ᐅ Planning a Controlled Residential Ventilation System through a Local Heating and Plumbing Company
Created on: 3 May 2022 21:31
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Hausmax123
Hello, after a long back and forth, I’ve almost convinced my wife that we need a mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery. Her main concerns are the dry air in winter and noise levels. Today, we had a conversation with the local heating/plumbing company that works with our general contractor. Unfortunately, the plumber reinforced my wife’s worries, saying that dry air is indeed a bigger issue and, in response to my question about the possibility of an enthalpy heat exchanger, he said it would barely make a difference and would just be an unnecessary expense.
My biggest fear is actually a poorly planned mechanical ventilation system (noise, drafts, etc.), and I feel there is a real chance of that happening with this company. They offered us a Helios EC 370w ventilation system. From what I’ve found about this unit, it seems to be an older model and probably undersized for our house (202m² (2174 sq ft) over 2 full floors). When I asked, the plumber said there is enough capacity and that we definitely wouldn’t hear any noise. The design of the exhaust and supply air ducts will be done by the local company. According to the plumber, they have a lot of experience with mechanical ventilation systems and have never had issues with noise so far. I had understood that the planning is usually done by major companies (Zehnder, Helios, etc.) and only the installation is handled by the heating/plumbing company, which I would prefer much more.
How was it handled in your cases? Who planned the system? Does anyone know the Helios unit, and is it adequately sized for our house if you want to avoid noise?
My biggest fear is actually a poorly planned mechanical ventilation system (noise, drafts, etc.), and I feel there is a real chance of that happening with this company. They offered us a Helios EC 370w ventilation system. From what I’ve found about this unit, it seems to be an older model and probably undersized for our house (202m² (2174 sq ft) over 2 full floors). When I asked, the plumber said there is enough capacity and that we definitely wouldn’t hear any noise. The design of the exhaust and supply air ducts will be done by the local company. According to the plumber, they have a lot of experience with mechanical ventilation systems and have never had issues with noise so far. I had understood that the planning is usually done by major companies (Zehnder, Helios, etc.) and only the installation is handled by the heating/plumbing company, which I would prefer much more.
How was it handled in your cases? Who planned the system? Does anyone know the Helios unit, and is it adequately sized for our house if you want to avoid noise?
Hello, I have a central Maico mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery but without an enthalpy exchanger (missed ordering it together). I have been living here since September 2021, and the humidity has never dropped below 42% RH, with current values ranging from just over 50% to nearly 60%. The mechanical ventilation is inaudible because I never activate the “party mode.”
Due to my talent for killing houseplants by either overwatering or underwatering, I only have three mini cacti in the bathroom and no other greenery (except in the refrigerator). The only measure I take to increase humidity is to leave the bathroom door slightly open after showering.
Due to my talent for killing houseplants by either overwatering or underwatering, I only have three mini cacti in the bathroom and no other greenery (except in the refrigerator). The only measure I take to increase humidity is to leave the bathroom door slightly open after showering.
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Hausmax12320 May 2022 08:35We are currently still in the floor plan design phase or just about to submit the building permit/planning permission application. The mechanical ventilation with heat recovery can still be included in the planning. I will not have the system designed by the local company, as I doubt their expertise in this area due to statements like “enthalpy exchangers don’t help” and I am concerned about ending up with a noisy, poorly planned mechanical ventilation system. I don’t feel confident enough to plan it myself, so I am considering having the design done either by one of the manufacturers (e.g. Zehnder or Maico) or finding someone who specializes in mechanical ventilation system design. For the installation, I would then have to find a local company again, which, as far as I understand, does not carry as much risk of errors...
Has anyone had experience with having the system design and installation handled by different companies?
Has anyone had experience with having the system design and installation handled by different companies?
So you want a mechanical ventilation with heat recovery (MVHR) system in a house where you don’t trust the builder to plan one properly. For this purpose, a specialist planner with expertise in MVHR is supposed to get involved in the builder’s planned ceiling construction, and either this planner or a third party will carry out the installation. Whether you will still be happy with yourself afterwards, I leave that as a question mark; at least you might be inclined to form a support group with @R.Hotzenplotz (who has not exactly provided a warning example regarding MVHR here, but his kitchen extractor hood apparently was no easy task either) ;-)
Alright then (or not so alright, but doable with a lot of praying), let’s walk through the scenario – to the best of my recollection (and apart from kitchen and financing threads I actually know almost all threads here since I joined, and I had looked back about a year) unfortunately without any “role models” in this (and also in the green) forum:
So we start from the ceiling as planned so far. MVHR ducts don’t weigh much, so you won’t have to reinforce the ceiling structure for that. In the worst case, the floor buildup above the ceiling could become thicker, which would affect the staircase – but only linearly, since it would be the same on both floors, so the story height measured from the finished floor top of the ground floor to the finished floor top of the upper floor stays the same – however, the staircase would have to be installed correspondingly higher. The previously unplanned MVHR system could also have consequences for the underside of the ceiling. This effect might be minimized if coordinated, for example with ceiling spotlights or access point outlets. In any case, it is urgent that before ordering the ceiling and planning the reinforcement, it is clear at which points the MVHR planner intends ceiling penetrations. And I would strongly advise you to integrate the MVHR installation into the construction site schedule. If you treat MVHR as a “the general contractor has nothing to do with this” trade, the measure will end up being a perfect self-inflicted headache!
Keep in mind: we are talking here about a few centimeters of potential loss in clear ceiling height – so avoid (unless your national building code would require it) increasing the story height, as this would mess up the staircase planning and possibly ruin the layout in crucial places (a classic example: distance between staircase exit and bathroom door frame).
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
Alright then (or not so alright, but doable with a lot of praying), let’s walk through the scenario – to the best of my recollection (and apart from kitchen and financing threads I actually know almost all threads here since I joined, and I had looked back about a year) unfortunately without any “role models” in this (and also in the green) forum:
So we start from the ceiling as planned so far. MVHR ducts don’t weigh much, so you won’t have to reinforce the ceiling structure for that. In the worst case, the floor buildup above the ceiling could become thicker, which would affect the staircase – but only linearly, since it would be the same on both floors, so the story height measured from the finished floor top of the ground floor to the finished floor top of the upper floor stays the same – however, the staircase would have to be installed correspondingly higher. The previously unplanned MVHR system could also have consequences for the underside of the ceiling. This effect might be minimized if coordinated, for example with ceiling spotlights or access point outlets. In any case, it is urgent that before ordering the ceiling and planning the reinforcement, it is clear at which points the MVHR planner intends ceiling penetrations. And I would strongly advise you to integrate the MVHR installation into the construction site schedule. If you treat MVHR as a “the general contractor has nothing to do with this” trade, the measure will end up being a perfect self-inflicted headache!
Keep in mind: we are talking here about a few centimeters of potential loss in clear ceiling height – so avoid (unless your national building code would require it) increasing the story height, as this would mess up the staircase planning and possibly ruin the layout in crucial places (a classic example: distance between staircase exit and bathroom door frame).
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
H
Hausmax12323 May 2022 20:09@11ant thanks for your input. The controlled residential ventilation system planning will be coordinated with the general contractor, and the detailed design will only be approved once the controlled ventilation planning is finalized and ceiling penetrations and ductwork are planned. For the heating/plumbing trade, we have freedom to choose the supplier anyway. The controlled ventilation planning is now to be handled by a specialist planner, and installation will be done by the company responsible for the heating/plumbing trade. Let’s see how that works out. I have read several times that some people install the controlled ventilation system themselves, so I assume that the heating/plumbing company (which also offers controlled ventilation systems) can install a controlled ventilation system designed by an external planner...
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Gecko192725 May 2022 12:21Hausmax123 schrieb:
@11ant thanks for your input. The mechanical ventilation planning will be coordinated with the general contractor and the detailed construction planning will only be approved once the mechanical ventilation planning is finalized and ceiling penetrations and ducts are planned. For the heating/plumbing trade, we have free choice of providers anyway. The mechanical ventilation planning is now supposed to be done by a specialist planner, and the installation by the company handling the heating/plumbing trade. Let’s see how that works out. I’ve read several times now that some people even do the installation of the mechanical ventilation themselves, so I assume that the heating/plumbing company (which also offers mechanical ventilation) can install a mechanical ventilation system planned by an external planner...Back then, I unfortunately did not receive any planning from the ventilation system manufacturers. Many heating engineers have their mechanical ventilation systems planned by the manufacturer, but it seems they don’t want to work with private clients. I personally consider it disadvantageous to have planning and installation carried out by two different companies for a small scope of work like mechanical ventilation. There is a lot that can still go wrong during installation, especially if the planning comes from a third party. Isn’t it possible to find a heating engineer who can handle the planning or arrange for it to be done?
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