
We also have household insurance – if things go really wrong, we might even have this clarified, since the shower trays are no longer serviceable and that option was lost to us.
There is still time. Due to the current situation, no three trades will come to our house this year or probably next year anyway.
So we are just gathering information on whether it makes sense to have it fixed at all.
Frankly, we are tired of it.
And we would like to know your opinion on the “serviceability” issue.
Also, whether tradespeople are not supposed to follow the manufacturer’s installation instructions, especially considering that “serviceability” is a very specific feature of these (expensive) shower trays.
Thank you very much for your help.
Rosema7
A different question: if the screed was applied tightly up to the shower tray, how can the, in my opinion, necessary waterproofing tape be installed from the drain to the surface? This tape should overlap the tray, so there should be some space between the screed and the drain. Also, the shower should be able to move independently from the screed or tiles to prevent any detachment and water leaking underneath the screed. So my question is: how was the waterproofing done? Maybe you have some ideas, because just fixing the visually disturbing edge would probably be disproportionate.
Best regards
Best regards
Winniefred28 Oct 2020 07:55If you’re not sure that everything will fit together in the end, I would leave it as is and keep the money. Plumbing work usually involves quite extensive and complex changes (and I believe that’s exactly why this trade often tries to avoid responsibility when mistakes are made—our experience was the same). It’s not just a bit of drywall alteration or some new plastering. It’s definitely very frustrating. However, I would probably just move on. The shower tray seems to be functioning properly anyway.
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