Hello,
we are currently building a semi-detached house with a developer.
The assigned electrician does not offer any smart home options (he only wants to do the standard electrical installation) (that’s how it is with developers).
However, we would like to have a simple "smart home" (I know smart home is not the exact term) or be able to retrofit one later.
Our new house is expected to be handed over before March 2023.
What options do we have for a smart home that can be retrofitted?
What do you think about the new smart home standard Matter?
I can imagine that Matter could replace the current wireless smart home protocols (Zigbee and Z-Wave).
As an alternative to Matter, I could also consider EnOcean.
What is your opinion on EnOcean? I like the idea of it being battery-free.
Which smart home wireless standard would you say is future-proof and would you recommend?
I don’t have to set up the smart home immediately after handover; I can also do it after about a year (in case Matter is delayed).
We basically only want to cover standard functions:
Light switches
Power outlets
Roller shutter control (we have electric roller shutters everywhere)
Window sensors (preferably invisible in the handle with handle position detection)
Underfloor heating controllers
Weather station
Video doorbell (to retrofit ourselves)
Possibly door lock (e.g., Nuki)
All of this should work together with small, simple automations.
Would you advise against something like Homematic IP because only one manufacturer is behind the technology?
To be able to retrofit later, what do we need to have prepared by the electrician during the new build?
Since these are retrofit systems, probably not much, right?
I’m thinking we should have the electrician prepare the following:
- Deep flush-mounted boxes to be able to retrofit smart home technology
- Simple light switches only (I have never seen smart light switches with toggle switches where you can turn the light on and off by pressing left or right)
- Sufficient LAN cabling
What else should we keep in mind?
Thank you very much for your help so we don’t make mistakes.
A wired smart home like KNX is unfortunately not offered by the electrician (it would probably be too much and too expensive for us anyway).
We don’t have the biggest smart home demands; we just want to increase our comfort a bit, and of course, it’s a bit of a hobby.
we are currently building a semi-detached house with a developer.
The assigned electrician does not offer any smart home options (he only wants to do the standard electrical installation) (that’s how it is with developers).
However, we would like to have a simple "smart home" (I know smart home is not the exact term) or be able to retrofit one later.
Our new house is expected to be handed over before March 2023.
What options do we have for a smart home that can be retrofitted?
What do you think about the new smart home standard Matter?
I can imagine that Matter could replace the current wireless smart home protocols (Zigbee and Z-Wave).
As an alternative to Matter, I could also consider EnOcean.
What is your opinion on EnOcean? I like the idea of it being battery-free.
Which smart home wireless standard would you say is future-proof and would you recommend?
I don’t have to set up the smart home immediately after handover; I can also do it after about a year (in case Matter is delayed).
We basically only want to cover standard functions:
Light switches
Power outlets
Roller shutter control (we have electric roller shutters everywhere)
Window sensors (preferably invisible in the handle with handle position detection)
Underfloor heating controllers
Weather station
Video doorbell (to retrofit ourselves)
Possibly door lock (e.g., Nuki)
All of this should work together with small, simple automations.
Would you advise against something like Homematic IP because only one manufacturer is behind the technology?
To be able to retrofit later, what do we need to have prepared by the electrician during the new build?
Since these are retrofit systems, probably not much, right?
I’m thinking we should have the electrician prepare the following:
- Deep flush-mounted boxes to be able to retrofit smart home technology
- Simple light switches only (I have never seen smart light switches with toggle switches where you can turn the light on and off by pressing left or right)
- Sufficient LAN cabling
What else should we keep in mind?
Thank you very much for your help so we don’t make mistakes.
A wired smart home like KNX is unfortunately not offered by the electrician (it would probably be too much and too expensive for us anyway).
We don’t have the biggest smart home demands; we just want to increase our comfort a bit, and of course, it’s a bit of a hobby.
M
Manatarms12329 Apr 2022 07:45I’m not sure if the electrician will agree to install empty conduits everywhere, or if that will just become prohibitively expensive.
A complete wireless smart home would probably be enough for us (KNX would likely be overkill). Our requirements are not very high.
You can drive a Ferrari and still only go up to 100 km/h (60 mph) 😀
If we focus again on wireless,
Which wireless protocol would you recommend? Thread because of Matter? Or EnOcean for battery-free devices?
What do we need to consider or prepare in terms of wireless?
Deep flush-mount boxes are definitely a must.
Should light switches always be installed individually? So no double rocker switches for lights?
Are standard electrical cables sufficient, or does wireless retrofitting absolutely require 5-core cables, for example?
Is there anything else I should pay attention to?
A complete wireless smart home would probably be enough for us (KNX would likely be overkill). Our requirements are not very high.
You can drive a Ferrari and still only go up to 100 km/h (60 mph) 😀
If we focus again on wireless,
Which wireless protocol would you recommend? Thread because of Matter? Or EnOcean for battery-free devices?
What do we need to consider or prepare in terms of wireless?
Deep flush-mount boxes are definitely a must.
Should light switches always be installed individually? So no double rocker switches for lights?
Are standard electrical cables sufficient, or does wireless retrofitting absolutely require 5-core cables, for example?
Is there anything else I should pay attention to?
X
xMisterDx6 May 2022 22:28What is the purpose of LAN wiring?
Imagine you built your house 25 years ago... back then, during my student internship, I was still working with Token Ring and 10 Mbit.
The first time I heard about "CAT" cables was 20 years ago. Back then, we had CAT5; now there is CAT8...
On average, your home LAN installation becomes outdated every 5 years.
What surprises me every time with these topics is that no one ever asks about security.
If your door lock is "smart controlled" and someone hacks it, the insurance won’t pay a dime because no actual break-in occurred.
And for some amusement... I drive a Seat Leon ST, model year 2020. Sometimes the trunk closes while I’m still looking for something... but other times it just opens on its own... food for thought...
Imagine you built your house 25 years ago... back then, during my student internship, I was still working with Token Ring and 10 Mbit.
The first time I heard about "CAT" cables was 20 years ago. Back then, we had CAT5; now there is CAT8...
On average, your home LAN installation becomes outdated every 5 years.
What surprises me every time with these topics is that no one ever asks about security.
If your door lock is "smart controlled" and someone hacks it, the insurance won’t pay a dime because no actual break-in occurred.
And for some amusement... I drive a Seat Leon ST, model year 2020. Sometimes the trunk closes while I’m still looking for something... but other times it just opens on its own... food for thought...
B
Benutzer2006 May 2022 23:34xMisterDx schrieb:
I first heard about "CAT" 20 years ago. Back then we were at CAT5, now there is CAT8...
On average, your home LAN installation becomes outdated every 5 years. Cat5 supports 1 Gbit/s – which was oversized for all private users 20 years ago and still is today. So for private users, it is still far from outdated.
xMisterDx schrieb:
What is the purpose of having a wired LAN installation?What alternative do you suggest?
xMisterDx schrieb:
I drive a Seat Leon ST, model year 2020. Sometimes the trunk closes by itself while I’m still looking for something… but other times it just opens on its own… something to think about… No ASIL… because it’s just a boring trunk…
This is not a straightforward question at the moment, and I recently faced a similar situation myself.
Mainly for cost reasons, I decided against a full KNX automation system for my modest "home automation" setup.
For roller shutters/blinds, smart plugs (e.g., pool pump & salt system), various measurement tasks (e.g., balcony solar system, circulation pump control), LED strips, and some of the lighting, I chose Shelly devices, which are Wi-Fi based.
I already own Philips Hue and will continue using it for lighting control in certain areas.
I also have Homematic IP, which I mainly used in my previous house for heating control (window-open detection). As mentioned before, this is not very suitable for underfloor heating, so I won’t continue using it for that purpose in the new house. (The exception is a holiday home where the heating is turned down to a minimum temperature for weeks at a time.)
What I will keep are the smart plugs for cycle detection of the washer and dryer, as well as the window/door sensors with alarm sounder and panic button for the "alarm system." However, I’m currently looking into the cost of integrated reed switches for some windows.
HMIP works reliably but is also quite expensive.
I am still unsure about how to integrate additional sensors, such as for presence detection, brightness measurement, room temperature measurement, or anemometers. Aqara is an interesting brand here, also from a cost perspective. Their standard components don’t yet support Matter, but they are working on a new product line. Whether I want to include another system is still undecided.
With an overarching automation platform like Home Assistant, you can connect devices from different manufacturers and visualize everything. This runs on a small server, a Raspberry Pi, or a NAS.
Even though Matter ensures radio protocol compatibility between brands, I doubt all devices will be visualized in one manufacturer's app.
If possible, I would suggest waiting a bit until manufacturers have clarified how and with which devices they will support Matter.
By the way, if you consider using Shelly devices, make sure you have a good Wi-Fi network with strong coverage throughout the house (an access point on every floor).
No, they don’t have to be individual. But make sure that all switch boxes have three-core cables, including a neutral conductor. This is actually standard nowadays.
Roller shutters:
If you want to automate them with Shelly modules, it’s better to use push buttons rather than toggle switches in the installation, as this simplifies control later on.
Use classic roller shutter motors with wired connections (one conductor for up and one for down) instead of radio solutions.
Consider having a central roller shutter switch in larger rooms or per floor to make operation easier.
Other home automation elements I have implemented/planned/specify:
# I installed an additional high-level central socket in the living room where I will later mount a tablet for home automation visualization. The tablet will be mounted with a holder above the socket, and a power supply will be installed inside the socket for charging.
# A triple light push-button in the living room to activate specific scenes
# The mentioned central roller shutter push buttons on each floor
# In the hallway, I have an HMIP double push-button with color feedback. This shows me if the washer or dryer cycle is finished, the state of the alarm system, etc.
# Circulation pump control via a Shelly device with a temperature sensor add-on. It detects when hot water is drawn from the supply line and switches the pump on.
# Flush-mounted motion sensor in the hallway entrance area for automatic light control
Mainly for cost reasons, I decided against a full KNX automation system for my modest "home automation" setup.
For roller shutters/blinds, smart plugs (e.g., pool pump & salt system), various measurement tasks (e.g., balcony solar system, circulation pump control), LED strips, and some of the lighting, I chose Shelly devices, which are Wi-Fi based.
I already own Philips Hue and will continue using it for lighting control in certain areas.
I also have Homematic IP, which I mainly used in my previous house for heating control (window-open detection). As mentioned before, this is not very suitable for underfloor heating, so I won’t continue using it for that purpose in the new house. (The exception is a holiday home where the heating is turned down to a minimum temperature for weeks at a time.)
What I will keep are the smart plugs for cycle detection of the washer and dryer, as well as the window/door sensors with alarm sounder and panic button for the "alarm system." However, I’m currently looking into the cost of integrated reed switches for some windows.
HMIP works reliably but is also quite expensive.
I am still unsure about how to integrate additional sensors, such as for presence detection, brightness measurement, room temperature measurement, or anemometers. Aqara is an interesting brand here, also from a cost perspective. Their standard components don’t yet support Matter, but they are working on a new product line. Whether I want to include another system is still undecided.
With an overarching automation platform like Home Assistant, you can connect devices from different manufacturers and visualize everything. This runs on a small server, a Raspberry Pi, or a NAS.
Even though Matter ensures radio protocol compatibility between brands, I doubt all devices will be visualized in one manufacturer's app.
If possible, I would suggest waiting a bit until manufacturers have clarified how and with which devices they will support Matter.
By the way, if you consider using Shelly devices, make sure you have a good Wi-Fi network with strong coverage throughout the house (an access point on every floor).
Manatarms123 schrieb:
Should light switches always be individual? Like no double rocker switch for lights?
No, they don’t have to be individual. But make sure that all switch boxes have three-core cables, including a neutral conductor. This is actually standard nowadays.
Roller shutters:
If you want to automate them with Shelly modules, it’s better to use push buttons rather than toggle switches in the installation, as this simplifies control later on.
Use classic roller shutter motors with wired connections (one conductor for up and one for down) instead of radio solutions.
Consider having a central roller shutter switch in larger rooms or per floor to make operation easier.
Other home automation elements I have implemented/planned/specify:
# I installed an additional high-level central socket in the living room where I will later mount a tablet for home automation visualization. The tablet will be mounted with a holder above the socket, and a power supply will be installed inside the socket for charging.
# A triple light push-button in the living room to activate specific scenes
# The mentioned central roller shutter push buttons on each floor
# In the hallway, I have an HMIP double push-button with color feedback. This shows me if the washer or dryer cycle is finished, the state of the alarm system, etc.
# Circulation pump control via a Shelly device with a temperature sensor add-on. It detects when hot water is drawn from the supply line and switches the pump on.
# Flush-mounted motion sensor in the hallway entrance area for automatic light control