We are in the process of purchasing a semi-detached house in need of full renovation, which we plan to completely refurbish and extend. Key details are as follows:
Existing semi-detached house, 1.5 stories with a pitched roof, 100 sqm (1,076 sq ft), built around 1930 – everything will be gutted and rebuilt. A new extension of 90 sqm (969 sq ft) will be added, two stories in a cubical design, with a basement of about 40 sqm (431 sq ft).
We have agreed on a purchase price, financing is secured, and we estimate total costs of 900,000 euros. We decided to finance 500,000 euros and contribute 400,000 euros in equity.
Now for the question: We tend to want to carry out the entire project (renovation to KFW70EE standard plus extension with basement) with the help of an architect. I have time and enjoy planning, which is important when choosing the option without a general contractor and working with an architect.
I am interested in your experiences regarding collaboration with an architect. What should we look out for when choosing one? How does the ideal collaboration process work? Any other tips? Would you build this way again?
What we definitely do not need is someone who just wants to impose their ideas without considering our wishes. We already know exactly what we need and want in terms of size and floor plan, we are familiar with the zoning plan, the building envelope, etc., and do not need advice on where to place the home office or whether we need one at all. These are fundamental decisions we have already made. Our focus is therefore less on design help and more on submitting applications, managing the construction process, and achieving better cost control and transparency.
I look forward to your experiences and advice on this!
Existing semi-detached house, 1.5 stories with a pitched roof, 100 sqm (1,076 sq ft), built around 1930 – everything will be gutted and rebuilt. A new extension of 90 sqm (969 sq ft) will be added, two stories in a cubical design, with a basement of about 40 sqm (431 sq ft).
We have agreed on a purchase price, financing is secured, and we estimate total costs of 900,000 euros. We decided to finance 500,000 euros and contribute 400,000 euros in equity.
Now for the question: We tend to want to carry out the entire project (renovation to KFW70EE standard plus extension with basement) with the help of an architect. I have time and enjoy planning, which is important when choosing the option without a general contractor and working with an architect.
I am interested in your experiences regarding collaboration with an architect. What should we look out for when choosing one? How does the ideal collaboration process work? Any other tips? Would you build this way again?
What we definitely do not need is someone who just wants to impose their ideas without considering our wishes. We already know exactly what we need and want in terms of size and floor plan, we are familiar with the zoning plan, the building envelope, etc., and do not need advice on where to place the home office or whether we need one at all. These are fundamental decisions we have already made. Our focus is therefore less on design help and more on submitting applications, managing the construction process, and achieving better cost control and transparency.
I look forward to your experiences and advice on this!
Oh man, we just want a floor plan that is practical for our family and that we like. It doesn’t help me if others think a floor plan is great but it doesn’t work for us.
One more question... Does anyone have experience with handling specific trades themselves or doing some of the work on their own? Do you discuss this with the architect, who then basically takes care of everything else?
We can’t do unlimited work (both working and have small children), but we have an electrician and a tiler among our friends. I can do parquet flooring, plastering, and painting myself—I have done this in our house and with some support, I could manage it time-wise.
Sanitary installation could probably be done by my brother-in-law. So these are all tasks that usually happen towards the end of the renovation.
So, would it be possible to agree with the architect on a “nearly turnkey” house where the cooperation ends once only wall and floor finishes and bathrooms are left?
One more question... Does anyone have experience with handling specific trades themselves or doing some of the work on their own? Do you discuss this with the architect, who then basically takes care of everything else?
We can’t do unlimited work (both working and have small children), but we have an electrician and a tiler among our friends. I can do parquet flooring, plastering, and painting myself—I have done this in our house and with some support, I could manage it time-wise.
Sanitary installation could probably be done by my brother-in-law. So these are all tasks that usually happen towards the end of the renovation.
So, would it be possible to agree with the architect on a “nearly turnkey” house where the cooperation ends once only wall and floor finishes and bathrooms are left?
ruby27 schrieb:
if others find a floor plan great but it doesn’t work for us. There is no such thing as “great.” A (good) architect designs based on feasibility regarding the building permit / planning permission, the site, and the financial aspects. They combine individuality, needs, and the family’s future plans with respect for privacy, flexibility, a comfortable atmosphere, and personal development—all under one roof.
Well… an architect has thoroughly studied every kind of demand and need… they know how to arrange rooms so everything works and meets expectations. After all, that is the purpose of a home or residential building. However, most laypeople don’t realize this and plan something quite clumsily on their own.
Until your detailed plans are presented here, I am sorry but frankly, I have to categorize you—just like the last few discussions and about 80% of the design debates from laypeople here. Just do some reading first.
…
ruby27 schrieb:
Electrician and tile setter among friends. Well, what exactly does “among friends” mean? Since work must be done with invoices and warranty, a friend might at best add an extra outlet later. They could also give advice. But if a friend were to take over the entire trade, it would almost certainly delay the house build—assuming they take their annual leave and actually have time for you. Maybe you could get discounts on materials through the companies they work for?
ruby27 schrieb:
Sanitary installation The same applies here, but warranty is even more important.
ruby27 schrieb:
So you could basically agree with the architect on an “almost turnkey” house You can do (almost) anything. “Turnkey” is a marketing term… architects don’t advertise that. It’s often loosely applied, mostly by general contractors.
ruby27 schrieb:
I can install parquet flooring, plaster, and paint myself, I have already done this in this house and would be able to manage it with some support timewise as well. Flooring and painting usually have to be counted as owner-supplied labor because hardly any general contractor includes these anymore. But since you want to build with an architect, they will also factor in owner-supplied work. You just have to make sure their estimates for this are realistic, because their payment under the HOAI fee structure is based on construction costs.
ruby27 schrieb:
One more question... Has anyone had experience managing individual trades themselves or doing some work as self-performed labor? Do you discuss this with the architect, who then basically only takes care of everything else?
We [...], have an electrician and a tiler among friends. I can do parquet flooring, plastering, and painting myself—I’ve done this in my current house and could manage it with some support timewise.
Plumbing might probably be taken care of by my brother-in-law. So, these are all tasks that usually happen towards the end of the renovation.
Would it be possible to agree with the architect on an “almost turnkey” house, where the collaboration ends, for example, when only the wall and floor finishes and bathrooms remain? Thanks for the unintentionally given prompt to add a renovation plan to my house build schedule, alongside the alternative procedures!
I wouldn’t recommend creating any confusion in the contracting process by interfering with the architect’s role. Discuss with the architect a standard tender process that also involves your brother-in-law and yourself. In practical terms, the renovation phase of the old building and the new extension are hardly separable in physical sequence—or do you want to complete a provisional core apartment in phase I, followed by gradual completion of additional living spaces? To my knowledge, neither building regulations nor fee regulations limit your contractual freedom regarding the handover point of construction management responsibility. I would keep construction coordination, including the construction schedule and all helpers and self-performed work, under the architect’s control. I also frequently oversee projects that go beyond my formal scope of services, so I’m happy to advise on collaborating effectively with the architect.
If the whole project is to succeed, I would NEVER exempt myself or my brother-in-law from playing in time to the same conductor’s baton as all other parties involved!
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To answer the original question: we are currently finishing the renovation of 190 sqm (2,045 sq ft) of living space, built in 1936, with two small children aged 1 and 4.
1) Yes, definitely work with an architect repeatedly. We would have been pretty lost otherwise. The money is definitely well spent if you can afford it.
2) No, do not plan on doing the work yourself with three kids and a full-time job. If you manage to do some, great – but don’t rely on it. We didn’t want to spend all our free time on the construction site. There are also many meetings and phone calls that have to be squeezed into your (work) schedule.
3) Make sure to find someone experienced in both renovation and new construction.
4) Make sure to find someone you get along with personally, or whose style you can handle.
5) Trust your gut feeling.
6) Have the architect handle the tendering process and listen to their recommendations for contractors. Experienced architects usually have a good network, and the contractor bids are reasonable because they want to keep working with the architect in the future. We tried twice to get cheaper offers through friends’ recommendations, but in both cases, it ended up more expensive. It is also crucial that everyone on the construction site gets along reasonably well.
7) Be prepared that even with an architect, many decisions will come your way, which can take up a lot of time. Prioritize what is really important to you and otherwise accept recommendations. For example: we could have spent hours choosing window handles, but we just went with the architect’s “standard” option. It looks good, and we don’t really notice it anyway. Baseboard height – 6, 8, 10, or 12 cm (2.4, 3.1, 3.9, or 4.7 inches)? Again, we just followed the recommendation, and it works well. On the other hand, the bathroom tiles still please me every time I see them – there we made at least some personal choices.
8) Be prepared for surprises, especially with the renovation part, and stay flexible. For example, the original floor plans showed single-layer masonry, but in reality, it was double-layered. This meant we needed two steel beams for new window openings and couldn’t run pipes inside the walls. One increased costs, and the other changed the planning.
9) Look closely at the architect’s cost estimate and build in a sufficient contingency buffer (20% or more). Neither in our case nor for others we know who worked with architects did the final cost match the estimate. This is especially due to smaller items not included (e.g., gutting and disposal, porta-potty, etc.).
1) Yes, definitely work with an architect repeatedly. We would have been pretty lost otherwise. The money is definitely well spent if you can afford it.
2) No, do not plan on doing the work yourself with three kids and a full-time job. If you manage to do some, great – but don’t rely on it. We didn’t want to spend all our free time on the construction site. There are also many meetings and phone calls that have to be squeezed into your (work) schedule.
3) Make sure to find someone experienced in both renovation and new construction.
4) Make sure to find someone you get along with personally, or whose style you can handle.
5) Trust your gut feeling.
6) Have the architect handle the tendering process and listen to their recommendations for contractors. Experienced architects usually have a good network, and the contractor bids are reasonable because they want to keep working with the architect in the future. We tried twice to get cheaper offers through friends’ recommendations, but in both cases, it ended up more expensive. It is also crucial that everyone on the construction site gets along reasonably well.
7) Be prepared that even with an architect, many decisions will come your way, which can take up a lot of time. Prioritize what is really important to you and otherwise accept recommendations. For example: we could have spent hours choosing window handles, but we just went with the architect’s “standard” option. It looks good, and we don’t really notice it anyway. Baseboard height – 6, 8, 10, or 12 cm (2.4, 3.1, 3.9, or 4.7 inches)? Again, we just followed the recommendation, and it works well. On the other hand, the bathroom tiles still please me every time I see them – there we made at least some personal choices.
8) Be prepared for surprises, especially with the renovation part, and stay flexible. For example, the original floor plans showed single-layer masonry, but in reality, it was double-layered. This meant we needed two steel beams for new window openings and couldn’t run pipes inside the walls. One increased costs, and the other changed the planning.
9) Look closely at the architect’s cost estimate and build in a sufficient contingency buffer (20% or more). Neither in our case nor for others we know who worked with architects did the final cost match the estimate. This is especially due to smaller items not included (e.g., gutting and disposal, porta-potty, etc.).
leschaf schrieb:
Take a close look at the architect’s cost estimate and make sure to include a significant contingency (starting at 20%). For us, and for everyone we know personally who worked with an architect, the final costs never matched the initial estimates. This is mainly because some smaller items aren’t included, such as demolition and disposal, portable toilet rental, and so on. You only need to look at a car repair bill to see what proportion is made up by small parts like screws, clamps, rubber pieces, and washers.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
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