Hello everyone,
In about three weeks, we are supposed to finalize our electrical planning on site. Unfortunately, our electrician is somewhat old-fashioned, which makes it difficult for me to collaboratively plan a future-proof electrical setup with him. Therefore, I am currently educating myself to ensure that the networking in our single-family home is fundamentally future-proof.
Basically, it’s about the LAN network... LAN wall outlets are relatively expensive, so proper planning is even more important.
About us:
- Mid to late 20s – couple without children. Planning for 2 children in the near future.
- Single-family house with a usable basement, 2 full floors, and fully equipped with concrete ceilings
- Utility room in the basement with air-to-water heat pump, ventilation system, photovoltaic system
- The router is planned to be located in the office on the ground floor
- The upper floor includes bathroom / bedroom / 2 children’s rooms
- No satellite dish or cable TV — we will use Internet TV exclusively!
Now, I am struggling to network our single-family home sensibly but as cost-effectively as possible.
I have the following questions:
1. Slightly off-topic: In the living room, I would like to have an in-wall conduit installed on the TV wall (the TV will be wall-mounted) so that no cables are visible. Is this sensible and affordable? I will get exact prices from my electrician if this makes sense at all. Would it also make sense to install power outlets at TV height? How do you plan the connections on your media wall reasonably? What should be considered?
Since we plan to use a Magenta TV box and thus IP-TV, a total of four LAN ports in the living room area would presumably be useful, right?
2. How many LAN outlets and especially where should LAN outlets be installed? Mainly: which cable? Is CAT6 sufficient?
→ Such a double LAN outlet certainly costs close to €200, so planning must be really sensible.
Is it really necessary to install 2 double LAN outlets in each children’s room? I always wonder: what is actually going to be plugged in there?
One port for the TV and one port for a multimedia device should be enough, right? So four connections would probably be overkill, correct?
The fact is: It will certainly take years or decades before our children actually use these outlets... Who knows what changes might happen by then? Therefore, could we not cost-effectively use empty conduits (empty pipes) instead?
Is it also possible to “branch off” from an existing double outlet afterward to add more ports for the room? What should be considered here? Or should we consider having an empty conduit prepared in another spot in the room so that a socket can be installed later?
3. How do you solve the “router problem”? Should the one router be placed in the office (ground floor) with LAN outlets in the existing bedrooms upstairs to ensure a stable LAN connection? Or is a router upstairs absolutely necessary?
4. How important are LAN outlets in the utility room? Should the router possibly even be located in the utility room? Because of the concrete ceiling between basement and ground floor, a second router would almost certainly be needed. How should this situation be handled with a basement?
5. What do you think about installing empty conduits for CAT cables in the kitchen / hallway etc. to enable later retrofitting? Is this relatively affordable in new builds?
I would appreciate any feedback so we can make the best possible plans 🙂
In about three weeks, we are supposed to finalize our electrical planning on site. Unfortunately, our electrician is somewhat old-fashioned, which makes it difficult for me to collaboratively plan a future-proof electrical setup with him. Therefore, I am currently educating myself to ensure that the networking in our single-family home is fundamentally future-proof.
Basically, it’s about the LAN network... LAN wall outlets are relatively expensive, so proper planning is even more important.
About us:
- Mid to late 20s – couple without children. Planning for 2 children in the near future.
- Single-family house with a usable basement, 2 full floors, and fully equipped with concrete ceilings
- Utility room in the basement with air-to-water heat pump, ventilation system, photovoltaic system
- The router is planned to be located in the office on the ground floor
- The upper floor includes bathroom / bedroom / 2 children’s rooms
- No satellite dish or cable TV — we will use Internet TV exclusively!
Now, I am struggling to network our single-family home sensibly but as cost-effectively as possible.
I have the following questions:
1. Slightly off-topic: In the living room, I would like to have an in-wall conduit installed on the TV wall (the TV will be wall-mounted) so that no cables are visible. Is this sensible and affordable? I will get exact prices from my electrician if this makes sense at all. Would it also make sense to install power outlets at TV height? How do you plan the connections on your media wall reasonably? What should be considered?
Since we plan to use a Magenta TV box and thus IP-TV, a total of four LAN ports in the living room area would presumably be useful, right?
2. How many LAN outlets and especially where should LAN outlets be installed? Mainly: which cable? Is CAT6 sufficient?
→ Such a double LAN outlet certainly costs close to €200, so planning must be really sensible.
Is it really necessary to install 2 double LAN outlets in each children’s room? I always wonder: what is actually going to be plugged in there?
One port for the TV and one port for a multimedia device should be enough, right? So four connections would probably be overkill, correct?
The fact is: It will certainly take years or decades before our children actually use these outlets... Who knows what changes might happen by then? Therefore, could we not cost-effectively use empty conduits (empty pipes) instead?
Is it also possible to “branch off” from an existing double outlet afterward to add more ports for the room? What should be considered here? Or should we consider having an empty conduit prepared in another spot in the room so that a socket can be installed later?
3. How do you solve the “router problem”? Should the one router be placed in the office (ground floor) with LAN outlets in the existing bedrooms upstairs to ensure a stable LAN connection? Or is a router upstairs absolutely necessary?
4. How important are LAN outlets in the utility room? Should the router possibly even be located in the utility room? Because of the concrete ceiling between basement and ground floor, a second router would almost certainly be needed. How should this situation be handled with a basement?
5. What do you think about installing empty conduits for CAT cables in the kitchen / hallway etc. to enable later retrofitting? Is this relatively affordable in new builds?
I would appreciate any feedback so we can make the best possible plans 🙂
xMisterDx schrieb:
If that makes you happy, then it’s fine...
There are people who drive classic cars, would never get into a smart car with a bunch of assistants, and enjoy life...
However, I would never think of calling those people naive or silly.
But apparently, that seems to be the norm here. If you don’t want KNX, you must not know anything, right? 😉So, you would prefer conventional electrical systems for nostalgic reasons or because you like the look of analog switch panels on the walls? 😉
Otherwise, if we must stick to car comparisons, I’d say conventional electrical systems are more like a 10-20 year old diesel car than a beautiful classic car :p
X
xMisterDx8 Aug 2022 13:40Gudeen. schrieb:
So, you’d prefer traditional electrical wiring for nostalgic reasons or because of the nice analog switch clusters on the walls? 😉
Otherwise, if we must have car comparisons, I’d liken conventional wiring more to a 10-20 year old diesel than to a classic vintage car:p Fine by me. However, that 20-year-old diesel is still running and will probably keep running longer than my state-of-the-art 2020 Seat Leon, where I can no longer control the ventilation if the central control panel fails. That’s already happened three times and it’s really frustrating. Or where just the transmission replacement costs me or the leasing company 5,000-6,000 EUR, because it’s a 7-speed DSG instead of a 5-speed manual for 500 EUR from the “junkyard”...
What annoys me is being called stupid here just because I don’t see KNX as the holy grail 😉
I automate industrial systems every day… lack of competence is hardly the issue with me…
The issue is not necessarily that alternatives are not allowed or not desired, but rather that many people make claims without being able to back them up with solid evidence. In the home automation world, there are certainly other good options besides KNX, but unfortunately, discussions often veer off into an unobjective direction because people simply lack a proper understanding of KNX. THAT is unfortunate and deserves criticism—not the fact that there are other systems besides KNX. It’s always the same incorrect “arguments” against KNX, and that tends to trigger some of us here 🙂
M
motorradsilke8 Aug 2022 14:06Gudeen. schrieb:
So, you mean you prefer traditional electrical wiring for nostalgic reasons or because you like the look of the numerous analog switches on the walls? 😉
Otherwise, if we must use car comparisons, I would compare conventional wiring more to a 10-20 year old diesel than to a classic vintage car :p That said, I would always prefer a 10-year-old diesel over modern cars that control me in every aspect. It’s quite similar with home automation; there are some things I can imagine automating, and others not at all. Unfortunately, you often get labelled as naive or foolish just because you have different ideas.
xMisterDx schrieb:
What annoys me is being treated like an idiot here just because I don’t consider KNX the holy grail 😉 If only the holy grail actually existed 😉 I think it’s important to consider many factors: knowledge, curiosity, comfort, time, and money.
Some already consider controlling lighting with motion sensors INSIDE THE HOUSE(!) as smart home. I see myself as more advanced than a hobbyist.
I’m currently in the process of planning and researching. I have experience with KNX, Loxone, DALI. I’m also familiar with open-source stuff (Shelly, etc.), Zigbee, Z-Wave, Home Assistant, and so on.
Each option has its pros and cons. For me, the question is not really which system to choose, but how to integrate all the systems I can use effectively.
Not everyone can or wants to do this, so many people just opt for a single system solution.
I’ve thought for a long time about which bus system to use—or whether I need one at all. I still can’t give a final answer.
xMisterDx schrieb:
It’s hardly due to a lack of competence on my part...Still, I wouldn’t let an orthopedic surgeon—no matter how reputable—near my testicles if I ever needed surgery there...