Dear house building forum,
In our town, building plots in two residential areas were recently allocated simultaneously, which means that almost all plots in our preferred area are still available. These will be advertised again in the coming weeks, and we are now considering which plots would best suit our needs so that we have 2-3 favorites for the allocation. We have already given this some thought and are currently leaning towards plots no. 22 and 23, or alternatively no. 8 or 9. One current concern is whether the southwest orientation of the first-mentioned plots would make the terrace too hot in summer, as we have been hearing this more and more often from people we know. On the other hand, we would like to create a (small) vegetable garden with a greenhouse, so I thought a southern orientation might be advantageous.
Overall, we hope to receive suggestions and perspectives that we have not yet considered, so that we can make the best possible decision for us in the end.
Development plan / restrictions:
Plot size: approx. 600 m² (6460 sq ft)
Slope: no
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4
Built-up area ratio (site coverage): 0.8
Edge development: no
Building boundary
Number of parking spaces: 2
Number of floors: 1.5
Roof type: gable roof
Style: modern
Maximum heights / limits: in WA1 the ridge height (TH) is 4.50 m (15 ft), in WA2 it is 6.50 m (21 ft); the overall building height (GH) is 10 m (33 ft) in both
--> current favorites marked with a red dot in WA1, green dot in WA2
Other requirements: roof pitch 35–45 degrees
We are also currently wondering how low the knee wall will be with a ridge height of 4.50 m (15 ft), and whether we might therefore tend towards WA2 and a two-story house instead.
I apologize in advance for the plans, as I have seen much nicer versions posted here, and on my development plan the individual plots are not marked, but I hope that combining both plans makes the main information clear (don’t be surprised that I have removed personal data of already reserved plots from one of the overviews).
Thanks in advance for your input!
In our town, building plots in two residential areas were recently allocated simultaneously, which means that almost all plots in our preferred area are still available. These will be advertised again in the coming weeks, and we are now considering which plots would best suit our needs so that we have 2-3 favorites for the allocation. We have already given this some thought and are currently leaning towards plots no. 22 and 23, or alternatively no. 8 or 9. One current concern is whether the southwest orientation of the first-mentioned plots would make the terrace too hot in summer, as we have been hearing this more and more often from people we know. On the other hand, we would like to create a (small) vegetable garden with a greenhouse, so I thought a southern orientation might be advantageous.
Overall, we hope to receive suggestions and perspectives that we have not yet considered, so that we can make the best possible decision for us in the end.
Development plan / restrictions:
Plot size: approx. 600 m² (6460 sq ft)
Slope: no
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4
Built-up area ratio (site coverage): 0.8
Edge development: no
Building boundary
Number of parking spaces: 2
Number of floors: 1.5
Roof type: gable roof
Style: modern
Maximum heights / limits: in WA1 the ridge height (TH) is 4.50 m (15 ft), in WA2 it is 6.50 m (21 ft); the overall building height (GH) is 10 m (33 ft) in both
--> current favorites marked with a red dot in WA1, green dot in WA2
Other requirements: roof pitch 35–45 degrees
We are also currently wondering how low the knee wall will be with a ridge height of 4.50 m (15 ft), and whether we might therefore tend towards WA2 and a two-story house instead.
I apologize in advance for the plans, as I have seen much nicer versions posted here, and on my development plan the individual plots are not marked, but I hope that combining both plans makes the main information clear (don’t be surprised that I have removed personal data of already reserved plots from one of the overviews).
Thanks in advance for your input!
M
MachsSelbst11 Oct 2024 20:25This is relatively simple. Most likely, an older development borders the area, where only pitched roof houses exist, as was the case here. The intention was probably to create a "smooth transition" and accommodate those who were only allowed to build pitched roofs at the time...
Anyone who wants to file a complaint, go ahead. If the plots are allocated by the municipality you are complaining against, you can guess who definitely won’t get a plot...
Here, the roof ridge height is measured from the middle of the street boundary line...
Anyone who wants to file a complaint, go ahead. If the plots are allocated by the municipality you are complaining against, you can guess who definitely won’t get a plot...
Here, the roof ridge height is measured from the middle of the street boundary line...
MachsSelbst schrieb:
It’s relatively simple. Most likely, an older residential area with only gable roof houses borders the site, which was the case here. The idea was probably to create a "smooth transition" and accommodate those who were only allowed to build gable roofs back then...That, for example, would be such a legitimate reason.https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
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11ant schrieb:
I don’t understand the different ridge heights since the building area is almost flat.It’s similar for us. Not the eaves height, but the roof pitch: bungalows in the south (explicitly mentioned), gable roofs in the middle, and cube-shaped buildings in the north (not two-story, but flat roof at a height of 7.80m (26 feet), single-story). A proper arrangement considering the optimal sun exposure across the entire development area._Jannika_ schrieb:
how low the knee wall will be with an eaves height of 4.50m (15 feet) and whether we might rather prefer WA2 zoning and a two-story house.That depends on what you want and your needs. There’s no information about that. We are two people and feel very comfortable in a single-story house. If you dream of a gallery room, then you want an attic. If there are four of you, a townhouse of about 150-160sqm (1600-1700 sqft) works well. Then you lose the cozy feeling of the attic. If you want a vegetable garden, the garden area should be larger. That again depends on whether you choose single or two-story. At 10 meters (33 feet) height you get a tall building if you plan a two-story with roof space. Etc. There’s no general advice to give. Both types of living spaces have potential. For example, 10, 11, 14 each have great potential. Ultimately, you can build well on any plot, even with orientations that don’t seem ideal at first.
_Jannika_ schrieb:
One question currently on our mind is whether the southwest orientation of the initially mentioned plots leads to an uncomfortably hot terrace in summer,Yes, without an awning or shading it’s almost unbearable. Nevertheless, it’s always the favorite with standard floor plans (terrace by the large windows). If I were to build again, I would put a terrace on the northwest side. Still, I would want most windows on the south side as well as a terrace there. That terrace can also be on the west side. It always depends on the floor plan; one doesn’t exclude the other.You asked this in July: in the meantime, I have placed “my house” on every plot. Have you done something similar for some plots?
_Jannika_ schrieb:
would like to create a (small) vegetable garden with a greenhouse, and thought a southern orientation would be advantageous.The southern orientation can also be at the corner of the plot on the east or west side.I advise you to sketch out your ideas on several plots: the house footprint with terrace and entrance, two parking spaces with courtyard and driveway, plus a garden with greenhouse and a small vegetable patch. That can be done in one evening. Then you will see each plot’s potential.
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_Jannika_13 Oct 2024 15:0111ant schrieb:
In a constitutional state, a layperson, in their role as a citizen, should not have to make assumptions but instead be provided with a comprehensible basis for administrative acts. A zoning plan must include a justification; such details need to be included (only WHAT in the "textual provisions," but also WHY in the "justification"). Otherwise, the zoning plan can be challenged. Thanks for the hint, I have now reviewed the justification of the zoning plan, and it is indeed as @MachsSelbst described. It borders an old development area, and the subdivision was made to allow for "moderate densification with two-story buildings."
11ant, post:672028, member: 32750 schrieb:
Both eave heights are manageable. But you must not be arbitrarily restricted.
What an eave height is practically "worth" depends largely on the reference level. Assuming a reasonable "zero," then +4.50 m (14.8 feet) minus a floor height of, for example, 2.85 m (9.35 feet) results in a knee wall height of 1.65 m (5.4 feet). The knee wall basically also acts as a window division, so "favorable" knee wall heights are around 1.00 m (3.3 feet) plus or minus 0.20 m (8 inches). See also (external) "How the Knee Wall Influences the Window Design in the Attic." According to the zoning plan, the lower reference level is the upper edge of the improved access road assigned to the respective plot, measured at the centerline of the roadway, perpendicular to the main building. Since the development area is quite flat, this should hopefully be a reasonable "zero." With these figures, I can now better visualize the situation, and I have also reviewed the external article—thanks for that!
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_Jannika_13 Oct 2024 15:23ypg schrieb:
That really depends on what you want and your needs. There’s no information on that yet. We are two people and feel very comfortable in a single-story house.
If you dream of an open gallery space, then a loft or attic floor is the way to go. If you are four people, a townhouse or town villa with about 150-160sqm (1,615-1,722 sq ft) works quite well. However, you lose the cozy feeling of an attic. If you want a vegetable garden, the garden area can be larger. This again depends on whether it’s a single-story or two-story house. At 10 meters (33 feet), you end up with a tall house if it’s two stories with a roof area. Etc. You can’t make general recommendations here. Both layouts have their potential. For example, 10, 11, 14: lots of potential. In the end, you can build nicely on any plot, even with orientations that don’t seem ideal at first. That’s true, I hadn’t mentioned that before. We are currently two people, but children are planned. We expect to have two children’s rooms and a home office, in addition to the usual rooms you need. So around 150sqm (1,615 sq ft) should be suitable. The idea that having two stories reduces the footprint and therefore leaves more garden space is a good point.
ypg schrieb:
Yes, without an awning or shading, it’s almost unbearable. Still, it’s always the favorite in standard floor plans (a terrace next to large windows). If I were to build again, I would place a terrace on the northwest side. Still, southern-facing windows would be preferred, with a terrace there as well. The terrace could also be on the west side, depending on the floor plan. One doesn’t exclude the other. Thanks for sharing your experience! I have often read about the trend toward multiple terraces or different seating areas and think that makes a lot of sense. It also encourages deviating from the classic south-facing orientation.
ypg schrieb:
You asked this question in July: by now I would have designed “my house” for every plot. Have you done something similar for some of your plots? So far, we have done this for our two preferred plots (No. 8 and 22), but especially on the square-shaped plot, I found it hard to imagine anything practical. However, we will take another approach now and include more plots like the ones mentioned above. Until now, we have mainly focused on plot sizes, which is probably not the best criterion.
11ant schrieb:
The knee wall also serves as a sort of window divider, so "optimal" knee wall heights are generally around 100 plusminus 20. See also (external) "How the knee wall influences the window situation in the attic."Oops, it should correctly say: "120 plusminus 20" (so between 100 and 140). Sorry about that. I don’t want to mislead anyone._Jannika_ schrieb:
According to the development plan, the lower reference level is the top edge of the improved access road assigned to the respective plot, measured at the center of the roadway at a right angle to the main building. Since the building area is quite flat, hopefully this provides a reasonable "zero" level.The planners here can be quite sadistically creative; this definition is actually one of the better ones. In some cases, you really have to carefully navigate the details and turn the little crank all the way up to determine the valid value for your own plot._Jannika_ schrieb:
With these numbers, I can now imagine it much better, and I’ve read the external article as well, thanks!You’re welcome. Simply put, you can picture the knee wall, and consider the eaves height as the knee joint. Facade windows at the eaves side then only fit into the lower leg section, providing views only for crawling children and dachshunds after considering the sole plate, ring beam, and possibly the roller shutter box. In the upper leg, there are only roof windows, which, if you raise the knee wall too high, become sky view windows. To break through this window division, there are only two options: either dormers (commonly lumped together with gables but usually limited in length along the eaves) or windows that follow the wall-roof angle (difficult to design and install, and practically only found in premium product lines).https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
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