Hi,
I’m still undecided about installing home automation in our planned new build.
My requirements are as follows:
- Control of roller shutters or blinds (possibly window contacts to detect open windows)
- Control of heating / air source heat pump or solar system
- Control of a video intercom system via a tablet
Of course, I have looked into KNX and the material costs alone would be around 6000€ (approximately 6,350 USD). As an alternative, Loxone is mentioned increasingly often, although the proprietary format is a bit off-putting.
My requirements could also be met with a manufacturer-specific system.
Do you have any recommendations for or against home automation (in my case)?
Best regards
Acd85
I’m still undecided about installing home automation in our planned new build.
My requirements are as follows:
- Control of roller shutters or blinds (possibly window contacts to detect open windows)
- Control of heating / air source heat pump or solar system
- Control of a video intercom system via a tablet
Of course, I have looked into KNX and the material costs alone would be around 6000€ (approximately 6,350 USD). As an alternative, Loxone is mentioned increasingly often, although the proprietary format is a bit off-putting.
My requirements could also be met with a manufacturer-specific system.
Do you have any recommendations for or against home automation (in my case)?
Best regards
Acd85
Mycraft schrieb:
As several people have confirmed here by now, Loxone and KNX are quite similar in terms of initial costs, etc. So, what costs exactly are you referring to? Phew, I honestly don’t know how to respond to such selective nonsense...
You took a partial quote from Uwe, you don’t know the components involved, and you think his statement: "Just what I would have needed for all the connections with Loxone extensions" directly makes the whole system more expensive? Wow... I have nothing more to say on that!
Mycraft schrieb:
Well, see, you actually end up using the KNX protocol anyway, so why take the detour through Loxone and then still use EIB/KNX? You’d better read the entire paragraph again before writing such nonsense!
Mycraft schrieb:
Oh yes, of course... because today’s building technology already comes with a built-in web server, and every roller shutter motor instantly understands exactly what the free service wants from it and what to do with the data. Right... Sorry, that amazing, so-called flexible system doesn’t need a server at all and therefore can’t communicate with anything that isn’t EIB... My mistake!
@Mycraft
calm down and read the texts completely again. We know you have your opinion, but by now it has NOTHING to do with the actual topic here!
Saruss schrieb:
Regarding a point mentioned earlier: I am quite certain that home automation definitely does not save heating costs. At least not if you have underfloor heating with a low supply temperature or a reasonably insulated building. At most in older buildings where you can shut off a room and then quickly heat it up again thanks to a supply temperature of 80°C (176°F).
I can confirm that. Our supply temperature is 31°C (88°F). If we don’t keep the underfloor heating running continuously in the bathrooms, we can’t reach a temperature suitable for showering there.
With such a low supply temperature, it takes 24 to 36 hours to notice any temperature change. Until three weeks ago, I also didn’t believe it, but unfortunately, that’s how it is!
FreakErn schrieb:
I can confirm that. We have a flow temperature of 31°C (88°F). If we don't keep the underfloor heating on continuously in the bathrooms, we can't reach a temperature suitable for showering there. Therefore, I am also considering whether it’s really worth spending the money and space on the heating actuators. I need to discuss this again with my GaWaSch.
Uwe82 schrieb:
That’s why I’m also considering whether I should really spend the money and space on the heating actuators, I need to discuss this again with my GaWaSch I’m not very familiar with KNX, but wouldn’t it be enough to just install a bus cable in the heating distribution manifold, just in case? Then you only need to remember to leave a cable spare somewhere to be able to measure the temperature.
Since people keep complaining that I supposedly haven’t read everything and only pick out single sentences, I’ll quote the full text:
First:
We never talked about DIY here, but about ready-made solutions… that’s why I ignored your part.
Second:
The HomeServer is a very poor example for this because it’s basically the luxury class—completely overkill for the average user.
Third, and here I’ll quote myself:
Just like you, I named two examples and added that there are many more options. Just consider the number of ready-made solutions available for smartphones. The range is huge—from fully free software to something like the HomeServer.
By the way, here is a quote from Wiregate:
The WireGate Server is a pre-installed multifunction gateway for smart homes. It is specifically designed as a gateway between wireless and wired bus systems such as 1-Wire sensor networks, KNX installation bus, Ethernet & Internet as well as serial interfaces like USB, RS232, RS485.
Events and data are stored in simple text files (“logs”) and databases and can be easily analyzed graphically with just a click. Logic and extended functions can be implemented with plugins. Several dozens of ready-made plugins are available for personal use and can be easily adapted for individual purposes.
New in version 1.2: The graphical interface for browser use has been extensively revised and significantly simplified. No Linux knowledge is required. A root access option is available for power users.
And yes, I was where you are now about five years ago and looked at various solutions, including Loxone, so I know what I’m talking about. And I didn’t stop there—I keep myself updated daily on developments.
Don’t bother. It’s pointless and just wasted money. No proper regulation will happen. In a well-built and balanced system, the heat pump or boiler automation—depending on what you installed—does all the work.
Regarding the nonsense from FreakErn, one can only say:
The topic here is:
Home Automation – Advice
and that’s all I’m doing here…
P.S. I am the calm in person…
Uwe82 schrieb:
First, you only addressed my first part (“have to buy expensive stuff”) and ignored the other part (“or have to DIY it”).
Second, the HomeServer was only given as an example, which is why it was marked “e.g.”.
Third, the EibPC with visualization costs more than 600€ (about $650) without the IP gateway, which is also needed, so it’s quite a bit more expensive and in the end also a DIY solution with a much steeper learning curve for beginners. Wiregate isn’t exactly cheap either and, as far as I know, mostly just provides visualization without major logic functions (otherwise please enlighten me, I’m an uninformed person with outdated devices which he only recently bought a few months ago).
Have you even taken a closer look at Loxone or other PLCs?
First:
We never talked about DIY here, but about ready-made solutions… that’s why I ignored your part.
Second:
The HomeServer is a very poor example for this because it’s basically the luxury class—completely overkill for the average user.
Third, and here I’ll quote myself:
Mycraft schrieb:
Look at Wiregate or EibPC to name just two, but there are many, many more and new ones appear every day.
Just like you, I named two examples and added that there are many more options. Just consider the number of ready-made solutions available for smartphones. The range is huge—from fully free software to something like the HomeServer.
By the way, here is a quote from Wiregate:
The WireGate Server is a pre-installed multifunction gateway for smart homes. It is specifically designed as a gateway between wireless and wired bus systems such as 1-Wire sensor networks, KNX installation bus, Ethernet & Internet as well as serial interfaces like USB, RS232, RS485.
Events and data are stored in simple text files (“logs”) and databases and can be easily analyzed graphically with just a click. Logic and extended functions can be implemented with plugins. Several dozens of ready-made plugins are available for personal use and can be easily adapted for individual purposes.
New in version 1.2: The graphical interface for browser use has been extensively revised and significantly simplified. No Linux knowledge is required. A root access option is available for power users.
And yes, I was where you are now about five years ago and looked at various solutions, including Loxone, so I know what I’m talking about. And I didn’t stop there—I keep myself updated daily on developments.
Uwe82 schrieb:
Therefore, I’m considering whether I should really spend the money and space on the heating actuators, I need to talk to my plumber again about that
Don’t bother. It’s pointless and just wasted money. No proper regulation will happen. In a well-built and balanced system, the heat pump or boiler automation—depending on what you installed—does all the work.
Regarding the nonsense from FreakErn, one can only say:
The topic here is:
Home Automation – Advice
and that’s all I’m doing here…
P.S. I am the calm in person…