ᐅ Semi-detached house, upscale fittings: Are the additional costs accurate?
Created on: 6 Dec 2014 11:35
3
305er
Hello,
Yesterday, we met with an architect who showed us a plot of land for a semi-detached house. The other half is already built.
The house has 140 sqm (1507 sqft) of living space, although a large part of this already includes the basement, as it is usable living space (with a window).
The house will be finished to a high standard (I will copy the real estate listing at the end here).
The architect will act as the general contractor and work with local craftsmen.
For additional work such as extra electrical outlets, different bathroom fixtures, etc., I will need to contact his respective craftsmen, who will then provide me with the costs.
Now to the main questions:
The house comes only with a gas heating system and radiators in the rooms.
He said if I want underfloor heating, it will be operated by an air-source heat pump.
The extra cost for this system plus underfloor heating is about €15,000 (about $16,200).
This sounded reasonable to me as I didn’t have any idea before. On this forum, some people were shocked when someone had to pay €8,000 (about $8,600) more.
What do you think about my price?
Also, he kept saying that this air-source heat pump is a form of solar technology, because it extracts heat from the air.
Furthermore:
There are additional costs of about €18,000 (about $19,400) for earthworks, sewer connections, and utility connections.
Is this reasonable?
He said this includes excavation and laying the connections from the street to the house (electricity, water, etc.).
Another extra:
We could install a heat recovery ventilation system with air filters for about €15,000 (about $16,200), similar to what you find in passive prefab houses.
He estimates this could improve the energy efficiency rating from KfW 70 (the usual) to 55.
Is it worth the extra cost, also considering the health benefits?
I am allergic to pollen and suffer from extreme eye itching/burning, throat itching, etc.
These were my main questions so far.
Additional points:
I forgot to ask about the cost for electric shutters. What would you estimate?
And approximately how much would a garage cost?
Is a bedroom with a walk-in closet sized at 15 sqm (160 sqft) big enough? It seems a bit small to me.
Finally:
The plot is on a slight slope. This means roughly half of the basement is below ground level, or put differently, from the terrace there are a few steps down to the garden.
On the left side is the other semi-detached house, on the right side there is a stream, and behind the garden, directly adjacent without any gap, the forest slope goes up.
There is occasional wildlife visiting (according to the neighbor: mice, two rats, a marten’s nest somewhere nearby, a young deer, wild boar).
How would you assess this kind of plot? We are basically city people.
That’s all from me for now. Thanks for your help.
Here is the listing:
+++ NO COMMISSION +++ “BAUHAUS STYLE” IDYLL BY A STREAM – with Basement
Purchase Price:
289,820.00 EUR
Rooms:
5.0
Living Area Approx.:
140.91 sqm (1,517 sqft)
Plot Size Approx.:
420.00 sqm (4,500 sqft)
Main Features
House type:
Semi-detached house
Usable area approx.:
16 sqm (172 sqft)
Number of floors:
3
Bedrooms:
4
Bathrooms:
1
Guest toilet:
Basement:
TV / Internet / Telephone:
Electricity consumption: from 2,500 kWh*
Costs
Purchase price:
289,820.00 EUR
Buyer’s commission:
None
Building Quality
Construction phase:
House in planning (designed)
Standard of finishes:
High-quality
Heating type:
Central heating
Energy certificate:
Not yet available
Property Description
Idyllically situated by a stream, secluded at the edge of the forest, a planned, attractive detached family home with a basement will be built here, turnkey and solidly constructed. This spacious and modern energy-efficient house can be customized with the architect to meet your personal needs, including changes to the floor plan and finishes for your “dream home.” - the open living/dining area is spacious and bright with lots of glazing overlooking the garden and terrace - room layout changes possible - master bedroom with walk-in closet and two children’s rooms - daylight-filled comfort bathroom - generous living/work room in the garden-level basement
Features
“Masterful craftsmanship by local specialized tradesmen” - finished basement - energy-saving, breathable natural brickwork with additional external insulation for energy-conscious comfort - heating system with efficient gas condensing technology, optionally with solar collectors and underfloor heating - family-friendly daylight bathroom with tub and shower - ceramic sanitary fixtures by “Villeroy & Boch” - bathroom and guest toilet tiled in granite - smoke detectors in all bedrooms - partially glass interior doors with decorative balcony railings on the upper floor - interior window sills in “Carrara Bianco” marble - solid wood veneer interior doors with stainless steel handles - electrical switches by “Gira” “Everything is possible, nothing is mandatory... let your wishes run free.”
Additional
Availability: approx. 16 weeks construction time after start
Floor plans and elevations may include optional features at extra cost.
Turnkey means in this offer:
- including plot
- including finished basement without plot-related costs such as earthworks, sewer and utility connections
Floor coverings and painting/wallpapering work done by buyer
Yesterday, we met with an architect who showed us a plot of land for a semi-detached house. The other half is already built.
The house has 140 sqm (1507 sqft) of living space, although a large part of this already includes the basement, as it is usable living space (with a window).
The house will be finished to a high standard (I will copy the real estate listing at the end here).
The architect will act as the general contractor and work with local craftsmen.
For additional work such as extra electrical outlets, different bathroom fixtures, etc., I will need to contact his respective craftsmen, who will then provide me with the costs.
Now to the main questions:
The house comes only with a gas heating system and radiators in the rooms.
He said if I want underfloor heating, it will be operated by an air-source heat pump.
The extra cost for this system plus underfloor heating is about €15,000 (about $16,200).
This sounded reasonable to me as I didn’t have any idea before. On this forum, some people were shocked when someone had to pay €8,000 (about $8,600) more.
What do you think about my price?
Also, he kept saying that this air-source heat pump is a form of solar technology, because it extracts heat from the air.
Furthermore:
There are additional costs of about €18,000 (about $19,400) for earthworks, sewer connections, and utility connections.
Is this reasonable?
He said this includes excavation and laying the connections from the street to the house (electricity, water, etc.).
Another extra:
We could install a heat recovery ventilation system with air filters for about €15,000 (about $16,200), similar to what you find in passive prefab houses.
He estimates this could improve the energy efficiency rating from KfW 70 (the usual) to 55.
Is it worth the extra cost, also considering the health benefits?
I am allergic to pollen and suffer from extreme eye itching/burning, throat itching, etc.
These were my main questions so far.
Additional points:
I forgot to ask about the cost for electric shutters. What would you estimate?
And approximately how much would a garage cost?
Is a bedroom with a walk-in closet sized at 15 sqm (160 sqft) big enough? It seems a bit small to me.
Finally:
The plot is on a slight slope. This means roughly half of the basement is below ground level, or put differently, from the terrace there are a few steps down to the garden.
On the left side is the other semi-detached house, on the right side there is a stream, and behind the garden, directly adjacent without any gap, the forest slope goes up.
There is occasional wildlife visiting (according to the neighbor: mice, two rats, a marten’s nest somewhere nearby, a young deer, wild boar).
How would you assess this kind of plot? We are basically city people.
That’s all from me for now. Thanks for your help.
Here is the listing:
+++ NO COMMISSION +++ “BAUHAUS STYLE” IDYLL BY A STREAM – with Basement
Purchase Price:
289,820.00 EUR
Rooms:
5.0
Living Area Approx.:
140.91 sqm (1,517 sqft)
Plot Size Approx.:
420.00 sqm (4,500 sqft)
Main Features
House type:
Semi-detached house
Usable area approx.:
16 sqm (172 sqft)
Number of floors:
3
Bedrooms:
4
Bathrooms:
1
Guest toilet:
Basement:
TV / Internet / Telephone:
Electricity consumption: from 2,500 kWh*
Costs
Purchase price:
289,820.00 EUR
Buyer’s commission:
None
Building Quality
Construction phase:
House in planning (designed)
Standard of finishes:
High-quality
Heating type:
Central heating
Energy certificate:
Not yet available
Property Description
Idyllically situated by a stream, secluded at the edge of the forest, a planned, attractive detached family home with a basement will be built here, turnkey and solidly constructed. This spacious and modern energy-efficient house can be customized with the architect to meet your personal needs, including changes to the floor plan and finishes for your “dream home.” - the open living/dining area is spacious and bright with lots of glazing overlooking the garden and terrace - room layout changes possible - master bedroom with walk-in closet and two children’s rooms - daylight-filled comfort bathroom - generous living/work room in the garden-level basement
Features
“Masterful craftsmanship by local specialized tradesmen” - finished basement - energy-saving, breathable natural brickwork with additional external insulation for energy-conscious comfort - heating system with efficient gas condensing technology, optionally with solar collectors and underfloor heating - family-friendly daylight bathroom with tub and shower - ceramic sanitary fixtures by “Villeroy & Boch” - bathroom and guest toilet tiled in granite - smoke detectors in all bedrooms - partially glass interior doors with decorative balcony railings on the upper floor - interior window sills in “Carrara Bianco” marble - solid wood veneer interior doors with stainless steel handles - electrical switches by “Gira” “Everything is possible, nothing is mandatory... let your wishes run free.”
Additional
Availability: approx. 16 weeks construction time after start
Floor plans and elevations may include optional features at extra cost.
Turnkey means in this offer:
- including plot
- including finished basement without plot-related costs such as earthworks, sewer and utility connections
Floor coverings and painting/wallpapering work done by buyer
Strange discussion here. On one hand, there was a large group of women at the beginning, followed by many useful tips and questions, and then an original poster (OP) who strongly defends their plan (with THIS exact project). I just wonder why this keeps going like this. The OP has absolutely no interest in a factual discussion about the answers to the questions they raised. Therefore, I’ll summarize the results for the OP:
1. The equipment is sized adequately.
2. The provider is reputable and will carry out all work according to the OP’s wishes.
3. The equipment level is medium to high.
4. There are no risks regarding unexpected costs.
Then everything is all set. I sincerely keep my fingers crossed and wish for a continued worry-free project.
1. The equipment is sized adequately.
2. The provider is reputable and will carry out all work according to the OP’s wishes.
3. The equipment level is medium to high.
4. There are no risks regarding unexpected costs.
Then everything is all set. I sincerely keep my fingers crossed and wish for a continued worry-free project.
305er schrieb:
My questions are not always answered correctly:
Example question: Don’t all houses have to be insulated?
Answer: No
What am I supposed to do with that?? Why is that so?? According to current regulations, houses must be insulated.Some questions are not formulated correctly.
In your case: Don’t all houses have to be insulated?
it should probably be: Don’t all houses have to be additionally insulated with xx or something else.
When building monolithically, for example with aerated concrete, a certain thickness of the wall is sufficient so that no additional insulation is necessary. In my opinion, the answer no is the correct answer here.
The forum cannot replace consulting fundamental literature on house construction.
Regards, Yvonne
Edit: Your question was: Isn’t every masonry wall covered with an external thermal insulation composite system (ETICS) / external wall insulation?
And the answer is: No. That is the correct answer, see above.
I understand the reasons for defending your own project. That’s quite normal and respectable. And yes, the responses you get are often not encouraging but rather create some uncertainty, which is something you naturally want to avoid.
Critical, pessimistic, and informative comments are not meant to discourage you from your plan but rather to motivate you to consider these points carefully in your own interest. What remains can be a clarification, a formal agreement, or a contract that excludes the identified risks as much as possible, or it may lead you to consciously accept these risks as “manageable,” fully aware of their possible implications. Sometimes a warning about potential significant cost increases (for example, due to soil or water issues) shows that the intended project might ultimately be unfeasible, and you may need an alternative plan, which could even mean starting a new property search.
And yes, I sometimes think that, for instance, with financing contributions, the outlook is painted too negatively. On the other hand, you can decide to go ahead with your project fully informed by these comments. Then you have consciously made the decision, knowing there may be problems. Not all financial concerns actually turn into real issues.
In your specific case, however, you might (even if jokingly) be heading straight into a circular saw. Things are very vague and unclear. This usually means that the actual work will be at the lower end of the cost spectrum and might not deliver what you expected. This then leads to additional costs for changes, which can really hit hard because contractors often raise their prices significantly—you generally have no choice about who will do the work, and while price comparisons are possible, there is no real leverage in negotiations.
As I said, I’m keeping all fingers crossed for you, although in the end, that might not make much difference.
Critical, pessimistic, and informative comments are not meant to discourage you from your plan but rather to motivate you to consider these points carefully in your own interest. What remains can be a clarification, a formal agreement, or a contract that excludes the identified risks as much as possible, or it may lead you to consciously accept these risks as “manageable,” fully aware of their possible implications. Sometimes a warning about potential significant cost increases (for example, due to soil or water issues) shows that the intended project might ultimately be unfeasible, and you may need an alternative plan, which could even mean starting a new property search.
And yes, I sometimes think that, for instance, with financing contributions, the outlook is painted too negatively. On the other hand, you can decide to go ahead with your project fully informed by these comments. Then you have consciously made the decision, knowing there may be problems. Not all financial concerns actually turn into real issues.
In your specific case, however, you might (even if jokingly) be heading straight into a circular saw. Things are very vague and unclear. This usually means that the actual work will be at the lower end of the cost spectrum and might not deliver what you expected. This then leads to additional costs for changes, which can really hit hard because contractors often raise their prices significantly—you generally have no choice about who will do the work, and while price comparisons are possible, there is no real leverage in negotiations.
As I said, I’m keeping all fingers crossed for you, although in the end, that might not make much difference.
B
Bauexperte21 Dec 2014 19:40Good evening,
- Was my decision 36 years ago the right one?
- Did I give my children my best?
- Does everything in my granddaughter’s life really have to be perfect?
...
- to be continued
Regards, Bauexperte
305er schrieb:Mine aren’t either:
My questions are not always answered correctly...
- Was my decision 36 years ago the right one?
- Did I give my children my best?
- Does everything in my granddaughter’s life really have to be perfect?
...
- to be continued
Regards, Bauexperte
S
schroedi7522 Dec 2014 21:53I just have to share my thoughts on this....
I keep asking myself why there is a need for this "luxury" standard. Why do I need tiles that cost €60 per square meter (about $65 per square foot)? Tiles that I won’t even like anymore after 10 years... Why do I need electrically operated roller shutters? Only to have to replace the motor after 10 years because it’s broken? Why do I need an air-to-water heat pump that costs an extra €20,000 (about $21,500), just so I can save on energy costs over 20 years and then have to buy another expensive air-to-water heat pump? If it even lasts that long... You pay off your house for 30 years or more, only to have to take out another loan of the same size later to maintain it. Better stick to the essentials and spend your hard-earned money on a few more vacations instead. Why do I need 15 power outlets in the children’s room? Be happy if you can manage that with a switched power strip—that way, you also reduce standby power consumption. Not everything needs to be automated....
Best regards
Hartmut
I keep asking myself why there is a need for this "luxury" standard. Why do I need tiles that cost €60 per square meter (about $65 per square foot)? Tiles that I won’t even like anymore after 10 years... Why do I need electrically operated roller shutters? Only to have to replace the motor after 10 years because it’s broken? Why do I need an air-to-water heat pump that costs an extra €20,000 (about $21,500), just so I can save on energy costs over 20 years and then have to buy another expensive air-to-water heat pump? If it even lasts that long... You pay off your house for 30 years or more, only to have to take out another loan of the same size later to maintain it. Better stick to the essentials and spend your hard-earned money on a few more vacations instead. Why do I need 15 power outlets in the children’s room? Be happy if you can manage that with a switched power strip—that way, you also reduce standby power consumption. Not everything needs to be automated....
Best regards
Hartmut
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