ᐅ Design phases 1 to 4 with the architect, new construction originally planned with a general contractor, but...
Created on: 29 Mar 2021 23:36
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albert5Hello Forum,
we are planning to build a house...
We have worked with an architect to create a design and planning permission documentation and have received the approval exemption for the new construction project.
With the design, we approached several general contractors for consultations and received initial cost estimates and construction descriptions. However, we have the feeling that none of them really want to build our house. On one hand, the cost estimates differ significantly even after adding a 20% contingency/risk margin, and on the other hand, the design is dismissed with comments like “that’s not how it’s done,” “wow, that will be expensive,” and “usually it’s built this or that way.”
The house itself is quite standard: 130m2 (1400 sq ft), calcium silicate brick + brick veneer, L-shaped bungalow with a pitched roof, no bay windows/dormers, no basement, KfW-55 standard, district heating.
In the end, we are offered a house that mostly corresponds to their standard models, but costs about 50% less than our calculated budget. Additionally, the specification includes mediocre features that could be upgraded, but naturally at a considerable extra cost.
In short, so far I have not really trusted any of the general contractors.
Now we have time – we plan to start construction in 2022 – and sufficient equity to complete a closed shell (everything except building services: heating, electrical, flooring, sanitary, interior doors, interior wall finishes).
The idea now is to build the house through individual contracts with a structural engineer or other architects locally (since we will build far from our current residence).
Are there any other important considerations? What do you generally think of this approach?
Thank you very much.
we are planning to build a house...
We have worked with an architect to create a design and planning permission documentation and have received the approval exemption for the new construction project.
With the design, we approached several general contractors for consultations and received initial cost estimates and construction descriptions. However, we have the feeling that none of them really want to build our house. On one hand, the cost estimates differ significantly even after adding a 20% contingency/risk margin, and on the other hand, the design is dismissed with comments like “that’s not how it’s done,” “wow, that will be expensive,” and “usually it’s built this or that way.”
The house itself is quite standard: 130m2 (1400 sq ft), calcium silicate brick + brick veneer, L-shaped bungalow with a pitched roof, no bay windows/dormers, no basement, KfW-55 standard, district heating.
In the end, we are offered a house that mostly corresponds to their standard models, but costs about 50% less than our calculated budget. Additionally, the specification includes mediocre features that could be upgraded, but naturally at a considerable extra cost.
In short, so far I have not really trusted any of the general contractors.
Now we have time – we plan to start construction in 2022 – and sufficient equity to complete a closed shell (everything except building services: heating, electrical, flooring, sanitary, interior doors, interior wall finishes).
The idea now is to build the house through individual contracts with a structural engineer or other architects locally (since we will build far from our current residence).
- Is it advisable to have the detailed execution planning done by the original designer, or should this be handled by the new local engineer/architect? This person would then also take care of the tendering and site supervision.
- Might we face issues with construction financing if we already have a closed shell and need a loan to finish it?
- Is it better to tender the detailed execution plans together with the trades (electrician, sanitary, heating), or should these be prepared before the tender process?
Are there any other important considerations? What do you generally think of this approach?
Thank you very much.
albert5 schrieb:
We took the design to various general contractors [...] but the design was dismissed with comments like "that’s not how it’s done," "wow, that’s going to be expensive," and "normally you build it this or that way." Well, even I can’t completely judge that without seeing images ;-) But yes, when I think of "The Emperor’s New Clothes": an invisible house could indeed be quite costly 🙂
albert5 schrieb:
Is it advisable to have the construction documentation prepared by the original designer, or should the new engineer/architect on site take over this task? This person would also be responsible for tendering and construction supervision. Unless this is an early April fool’s joke, I find the timing of your question surprising: depending on the answer — and mine is clearly “yes!” — it would be illogical to have done the design and planning approvals “remotely” beforehand. Design development, construction documentation, and site supervision should all be handled by the same party (the original designer). Otherwise, you lose about 80% of the added value a freelance architect offers compared to a general contractor’s draftsperson. So, in that sense, “what a waste of the fee.”
albert5 schrieb:
Now we have time — we want to start building only in 2022 — and we have sufficient equity to complete a closed shell (everything except building services: heating, electrical, floor coverings, sanitary facilities, interior doors, interior wall finishes).
The idea now is to build the house with a structural engineer or another architect on site (we are building far away from our current place of residence) using individual trade contracts. Okay, no further questions, Your Honor. A contract volume consisting solely of a weather-tight shell and refusals from general contractors — there might be a causal connection here — somewhat like the relation between “almost everything done wrong” and “putting the cart before the horse” (as I said, assuming this is not an April fool’s joke). It would have been wiser to have the architect responsible for tendering and site supervision also be the planner — by the way, only after financing has been arranged:
albert5 schrieb:
Might we have problems with construction financing if we already have a shell and then need a loan to complete it? https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
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Gerddieter30 Mar 2021 17:27I don’t understand these counteroffers – can’t the general contractor just say, "not interested, no time, no desire"?
I could imagine that the general contractor calculates, for example:
House with all trades 400,000€ (approx. 440,000 USD), margin 80,000€ (approx. 88,000 USD),
structural shell closed 220,000€ (approx. 242,000 USD) + 80,000€ (approx. 88,000 USD), resulting in an offer of 300,000€ (approx. 330,000 USD).
Take it (and they earn their money) or leave it.
House with all trades 400,000€ (approx. 440,000 USD), margin 80,000€ (approx. 88,000 USD),
structural shell closed 220,000€ (approx. 242,000 USD) + 80,000€ (approx. 88,000 USD), resulting in an offer of 300,000€ (approx. 330,000 USD).
Take it (and they earn their money) or leave it.
Gerddieter schrieb:
I don’t understand the idea of counteroffers – can’t the general contractor just say "no interest, no time, no desire"?He will be even less willing to patiently explain to someone asking for a non-profit job that he doesn’t make a living from that. In such cases, a price that speaks for itself should be enough.https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Hello forum,
The requested general contractors (GCs) should offer the complete house including technical systems, etc.
The idea of splitting the contract arose after these offers were too far from the previously calculated costs – this could of course be due to discrepancies between market reality and the BKI-based estimate. However, the defensive, dismissive statements were also unusual, sometimes without constructive suggestions.
I assume that these companies are currently doing very well with their own house programs and evaluate external designs as unnecessary risks, pricing them accordingly. Perhaps we just selected the wrong providers.
The question is whether there might be another, possibly better way in this situation.
I would lose the single contact/contract partner (GC) for the entire project, but on the other hand possibly gain more influence over the outcome, without giving almost all financial control to one party (though with a bad feeling). As mentioned, in my assessment there is still enough time and equity to take important steps gradually.
Thank you very much.
The requested general contractors (GCs) should offer the complete house including technical systems, etc.
The idea of splitting the contract arose after these offers were too far from the previously calculated costs – this could of course be due to discrepancies between market reality and the BKI-based estimate. However, the defensive, dismissive statements were also unusual, sometimes without constructive suggestions.
I assume that these companies are currently doing very well with their own house programs and evaluate external designs as unnecessary risks, pricing them accordingly. Perhaps we just selected the wrong providers.
The question is whether there might be another, possibly better way in this situation.
I would lose the single contact/contract partner (GC) for the entire project, but on the other hand possibly gain more influence over the outcome, without giving almost all financial control to one party (though with a bad feeling). As mentioned, in my assessment there is still enough time and equity to take important steps gradually.
Thank you very much.
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