ᐅ Underfloor Heating – How to Insulate the Supply Lines to the Rooms?
Created on: 24 Sep 2024 18:11
C
cryptoki
Hi.
Contrary to the original plan, all the supply lines to the respective rooms were routed through the bedroom. I’m not very happy about that.
What is the best way to insulate the supply lines without reducing the minimum screed coverage? The pipe diameter is 16mm (5/8 inch), and cement screed will be used. Corrugated conduit? But that doesn’t really insulate.
Thanks
Contrary to the original plan, all the supply lines to the respective rooms were routed through the bedroom. I’m not very happy about that.
What is the best way to insulate the supply lines without reducing the minimum screed coverage? The pipe diameter is 16mm (5/8 inch), and cement screed will be used. Corrugated conduit? But that doesn’t really insulate.
Thanks
N
nordanney25 Sep 2024 12:56cryptoki schrieb:
8-12 hours is quite long. I can already feel the underfloor heating after 1-2 hours here. Not in new builds with heat pumps. With correct planning, temperatures rarely exceed 30-32 degrees Celsius (86-90°F) even in the coldest winter. With hardwood flooring, guests often ask whether the underfloor heating is on at all.
cryptoki schrieb:
. And when it doesn’t blast anymore, A heat pump doesn’t blast. It’s more like a gentle breeze (figuratively speaking).
cryptoki schrieb:
then you can also noticeably feel it in the bedroom, especially if the pipes are only minimally insulated. That’s true in older buildings, but not in new builds. A new build is like a high-end refrigerator. If you turn off the power, the temperature doesn’t drop immediately. After 20 hours, the milk inside might still be 9 degrees Celsius (48°F) instead of 6 degrees Celsius (43°F) — temperatures in the house behave similarly (just more slowly). Rooms tend to have quite consistent temperatures.
Hello.
I understand you, everything is basically correct and fine. This applies to about 99% of new build projects, yet there are occasionally houses that deviate from this standard. It is also true that adjacent rooms are gradually heated. If it were that simple, you could create a heating circuit in the middle of the house and heat the entire house this way. That doesn’t work; there will be local variations, even if they are nowhere near as large as in an older building.
It is also correct that for efficiency reasons, a heat pump is operated with the lowest possible supply temperature. It also makes perfect sense to do without a large buffer tank, which further increases efficiency. However, there are projects where maximum efficiency is deliberately ignored. We have a 1000-liter (264-gallon) stratified storage tank. Just the cost of the tiled stove with all its accessories... with that, I could probably heat for 30 years using only the heat pump. That will never be financially justifiable. But does buying a new iPhone, the latest TV, or even a new car—or even a second vehicle—pay off every year? There are certainly reasons to deviate from the ideal model. I’m already looking forward to lighting the tiled stove early in the morning and in the afternoon this winter. One burn releases about 30 kWh of heat for the house (waste heat lost through the chimney already deducted). Of that, 21 kWh is stored over 3 to 4 hours in the tank, and 9 kWh heats the living area and the flues. There is nothing better than chopping wood...
... maybe the system will later run at the minimal supply temperature, or maybe not. What stops me from installing a zone valve with a fail-safe open actuator and integrating it into the KNX system? They can just stay open. Then I can freely decide whether to keep the supply temperature low or raise it slightly and use the actuators. I can do it, but I don’t have to. Is this a religion where everything has to be done strictly by the book?
The current new build just misses the KfW55 standard. The supply temperatures are quite low but still over 30 degrees Celsius (86°F) higher than in the new build. In winter, the supply temperatures here can range between 35 and 40 degrees Celsius (95 and 104°F). Our current smart home control works perfectly with those supply temperatures.
... just a few insights to show that things aren’t always black and white. Maybe my option to control it is oversized or perhaps I don’t even use it. Who knows—but it doesn’t really matter.
I understand you, everything is basically correct and fine. This applies to about 99% of new build projects, yet there are occasionally houses that deviate from this standard. It is also true that adjacent rooms are gradually heated. If it were that simple, you could create a heating circuit in the middle of the house and heat the entire house this way. That doesn’t work; there will be local variations, even if they are nowhere near as large as in an older building.
It is also correct that for efficiency reasons, a heat pump is operated with the lowest possible supply temperature. It also makes perfect sense to do without a large buffer tank, which further increases efficiency. However, there are projects where maximum efficiency is deliberately ignored. We have a 1000-liter (264-gallon) stratified storage tank. Just the cost of the tiled stove with all its accessories... with that, I could probably heat for 30 years using only the heat pump. That will never be financially justifiable. But does buying a new iPhone, the latest TV, or even a new car—or even a second vehicle—pay off every year? There are certainly reasons to deviate from the ideal model. I’m already looking forward to lighting the tiled stove early in the morning and in the afternoon this winter. One burn releases about 30 kWh of heat for the house (waste heat lost through the chimney already deducted). Of that, 21 kWh is stored over 3 to 4 hours in the tank, and 9 kWh heats the living area and the flues. There is nothing better than chopping wood...
... maybe the system will later run at the minimal supply temperature, or maybe not. What stops me from installing a zone valve with a fail-safe open actuator and integrating it into the KNX system? They can just stay open. Then I can freely decide whether to keep the supply temperature low or raise it slightly and use the actuators. I can do it, but I don’t have to. Is this a religion where everything has to be done strictly by the book?
The current new build just misses the KfW55 standard. The supply temperatures are quite low but still over 30 degrees Celsius (86°F) higher than in the new build. In winter, the supply temperatures here can range between 35 and 40 degrees Celsius (95 and 104°F). Our current smart home control works perfectly with those supply temperatures.
... just a few insights to show that things aren’t always black and white. Maybe my option to control it is oversized or perhaps I don’t even use it. Who knows—but it doesn’t really matter.
Tolentino schrieb:
..., but then your question at the beginning of the thread is like asking which tires to put on a car to save fuel, while you have already decided on the 8-cylinder muscle car (instead of the electric vehicle).No. The question was how to avoid excessive heating of the bedroom caused by the heating circuits running through it. We are nowhere near that issue.
N
nordanney25 Sep 2024 14:26cryptoki schrieb:
The current new build narrowly misses the KfW55 standard. Supply temperatures are also quite low but about 30 degrees higher than in the new build. In winter, the supply temperatures here can be between 35 and 40 degrees. Only if the heating system is deliberately designed to be inefficient. An uninsulated older building with only new windows and attic insulation does not require such high supply temperatures (in winter). Just saying.
But since you apparently disregard all the information from the last five pages, I wonder why you’re even posting questions? And since money apparently isn’t a serious concern, I wonder how such odd planning decisions come about in your case?
Anyway, I’m out...
The question was different, but whatever.
You repeat it like a religion. It’s simple thermodynamics, and there’s more than just the current approach.
That’s also misleading. While others buy or lease 4 cars over 12-15 years, I keep mine for 12 to 15+ years. I don’t care about TVs or the latest iPhone. For me, a tiled stove has the highest priority. But never mind, apparently no one wants to consider that and instead accuses me of ignoring your helpful information. Not at all.
… how many new buildings with fireplaces are overheated at the slightest use because they weren’t planned correctly.
You repeat it like a religion. It’s simple thermodynamics, and there’s more than just the current approach.
That’s also misleading. While others buy or lease 4 cars over 12-15 years, I keep mine for 12 to 15+ years. I don’t care about TVs or the latest iPhone. For me, a tiled stove has the highest priority. But never mind, apparently no one wants to consider that and instead accuses me of ignoring your helpful information. Not at all.
… how many new buildings with fireplaces are overheated at the slightest use because they weren’t planned correctly.
It doesn’t matter.
Skip the insulation.
If you want to be able to dynamically control your heating circuits so you can do it, go ahead.
If you care about efficiency, don’t do it.
If you want a cooler bedroom, then insulate the walls and the door to the other interior rooms. In that case, it can also make sense to be able to open and close the heating circuits there separately and dynamically.
Skip the insulation.
If you want to be able to dynamically control your heating circuits so you can do it, go ahead.
If you care about efficiency, don’t do it.
If you want a cooler bedroom, then insulate the walls and the door to the other interior rooms. In that case, it can also make sense to be able to open and close the heating circuits there separately and dynamically.
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