Hello,
we are planning to purchase a single-family house.
Here are some details:
Year built: 1957
Living area: 130 m² (1400 sq ft) / basement
Plot size: 830 m² (0.2 acres)
Price: €85,000
Gas heating from 2005
Garage
Windows from 1980
Double-layer exterior walls
3-core wiring without RCD
Clay roof tiles / no insulation
That should be enough for now.
We really like the room layout.
- Upstairs, only a non-load-bearing wall needs to be removed to create a large bathroom.
- Downstairs, there is a guest toilet that also needs to be renovated.
- Inside, everything must be completely stripped out, meaning carpets and wallpaper.
- The subfloor consists of wooden floorboards that we want to sand and restore, at least in the living room.
- In the upper rooms, we plan to just repaint the floorboards for now.
- The windows need to be replaced.
- New kitchen (relocating connections)
- Blown-in insulation or ETICS (external thermal insulation composite system)
The electrical distribution panel dates from around 1980 and has 3-core wiring but no RCD. The question is whether to completely renew the electrical system while the walls are already open.
The pipes are galvanized and according to the realtor do not need to be replaced.
We have an inspection by a building surveyor scheduled for tomorrow, who will thoroughly check the entire house.
So far we have optimistically estimated renovation costs at around €70,000.
Basically, we have a shell and plan to rebuild everything internally.
What are your experiences with such renovations? What additional issues could arise that we might not have considered? Where can problems occur?
We have already agreed with the realtor that he will "hold" the house for us. We are happy to pay the costs for the surveyor because if everything is okay we get a good feeling. If the surveyor advises us against it, he will have saved us from a bad purchase. He should also give us an approximate idea of what costs to expect.
Do you have general experience with houses from the 1950s regarding structural condition or durability?
Best regards
we are planning to purchase a single-family house.
Here are some details:
Year built: 1957
Living area: 130 m² (1400 sq ft) / basement
Plot size: 830 m² (0.2 acres)
Price: €85,000
Gas heating from 2005
Garage
Windows from 1980
Double-layer exterior walls
3-core wiring without RCD
Clay roof tiles / no insulation
That should be enough for now.
We really like the room layout.
- Upstairs, only a non-load-bearing wall needs to be removed to create a large bathroom.
- Downstairs, there is a guest toilet that also needs to be renovated.
- Inside, everything must be completely stripped out, meaning carpets and wallpaper.
- The subfloor consists of wooden floorboards that we want to sand and restore, at least in the living room.
- In the upper rooms, we plan to just repaint the floorboards for now.
- The windows need to be replaced.
- New kitchen (relocating connections)
- Blown-in insulation or ETICS (external thermal insulation composite system)
The electrical distribution panel dates from around 1980 and has 3-core wiring but no RCD. The question is whether to completely renew the electrical system while the walls are already open.
The pipes are galvanized and according to the realtor do not need to be replaced.
We have an inspection by a building surveyor scheduled for tomorrow, who will thoroughly check the entire house.
So far we have optimistically estimated renovation costs at around €70,000.
Basically, we have a shell and plan to rebuild everything internally.
What are your experiences with such renovations? What additional issues could arise that we might not have considered? Where can problems occur?
We have already agreed with the realtor that he will "hold" the house for us. We are happy to pay the costs for the surveyor because if everything is okay we get a good feeling. If the surveyor advises us against it, he will have saved us from a bad purchase. He should also give us an approximate idea of what costs to expect.
Do you have general experience with houses from the 1950s regarding structural condition or durability?
Best regards
jan2110 schrieb:
We would basically invest the entire purchase price again in renovation costs.
... if everything goes smoothly ...Yes, that’s how it is.
It will still be cheaper for you than building a new house.
In my opinion, the key question is whether you are the type of people for a resale property.
A resale property can often be lived in immediately; not everything has to be up to the latest standards, and you may partly appreciate its quirks and be able to adapt to many things.
From an energy perspective, it’s also possible that you spend a few hundred more euros (a few hundred dollars) on consumption before you decide to replace some windows.
The quality of life lies in the established character, the garden, and the individuality.
P
Peanuts7421 Aug 2016 13:01garfunkel schrieb:
€10,000 for electrical work seems quite steep to me as well... What exactly needs to be done?If you can do it yourself and are not planning anything too extensive or luxurious, that amount is quite high. However, if you have it done by a professional, then that’s probably a realistic figure...
G
garfunkel21 Aug 2016 14:59You’re probably right, but this isn’t about new construction. I assume that in the affected older building, empty conduit pipes are already installed. That already reduces a lot of work; only occasionally will it be necessary (if the future residents consider it necessary) to add extra outlets or relocate a light switch here and there.
The cables already in place are probably still in good condition; at least, I can’t think of any reason why the cables would have deteriorated.
The kitchen is likely an area where rewiring or additional circuit protection may be advisable.
For example, distributing work area outlets across different residual current devices (RCDs / ground-fault circuit interrupters) and similar measures.
Completely removing old wiring and installing new wiring only makes sense to me if the conductors or cable sheaths are porous or if the cables were installed as surface-mounted wiring. Otherwise, in my view, installing a completely new electrical system is less justifiable.
A new circuit breaker panel with RCDs instead of fuses shouldn’t significantly impact the budget.
Overall, most of the existing electrical system will presumably be retained, so I was somewhat surprised by the price of €10,000.
By the way, many electricians don’t mind if you do some of the preparatory work yourself due to a high workload—such as cutting the chases, installing the conduit pipes, and possibly pulling the cables. You just need to coordinate this with the professional.
The cables already in place are probably still in good condition; at least, I can’t think of any reason why the cables would have deteriorated.
The kitchen is likely an area where rewiring or additional circuit protection may be advisable.
For example, distributing work area outlets across different residual current devices (RCDs / ground-fault circuit interrupters) and similar measures.
Completely removing old wiring and installing new wiring only makes sense to me if the conductors or cable sheaths are porous or if the cables were installed as surface-mounted wiring. Otherwise, in my view, installing a completely new electrical system is less justifiable.
A new circuit breaker panel with RCDs instead of fuses shouldn’t significantly impact the budget.
Overall, most of the existing electrical system will presumably be retained, so I was somewhat surprised by the price of €10,000.
By the way, many electricians don’t mind if you do some of the preparatory work yourself due to a high workload—such as cutting the chases, installing the conduit pipes, and possibly pulling the cables. You just need to coordinate this with the professional.
P
Peanuts7422 Aug 2016 07:42garfunkel schrieb:
You’re probably right, but this isn’t a new build. I assume that empty conduit pipes are already present in the affected old building. That eliminates a lot of work; only here and there will it be necessary (if the future residents consider it needed) to add additional sockets or maybe relocate a light switch.
The existing cables are likely still in good condition, at least I don’t see what could go wrong with the cables themselves.
The kitchen is probably an area where rewiring or additional safety measures should be considered.
For example, distributing work sockets across different RCDs (residual current devices) and similar steps.
Completely removing the old wiring and installing new wiring only makes sense to me if the cables or their insulation are brittle or if surface-mounted wiring has been used. Otherwise, a full rewiring seems less sensible in my opinion.
A new fuse box with RCDs instead of fuse links should not significantly affect the budget.
All in all, most of the electrical system could likely be retained, so the price of 10,000€ (approx. $11,000) surprised me a bit.
Many electricians, by the way, are not opposed to homeowners doing some of the work themselves, like cutting the channels, installing the conduit pipes, and possibly pulling the cables. You just have to coordinate this with the professional.Well, in almost no houses are empty conduits installed from the distribution board to the sockets.
And even if they are, it’s not always easy to pull new cables through them...
At a certain age of the building, it makes sense to renew everything.
A fully equipped distribution board quickly costs over 1,000€ (approx. $1,100).
If you only need the materials, the cost should still be well under 10,000€ (approx. $11,000)...
N
nightdancer22 Aug 2016 10:17Naming prices per square meter is not reliable. After all, the scope of renovations varies significantly and is usually not comparable. Everyone also has different requirements. You just need to be aware of the higher costs involved, such as sewage systems (often reaching five-digit amounts), windows, external thermal insulation composite systems (ETICS), roofs, electrical installations, and so on...
P
Peanuts7422 Aug 2016 12:05The 1000.-€ probably refers to a complete renovation, which seems about right when you compare the costs for interior finishing in new construction. It might be somewhat cheaper in new builds, but also simpler...
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