ᐅ Screed heating program set incorrectly and heating pipe loosened
Created on: 28 Jan 2022 04:57
F
faddl92
Hello everyone,
unfortunately, it seems that the screed heating schedule was set incorrectly in our case.
Here is how it was handled:
3 days at 25°C (77°F)
20 days heating up at 1K per day
3 days at 45°C (113°F)
20 days cooling down at 1K per day
We are now already in the cooling down phase. I am not an expert, but I have already informed the site manager. He said it’s fine and that there is no need to heat it up again. I am starting to get the feeling that he doesn’t really know what he is talking about. At the very least, during the cooling down phase at 1K per day, I feel that I need to speak up...
Meanwhile, our tilers and floor layers are waiting...
Actually, everything should have been finished by now. (We have bought the floor covering up to the screed)
What should we do?
The site manager doesn’t show up on site either. He hasn’t even been around the drywall installers or the plumbers.
To make matters worse, a taped heating pipe has come loose and is visible on the surface of the screed...
This was reported two weeks ago, but nothing has been done.
I would appreciate any advice...
Thank you!
Regards, faddl
unfortunately, it seems that the screed heating schedule was set incorrectly in our case.
Here is how it was handled:
3 days at 25°C (77°F)
20 days heating up at 1K per day
3 days at 45°C (113°F)
20 days cooling down at 1K per day
We are now already in the cooling down phase. I am not an expert, but I have already informed the site manager. He said it’s fine and that there is no need to heat it up again. I am starting to get the feeling that he doesn’t really know what he is talking about. At the very least, during the cooling down phase at 1K per day, I feel that I need to speak up...
Meanwhile, our tilers and floor layers are waiting...
Actually, everything should have been finished by now. (We have bought the floor covering up to the screed)
What should we do?
The site manager doesn’t show up on site either. He hasn’t even been around the drywall installers or the plumbers.
To make matters worse, a taped heating pipe has come loose and is visible on the surface of the screed...
This was reported two weeks ago, but nothing has been done.
I would appreciate any advice...
Thank you!
Regards, faddl
The construction manager has already confirmed it. He said that part of it will be chiseled out, lowered, and refilled—but only a small area.
Is that feasible?
...This report was made over 2 weeks ago. Nothing has happened since then. So, I’m a bit anxious.
Can I set a deadline? The flooring installer is supposed to come in 2 weeks. The appointment is fixed (they just have to do everything except that room now...).
This will definitely cause additional costs, rent, and so on...
Regards, Faddl
Is that feasible?
...This report was made over 2 weeks ago. Nothing has happened since then. So, I’m a bit anxious.
Can I set a deadline? The flooring installer is supposed to come in 2 weeks. The appointment is fixed (they just have to do everything except that room now...).
This will definitely cause additional costs, rent, and so on...
Regards, Faddl
Have you contractually agreed on the responsibility for additional costs due to delays?
If the renovation is done this way, it should be fine. They will use fast-setting screed, so that installing the floor covering soon won’t be a problem. Is the rest of the screed ready for covering?
If the renovation is done this way, it should be fine. They will use fast-setting screed, so that installing the floor covering soon won’t be a problem. Is the rest of the screed ready for covering?
B
Benutzer20030 Jan 2022 20:57faddl92 schrieb:
The construction manager already confirmed it. He said that parts will be partially broken up, excavated deeper, and refilled – but only a small area.
Is that feasible?Yes, that’s what I meant by "remove and replace."
Hello faddl92
I have read your initial post and would like to confirm your suspicion ("I am slowly getting the feeling he doesn’t know what he is talking about...").
Anyone who dries out at 1K/day definitely does not know the corresponding recommendations of the BVF (the Federal Association for Surface Heating and Cooling Systems), because that is nonsensical. The screed is able to release its stresses gradually through stepwise heating up to the maximum temperature. The recommendations listed there reflect the current state of the art.
According to these, (for cement screeds) after 21 days or (for calcium sulfate screeds) after 7 days, the system is gradually heated up to the maximum design temperature, this supply temperature is maintained for 4 days, and then it is gradually reduced again at 10K/day. At 40°C (104°F), this means less than one week of waiting time.
After that, functional heating is complete, and the system is left to rest for 2 days at room temperature until surface heating readiness occurs.
This, however, is no longer a gradual heating process; the heating system is immediately raised to the maximum design temperature.
---------------
So much for the “harmless text passage.”
That heating elements detach from the carrier plate or float must definitely be prevented during the installation of the underfloor heating elements. Now, this has happened not only visibly but it is uncertain whether the other heating elements still have the necessary screed coverage of 45mm (1.8 inches).
This means, first of all: your concerns are justified.
Furthermore: simply chipping away the visible part and lowering it—NO!
I have been professionally involved with such and similar issues for over 30 years now.
But ignoring the risk so easily and shifting responsibility onto you (as the owner) is definitely not something I would accept.
Okay, you have a warranty period, usually 5 years. But what use is that if the warm water elements fail to function (to put it politely) after 2 or 3 years?
Once the room is fully furnished, testing and, if necessary, repairs can only be carried out with great effort (for you and your family).
I strongly advise you to involve a publicly appointed and sworn expert for the trade “floor construction” immediately before any further actions.
You can obtain addresses, for example, through the “Expertise” department of your local Chamber of Industry and Commerce.
Because: what is emerging here, I know from my own experience, where the young owner, during his first construction project, documented the process with a camcorder: the flowing screed was poured from the supply hose laid about 1.60m (5 ft 3 in) above the shoulder of the installer onto the floor surface and tore the heating elements, which resemble a hydra with heads here and there sticking out of water (here: from the flowing mass), down, only for them to reappear elsewhere. The contractor at the time argued: “No problem, it will be smoothed over anyway!”
No, everything was completely removed again, including the heating elements and the damaged carrier plates; and afterwards they were replaced properly and professionally according to the state of the art—albeit with great effort, but still in the unoccupied building.
-------------------------------------------
Best regards and wishing you a decisive resolution: KlaRa
I have read your initial post and would like to confirm your suspicion ("I am slowly getting the feeling he doesn’t know what he is talking about...").
Anyone who dries out at 1K/day definitely does not know the corresponding recommendations of the BVF (the Federal Association for Surface Heating and Cooling Systems), because that is nonsensical. The screed is able to release its stresses gradually through stepwise heating up to the maximum temperature. The recommendations listed there reflect the current state of the art.
According to these, (for cement screeds) after 21 days or (for calcium sulfate screeds) after 7 days, the system is gradually heated up to the maximum design temperature, this supply temperature is maintained for 4 days, and then it is gradually reduced again at 10K/day. At 40°C (104°F), this means less than one week of waiting time.
After that, functional heating is complete, and the system is left to rest for 2 days at room temperature until surface heating readiness occurs.
This, however, is no longer a gradual heating process; the heating system is immediately raised to the maximum design temperature.
---------------
So much for the “harmless text passage.”
That heating elements detach from the carrier plate or float must definitely be prevented during the installation of the underfloor heating elements. Now, this has happened not only visibly but it is uncertain whether the other heating elements still have the necessary screed coverage of 45mm (1.8 inches).
This means, first of all: your concerns are justified.
Furthermore: simply chipping away the visible part and lowering it—NO!
I have been professionally involved with such and similar issues for over 30 years now.
But ignoring the risk so easily and shifting responsibility onto you (as the owner) is definitely not something I would accept.
Okay, you have a warranty period, usually 5 years. But what use is that if the warm water elements fail to function (to put it politely) after 2 or 3 years?
Once the room is fully furnished, testing and, if necessary, repairs can only be carried out with great effort (for you and your family).
I strongly advise you to involve a publicly appointed and sworn expert for the trade “floor construction” immediately before any further actions.
You can obtain addresses, for example, through the “Expertise” department of your local Chamber of Industry and Commerce.
Because: what is emerging here, I know from my own experience, where the young owner, during his first construction project, documented the process with a camcorder: the flowing screed was poured from the supply hose laid about 1.60m (5 ft 3 in) above the shoulder of the installer onto the floor surface and tore the heating elements, which resemble a hydra with heads here and there sticking out of water (here: from the flowing mass), down, only for them to reappear elsewhere. The contractor at the time argued: “No problem, it will be smoothed over anyway!”
No, everything was completely removed again, including the heating elements and the damaged carrier plates; and afterwards they were replaced properly and professionally according to the state of the art—albeit with great effort, but still in the unoccupied building.
-------------------------------------------
Best regards and wishing you a decisive resolution: KlaRa
In der Ruine31 Jan 2022 12:09KlaRa schrieb:
After that, the functional heating is completed, and there is a 2-day waiting period at room temperature before the final drying heating begins.Just a completely basic question.Does screed need to be dried this way, or can it simply be left for a few weeks to cure and dry by itself?
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