ᐅ Planning: Requirement for Two Full Stories – Defining When a Story Counts as Full
Created on: 26 Jun 2012 15:10
S
saschixHello everyone,
due to a current planning issue, I came across this forum and would appreciate your help with the following question related to our ongoing building project:
We have the opportunity to purchase a plot in an old development area. The zoning plan dates back to around 1970, and the old state building regulations of Baden-Württemberg from 1964 apply. The current state building regulations can be found online, but unfortunately, the old ones cannot. We are interested in whether anyone knows how the 1964 regulations define when a story counts as a full floor. The old zoning plan requires at least two full floors, which we might not meet due to an extension of a conservatory at ground level.
Thank you in advance for your efforts and best regards,
Sascha
due to a current planning issue, I came across this forum and would appreciate your help with the following question related to our ongoing building project:
We have the opportunity to purchase a plot in an old development area. The zoning plan dates back to around 1970, and the old state building regulations of Baden-Württemberg from 1964 apply. The current state building regulations can be found online, but unfortunately, the old ones cannot. We are interested in whether anyone knows how the 1964 regulations define when a story counts as a full floor. The old zoning plan requires at least two full floors, which we might not meet due to an extension of a conservatory at ground level.
Thank you in advance for your efforts and best regards,
Sascha
Hello Sascha,
old zoning plans are usually ignored anyway. By now, there are probably numerous exemptions that you can reference as comparable cases. Take a look at what the neighbors have built – typically, you are allowed to build similarly. If everyone still adheres to the old zoning plan, the local building authority can surely help. They should know what is possible within the building permit exemption process (if it’s a qualified zoning plan and not just a building line plan). We have zoning plans from 1950 that aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on. I’m confused about what the conservatory extension on the ground floor has to do with the count of full stories? Conservatories are usually considered subordinate structures and are not counted as full stories, right? I’m not an expert, but that’s how it was handled for us.
Best regards
old zoning plans are usually ignored anyway. By now, there are probably numerous exemptions that you can reference as comparable cases. Take a look at what the neighbors have built – typically, you are allowed to build similarly. If everyone still adheres to the old zoning plan, the local building authority can surely help. They should know what is possible within the building permit exemption process (if it’s a qualified zoning plan and not just a building line plan). We have zoning plans from 1950 that aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on. I’m confused about what the conservatory extension on the ground floor has to do with the count of full stories? Conservatories are usually considered subordinate structures and are not counted as full stories, right? I’m not an expert, but that’s how it was handled for us.
Best regards
If everyone still follows the old development plan, the municipal building authority should be able to assist. They need to know what is possible within the permit exemption process (if it is a qualified development plan and not a building line plan).
As Wastl already mentioned, the people at the building authority will help you here.
We did it by roughly sketching our ideas (house and location on the plot) and showing them to the building authority / city planning in advance. They also provide support with questions regarding land use.
This way, you will at least have certainty whether your project is feasible.
Best regards
As Wastl already mentioned, the people at the building authority will help you here.
We did it by roughly sketching our ideas (house and location on the plot) and showing them to the building authority / city planning in advance. They also provide support with questions regarding land use.
This way, you will at least have certainty whether your project is feasible.
Best regards
B
Bauexperte30 Jun 2012 14:08Hello,
You should quickly forget the statement "such old development plans are usually ignored anyway" because it does not reflect actual practice. Of course, development plans remain valid—even after many years—unless the municipality officially confirms their suspension!
As I understand it, you are building a single-storey house and have planned a conservatory-like structure on the ground floor, more like a bay window? You have an architect, right? – this should also be the case with a general contractor. It should therefore be straightforward to raise the knee wall in the attic so that you "mathematically" count as a two-storey building; the ridge and eave heights should be specified accordingly. By the way, in my opinion, the state building code has not changed regarding the nationwide interpretation of a two-storey building: essentially, if the attic floor space is calculated as more than 75% of the ground floor footprint, the building is considered two-storey (this applies nationwide).
Alternatively, you can follow the suggestion from the previous poster and visit the planning office responsible for you with your plans to discuss the building project. Usually, they are open to the public on Thursdays.
Kind regards
saschix schrieb:
The current state building code can be found online, but unfortunately not the old one. We want to know if anyone knows how, according to the old state building code from 1964, it is regulated when a storey is considered a full storey. The old development plan requires at least two full storeys, which we might not achieve due to a conservatory extension on the ground floor.
You should quickly forget the statement "such old development plans are usually ignored anyway" because it does not reflect actual practice. Of course, development plans remain valid—even after many years—unless the municipality officially confirms their suspension!
As I understand it, you are building a single-storey house and have planned a conservatory-like structure on the ground floor, more like a bay window? You have an architect, right? – this should also be the case with a general contractor. It should therefore be straightforward to raise the knee wall in the attic so that you "mathematically" count as a two-storey building; the ridge and eave heights should be specified accordingly. By the way, in my opinion, the state building code has not changed regarding the nationwide interpretation of a two-storey building: essentially, if the attic floor space is calculated as more than 75% of the ground floor footprint, the building is considered two-storey (this applies nationwide).
Alternatively, you can follow the suggestion from the previous poster and visit the planning office responsible for you with your plans to discuss the building project. Usually, they are open to the public on Thursdays.
Kind regards
Hello both, and thanks first of all for your replies!
Is there a source for this statement? Because that might actually be the case!
Thanks and best regards
Sascha
Bauexperte schrieb:
Hello,
By the way, in my opinion there have been no changes in the state building regulations regarding the (nationwide valid) interpretation of a two-story building: in essence, it states that if the attic floor (DG) has more than 75% of the ground floor (EG) area calculated, the building is considered a two-story building (valid nationwide).
Is there a source for this statement? Because that might actually be the case!
Thanks and best regards
Sascha
B
Bauexperte1 Jul 2012 19:27Hello,
§ 2 Terms:
(6) Full stories are floors that extend more than 1.4 m (4.6 feet) above the average ground level measured at the building’s corners and have a height of at least 2.3 m (7.5 feet) measured from the top edge of the floor to the top edge of the floor above or to the top edge of the roof covering of the roof above. The average ground level is calculated as the arithmetic mean of the ground elevation at the building’s corners. The following are not considered full stories:
1. Floors used exclusively for housing building services equipment and heating systems,
2. Top floors where the height of 2.3 m (7.5 feet) is present on less than three quarters of the floor area of the story below.
Cavities between the top floor ceiling and the roof with a clear height less than required for habitable rooms according to § 34 paragraph 1, as well as open galleries up to a floor area of 20 m² (215 square feet), are disregarded.
Kind regards
saschix schrieb:A look into the Building Regulations of Baden-Württemberg would have been enough...
Is there a source for this statement?? That might actually be fulfilled!
§ 2 Terms:
(6) Full stories are floors that extend more than 1.4 m (4.6 feet) above the average ground level measured at the building’s corners and have a height of at least 2.3 m (7.5 feet) measured from the top edge of the floor to the top edge of the floor above or to the top edge of the roof covering of the roof above. The average ground level is calculated as the arithmetic mean of the ground elevation at the building’s corners. The following are not considered full stories:
1. Floors used exclusively for housing building services equipment and heating systems,
2. Top floors where the height of 2.3 m (7.5 feet) is present on less than three quarters of the floor area of the story below.
Cavities between the top floor ceiling and the roof with a clear height less than required for habitable rooms according to § 34 paragraph 1, as well as open galleries up to a floor area of 20 m² (215 square feet), are disregarded.
Kind regards
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