ᐅ Y-Tong vs. Concrete Without Additional Insulation in Practice (Heating Costs)
Created on: 28 Feb 2019 17:02
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Keishadow
We are about to start building a house using Ytong blocks without additional insulation, with underfloor heating and a heat pump.
Nevertheless, I am interested in this comparison and roughly how much higher heating costs in percentage terms could be expected, if that can even be calculated.
Energy saving is a big focus nowadays. That’s why Ytong was recommended to us, suggesting that extra insulation might not be necessary. The walls can breathe, and the U-value is sufficient. However, the problem with the U-value is that it is a "laboratory value." In practical situations, the sun shines outside, even in winter! Materials with high density like concrete, calcium silicate blocks, etc., are warmed by the sun and can transfer that heat inside the house. Ytong heats up less strongly but retains the interior heat for longer. The same issue applies to triple-glazed windows. They keep the heat inside better but don’t allow the interior space to warm up as much when the sun shines. This puts the U-value into perspective and makes calculating the actual energy consumption for heating somewhat complicated.
If you also factor in air conditioning, which is used in summer to cool a Ytong house, it gets even more complex. Concrete, on the other hand, could keep the interior cooler in summer, potentially allowing one to avoid air conditioning altogether, which saves energy again.
So, it could well be that the difference in heating costs is not as significant as expected in the end. However, with concrete, you might enjoy significantly more comfortable temperatures during the summer.
Does anyone have experience with this? Perhaps someone lives in a concrete house without insulation and can share insights about the indoor climate and heating costs? I would be really interested to hear what comes out of it...
Nevertheless, I am interested in this comparison and roughly how much higher heating costs in percentage terms could be expected, if that can even be calculated.
Energy saving is a big focus nowadays. That’s why Ytong was recommended to us, suggesting that extra insulation might not be necessary. The walls can breathe, and the U-value is sufficient. However, the problem with the U-value is that it is a "laboratory value." In practical situations, the sun shines outside, even in winter! Materials with high density like concrete, calcium silicate blocks, etc., are warmed by the sun and can transfer that heat inside the house. Ytong heats up less strongly but retains the interior heat for longer. The same issue applies to triple-glazed windows. They keep the heat inside better but don’t allow the interior space to warm up as much when the sun shines. This puts the U-value into perspective and makes calculating the actual energy consumption for heating somewhat complicated.
If you also factor in air conditioning, which is used in summer to cool a Ytong house, it gets even more complex. Concrete, on the other hand, could keep the interior cooler in summer, potentially allowing one to avoid air conditioning altogether, which saves energy again.
So, it could well be that the difference in heating costs is not as significant as expected in the end. However, with concrete, you might enjoy significantly more comfortable temperatures during the summer.
Does anyone have experience with this? Perhaps someone lives in a concrete house without insulation and can share insights about the indoor climate and heating costs? I would be really interested to hear what comes out of it...
Keishadow schrieb:
It could have been that there is a concept here that, although expensive, saves energy for heating in the long run and thus protects the environment. You never know how advanced the technology is. Besides, it was also about the combination of winter -> heating, summer -> air conditioningYes, there is a sensible concept related to concrete, heating, and air conditioning. In this system, the concrete is used as a thermal buffer in winter, storing and releasing heat over a long period, and in summer it acts as a cooled mass. This is called thermal activation of concrete slabs. The concrete core, as the name suggests, is not in the outer walls but located inside, for example, as walls around a stairwell or similar.
Regarding architecture with concrete and glass: look up Brutalism – personally, I do not like it at all, and after about 20 years the buildings look like they are from the 1960s. However, apparently, it has quite a few followers.
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Keishadow1 Mar 2019 12:12dertill schrieb:
This has already been answered. They might have concrete on the outside or inside, but there is always insulation in the middle. Thanks to you as well for the detailed information. I didn’t know there was insulation in between. At first glance, it looked solid to me. Maybe I phrased my question too complicatedly, but basically everything is clear to me now.
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sichtbeton821 Mar 2019 12:16As my avatar name already suggests, we initially considered building with concrete.
We looked into two options:
a) An exterior wall constructed in three layers: concrete / insulation / concrete
b) A monolithic concrete wall construction (where small clay beads are mixed into the concrete to improve the U-value)... as far as I know, this is known as Liapor.
In Switzerland, many houses are built using option b (and the climate there is somewhat colder). However, the wall thicknesses are then around 60-100 cm (24-39 inches).
If you search for "single-family house near Heilbronn made of Liapor lightweight concrete," you will find, in my opinion, a beautiful example. Some data is also provided there.
We looked into two options:
a) An exterior wall constructed in three layers: concrete / insulation / concrete
b) A monolithic concrete wall construction (where small clay beads are mixed into the concrete to improve the U-value)... as far as I know, this is known as Liapor.
In Switzerland, many houses are built using option b (and the climate there is somewhat colder). However, the wall thicknesses are then around 60-100 cm (24-39 inches).
If you search for "single-family house near Heilbronn made of Liapor lightweight concrete," you will find, in my opinion, a beautiful example. Some data is also provided there.
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nordanney1 Mar 2019 12:19Keishadow schrieb:
If it costs 200€ more per month, then you can do that. I’m talking about 100€ per year!!! Same insulation values = same energy consumption.
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nordanney1 Mar 2019 12:21dertill schrieb:
Yes, there is a practical concept related to concrete, heating, and air conditioning. Concrete is used as a thermal storage medium in winter, absorbing and slowly releasing heat, while in summer it serves as a cooled mass. This is called concrete core activation. As the name suggests, the concrete core is not part of the exterior wall but installed inside, for example, as walls around a stairwell or similar. It has been used for many years in commercial construction. In residential buildings, it is still quite rare.
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Keishadow1 Mar 2019 12:22nordanney schrieb:
I’m talking about 100€ per year!!! Same insulation values = same energy consumption.Even if it’s 100€... Even if it’s 200€... Even if it’s 300€... Every single word is being scrutinized here, right?Similar topics