ᐅ Consultation for Smart Home New Construction Wireless Systems
Created on: 7 Dec 2019 19:53
S
Smarti99
Hello everyone,
I am currently planning the components for my smart home in a new build.
Thanks in advance
I am currently planning the components for my smart home in a new build.
- The electrical installation will be done conventionally.
- Roller shutters controlled only via smart home, without physical switches. Seasonally controlled (Sonoff relays).
- I also want to control underfloor heating circuits solely via smart home. For this, I would need temperature and humidity sensors in the rooms. Which ones would you recommend? Which relays could I use for the valves? They are just on or off. I would probably need about 8 to 10 units.
- I want to override light switches in the rooms using Shelly devices.
- There will be touchscreens on two floors displaying all information and control options.
- Additionally, Android apps on every phone for home control.
- In the living room, a configurable button with a display? What would be suitable here?
- Alarm system with motion sensors and possibly door contacts.
- Control via OpenHAB.
- Which sensor can I use to control any actuator with a simple wall switch?
Thanks in advance
That may be true; everyone has their own priorities. I fully agree with Untergasse43 and partly with his words... for some, the focus is on the technical equipment of the building structure. For others, it’s the garden design, and for a third group, the whole thing has to be as sustainable as possible.
A prime example is a fireplace or stove in a modern house with underfloor heating, which is about as necessary as a wart on the nose. Including all investment and procurement costs for the stove, chimney, etc., it can easily cost around 10,000 (currency). Then, for typical users without their own woodland, it’s used only two or three times per season.
Your statement fits perfectly here as well.
A prime example is a fireplace or stove in a modern house with underfloor heating, which is about as necessary as a wart on the nose. Including all investment and procurement costs for the stove, chimney, etc., it can easily cost around 10,000 (currency). Then, for typical users without their own woodland, it’s used only two or three times per season.
Your statement fits perfectly here as well.
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Alessandro19 Nov 2020 14:29My statement also applies to pools, saunas, cars, etc. ;-)
Still, with a smart home, it’s not like I don’t already have the basic features covered with solutions from shading companies like, for example, Somfy. Lighting can be managed with Philips HUE. Even with Google Home, you can cover 90% of all applications. All of this costs just a fraction compared to KNX, Loxone, Resideo, and so on.
These are standalone solutions that are less “smart” in terms of being interconnected, but each system works perfectly on its own.
I also can’t think of a meaningful example of logical connections between the different trades that would bring me more comfort and perhaps even save money.
Still, with a smart home, it’s not like I don’t already have the basic features covered with solutions from shading companies like, for example, Somfy. Lighting can be managed with Philips HUE. Even with Google Home, you can cover 90% of all applications. All of this costs just a fraction compared to KNX, Loxone, Resideo, and so on.
These are standalone solutions that are less “smart” in terms of being interconnected, but each system works perfectly on its own.
I also can’t think of a meaningful example of logical connections between the different trades that would bring me more comfort and perhaps even save money.
The idea that smart home technology saves money in private households is a very common myth...
The major issue I see with these standalone solutions is that you are completely at the mercy of the manufacturer’s decisions, without any protection.
If they lose interest and discontinue the products, and something breaks, it’s really inconvenient. Imagine a roller shutter control fails. If the manufacturer has gone out of business or stopped production, your shading system for that one window simply stops working.
In my opinion, this only truly works if you manage to network all devices together in some way.
A perfect example: If you have a photovoltaic system on the roof, it would be ideal if all consumers—like the hot water system in the heat pump, dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, etc.—know when the sun is shining and operate accordingly.
If they lose interest and discontinue the products, and something breaks, it’s really inconvenient. Imagine a roller shutter control fails. If the manufacturer has gone out of business or stopped production, your shading system for that one window simply stops working.
In my opinion, this only truly works if you manage to network all devices together in some way.
A perfect example: If you have a photovoltaic system on the roof, it would be ideal if all consumers—like the hot water system in the heat pump, dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, etc.—know when the sun is shining and operate accordingly.
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Alessandro19 Nov 2020 15:30Well, you can take that risk if you rely on reputable manufacturers. In the worst case, there are wireless actuators like EnOcean, Zigbee, etc.
Yes, these functions (except for the washing machine) are nice @gmt94, but if you compare the costs for installation and commissioning, you could run the dryer, heat pump, and dishwasher for decades at 0.50 euros (about 0.50 USD) per start.
Such a partial solution is never worthwhile...
Not even if I’m an eco-enthusiast, because the production and disposal of the individual appliances do not justify the use of "green electricity" from the photovoltaic system.
It gets even worse when an energy storage system is involved.
And: I can already set start times for the dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, etc. directly on the appliances.
What’s the point if the devices only turn on when the photovoltaic system is producing power, but I need the laundry, dishes, etc. immediately?
Yes, these functions (except for the washing machine) are nice @gmt94, but if you compare the costs for installation and commissioning, you could run the dryer, heat pump, and dishwasher for decades at 0.50 euros (about 0.50 USD) per start.
Such a partial solution is never worthwhile...
Not even if I’m an eco-enthusiast, because the production and disposal of the individual appliances do not justify the use of "green electricity" from the photovoltaic system.
It gets even worse when an energy storage system is involved.
And: I can already set start times for the dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, etc. directly on the appliances.
What’s the point if the devices only turn on when the photovoltaic system is producing power, but I need the laundry, dishes, etc. immediately?
Alessandro schrieb:
These are standalone solutions that are less smart in terms of networking, but each system works perfectly on its own. Only until the point where these systems start interfering with each other or causing problems, or annoying the residents because something doesn’t quite work—and that happens sooner or later.
For example, shutters lowering while someone is still in the garden. The Somfy shutters, heating control, and Hue lights still work perfectly. Only the homeowner is locked out because the key is inside.
Also, with this approach, you usually need many more devices or sensors because several systems require the same sensor data or feedback but cannot communicate with each other. One system might run on ZigBee, another on Wi-Fi, and a third uses a completely proprietary technology.
And no, sorry, a "smart home" controlled by 20 different apps on your phone is not a "smart home."
You mentioned it yourself—the “basic functions” can be achieved with individual systems. But quite often, you end up in a vendor lock-in. You become dependent on the manufacturer’s products. KNX is different in this regard.
Alessandro schrieb:
I also can’t think of any useful logical connections I could make between the different trades that would bring me more comfort or maybe even save money. Well, saving money probably isn’t the primary benefit here. But you do save time, and it definitely increases comfort. Useful connections appear when managing time-dependent electricity consumption or lighting control and scenarios. For example, a “normal” house usually has only a few lighting groups—that is, general ambient lighting and basic fixtures. With more options, people suddenly get more ideas. What you don’t know, you don’t miss.
Alessandro schrieb:
And: I can already set times for the dishwasher, washing machine, dryer, etc. But then you have to do it every time. You do it once or twice and then stop. In an intelligent system, it runs on its own—set it once and done.
Alessandro schrieb:
What’s the point if the appliances only start when the solar panels are producing, but I need the laundry or dishes right away? That’s where the human factor comes in, and according to Asimov’s Second Law, you can still start your washing machine or dishwasher manually if needed. Or you can start it remotely even if it conflicts with the original rules. KNX supports that.
Alessandro schrieb:
Such a partial island solution is never worthwhile... Exactly. That’s why KNX focuses on comprehensive automation, not just parts of it. It goes one step further by replacing conventional wiring with structured cabling, saving unnecessary costs and avoiding the related limitations.
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