ᐅ Architect’s Fees – Experiences

Created on: 27 Nov 2018 14:52
T
tumaa
Hello everyone,

First of all, this concerns a good older friend of mine. He has a problem with an architect, and naturally, I’m interested because I am currently in the construction phase myself or at least just starting out.

I can only relay what he told me. He has a friend who has a friend who is an architect.
He was also planning a new build but had to pause the project for personal reasons.

The architect was consulted. The plan was the design, and at first, since I was referred to you by a friend, I ask you for a "good price" (which is reasonable).
He was offered a fee of xyz for the design, and both parties agreed on it.
A short time later, the architect allegedly said, "If I do the design, it will be without my signature; I will complete everything, and you have to get approval/signature from another architect."
My friend was unsure at first but eventually agreed “verbally.”

After the preliminary design was sent to him, he was asked for a deposit. A deposit of about 37% of the agreed sum was paid.
The architect reportedly told him that the design was 75% complete and that he had spent around 50 hours working on it.
For example, the quantities (I’m not familiar with this) were still missing, so the structural builders could not use the drawings because much was missing for costing purposes.

It all became too much for my friend:
- The deposit of about 37% was supposed to be paid in cash. The architect was determined to avoid a bank transfer. When the money was handed over, my friend’s cousin was also present. No receipt was issued; when asked why he didn’t receive one, the answer was, "It’s a friendship price and was planned that way"... he got a bad feeling (he had merely asked for a "good price").
- Then there was the issue with the "signature," which was probably naive on his part.
- Although this is not really a reason, the exterior renderings of the building looked completely off, but of course, that is subjective.

Result: He wanted to end the cooperation immediately.
The architect was informed about this.

At first, there was no response from the architect. Then a few days later, he replied saying, "Since the design is almost finished, he would still like to be paid," leaving it up to my friend to decide how much.

My friend did not respond. Eventually, the architect sent another request and added, "If no counteroffer is made, an invoice will be issued according to the HOAI."

The cousin can confirm that the architect wanted the money in cash and about the "signature" statement.

This is probably not the first case like this. There have been similar cases where such agreements were considered "invalid" or "void."

He is really a good friend of mine (not very skilled with computers), has no legal expenses insurance, and I suggested that I ask here in case someone is legally knowledgeable about the matter:

Can the architect under such circumstances issue an invoice based on the HOAI later on? Is it even legal for him to act this way? (I believe this is called an "agreement without invoice" in legal terms).

Thank you in advance!

PS: Communication was also via email/messages. The conversations are still available.
M
Mottenhausen
28 Nov 2018 10:55
Threads like these should be collected and shown to everyone who confidently estimates their house construction costs at only 50% of the usual market prices, justifying it by saying they know someone who will do each trade or job at a friends-and-family rate. People have a hard time imagining at the start that this can and often will be the outcome in practice.
T
tumaa
29 Nov 2018 13:59
HilfeHilfe schrieb:
What?

The "silly" friend had a smart conversation with the architect :-)....how the process went, no idea :-).

For me, it was just important that he got out of there, somehow it worked out ;-).
H
HilfeHilfe
30 Nov 2018 06:52
tumaa schrieb:
The "silly" friend had a smart conversation with the architect 🙂.... how the process went, no idea 🙂.

For me, it was just important that he came out of there, somehow it worked ;-).

So we Serbs go, take the extra-large cousin with us, and have a friendly conversation.
Y
ypg
30 Nov 2018 10:45
I’ll skip the quotes. Encouraging undeclared work is an administrative offense and so on... see Section 1, Paragraph 1 of the Act on Illegal Employment.

The defense of naivety won’t help either. Tell that to your friend.

Good that they reached an agreement.
🙂
T
tumaa
30 Nov 2018 12:46
ypg schrieb:
I’ll skip the quotes.
Encouraging undeclared work is an administrative offense and so on... see Section 1, Paragraph 1 of the Act Against Unlawful Employment (Schwarzarbeitsgesetz).

Naivety won’t protect you here either. Tell that to your friend.

Good that they reached an agreement.
🙂

Hi....
I know that... but the friend just said, "Please give me a good price," you can also ask at a store.

It only came out later and ultimately contributed to ending the cooperation... the architect could have also issued an invoice for the deposit afterward; legally, I think he has about three months to do so...

However, I also believe that the architect here holds a so-called *guarantee obligation (Garantenstellung)*, which would be worse for him...