ᐅ Planned Throttling of Electric Vehicle Chargers and Heat Pumps
Created on: 15 Mar 2023 10:16
S
sub-xero
Hello dear photovoltaic enthusiasts,
Like many others, I had my new build equipped one year ago with a photovoltaic system, battery storage, heat pump, and electric vehicle charger. Everything is running to my highest satisfaction, and on average over the year, I am about 75% self-sufficient (including electricity for the heat pump).
Now, the politicians in our so-called banana republic Germany have come up with the brilliant idea to throttle the power supply for heat pumps and electric vehicle chargers starting in 2024. The reason is that our power grids would be completely overloaded with the expected development (electric cars and heat pumps). I understand that the promotion of electric vehicles and heat pumps does not fit well with the unplanned and poorly thought-out implementation of renewable energy, and therefore, shortages are likely to occur.
In this context, I am interested in how this throttling would actually be implemented in practice. Here are a few questions for open discussion:
The electricity I draw from the grid cannot be divided into "electricity for the EV charger," "electricity for the heat pump," "electricity for the household," etc. It is a total amount of X kW. Statements like:
According to the concept of the Federal Network Agency, if a shortage threatens, for example, EV chargers or heat pumps should be throttled down to a power of 3.7 kilowatts to prevent an overload.
are, in my view, completely unrealistic. The devices are not supplied individually from the grid. In a worst-case scenario, there would then be no electricity left for the freezer or the computer. That is obviously not acceptable.
Grid operators want to be able to "unilaterally and indefinitely" throttle devices in case of an impending grid overload. The planned regulation applies only to households that have installed, for example, an EV charger or a heat pump. The household itself would remain unaffected by a possible short-term dimming. The refrigerator, washing machine, and internet would continue to operate as usual.
How is this supposed to work technically?
In any case, the usefulness of installing heat pumps in houses without photovoltaic systems is questionable.
If private EV chargers are throttled, the trend toward e-mobility in Germany will definitely be further hindered. (Charging at 3.7 kW is possible and sufficient in many cases, but firstly, the power loss is relatively high, and secondly, in some situations, one wants to be able to charge faster with 11 kW.)
Like many others, I had my new build equipped one year ago with a photovoltaic system, battery storage, heat pump, and electric vehicle charger. Everything is running to my highest satisfaction, and on average over the year, I am about 75% self-sufficient (including electricity for the heat pump).
Now, the politicians in our so-called banana republic Germany have come up with the brilliant idea to throttle the power supply for heat pumps and electric vehicle chargers starting in 2024. The reason is that our power grids would be completely overloaded with the expected development (electric cars and heat pumps). I understand that the promotion of electric vehicles and heat pumps does not fit well with the unplanned and poorly thought-out implementation of renewable energy, and therefore, shortages are likely to occur.
In this context, I am interested in how this throttling would actually be implemented in practice. Here are a few questions for open discussion:
The electricity I draw from the grid cannot be divided into "electricity for the EV charger," "electricity for the heat pump," "electricity for the household," etc. It is a total amount of X kW. Statements like:
According to the concept of the Federal Network Agency, if a shortage threatens, for example, EV chargers or heat pumps should be throttled down to a power of 3.7 kilowatts to prevent an overload.
are, in my view, completely unrealistic. The devices are not supplied individually from the grid. In a worst-case scenario, there would then be no electricity left for the freezer or the computer. That is obviously not acceptable.
Grid operators want to be able to "unilaterally and indefinitely" throttle devices in case of an impending grid overload. The planned regulation applies only to households that have installed, for example, an EV charger or a heat pump. The household itself would remain unaffected by a possible short-term dimming. The refrigerator, washing machine, and internet would continue to operate as usual.
How is this supposed to work technically?
In any case, the usefulness of installing heat pumps in houses without photovoltaic systems is questionable.
If private EV chargers are throttled, the trend toward e-mobility in Germany will definitely be further hindered. (Charging at 3.7 kW is possible and sufficient in many cases, but firstly, the power loss is relatively high, and secondly, in some situations, one wants to be able to charge faster with 11 kW.)
WilderSueden schrieb:
If you have a second meter for the heat pump, it can be switched off during peak load periods.
This kind of shutdown already exists in practice today. That’s how it looks. We have the heat pump connected to a second meter with a cheaper heat pump tariff (16 cents).
Our power is cut off three times a day: once for 30 minutes in the morning, once for 60 minutes at midday, and once for 30 minutes in the afternoon.
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Bausparfuchs15 Mar 2023 13:04The actual problem is the power grids, not even the electricity itself. But the grid cables can only carry a limited amount of electrical power.
It simply won’t work. In recent years, almost every city and village in Germany has been excavated to install fiber optic cables. However, upgrading or installing more powerful power cables at the same time has been neglected. Efficiency and forward-looking planning simply aren’t the strengths of the German government.
So, most likely, the plan will be to spend 20 years planning and then 20 years installing cables with higher capacity.
It will be difficult anyway, since many raw materials like copper and aluminum were supplied by the geopolitical adversary, who is now considered hostile.
If we look at a new residential development, the main cable and the connections to individual houses are not designed to handle the required power. These areas often have mostly heat pumps and many electric vehicles. If each household consumes 20 kW and there are, say, 30 or more households, it simply won’t work because it was never planned for.
It makes a real difference whether I heat my apartment building in winter with 50 kW of electricity or with 50 kW of oil or gas.
Anyone who wants to electrify both heat generation and mobility at the same time has to make sure that it actually works technically. And right now, it does not.
It simply won’t work. In recent years, almost every city and village in Germany has been excavated to install fiber optic cables. However, upgrading or installing more powerful power cables at the same time has been neglected. Efficiency and forward-looking planning simply aren’t the strengths of the German government.
So, most likely, the plan will be to spend 20 years planning and then 20 years installing cables with higher capacity.
It will be difficult anyway, since many raw materials like copper and aluminum were supplied by the geopolitical adversary, who is now considered hostile.
If we look at a new residential development, the main cable and the connections to individual houses are not designed to handle the required power. These areas often have mostly heat pumps and many electric vehicles. If each household consumes 20 kW and there are, say, 30 or more households, it simply won’t work because it was never planned for.
It makes a real difference whether I heat my apartment building in winter with 50 kW of electricity or with 50 kW of oil or gas.
Anyone who wants to electrify both heat generation and mobility at the same time has to make sure that it actually works technically. And right now, it does not.
R
RotorMotor15 Mar 2023 13:48Bausparfuchs schrieb:
They missed the chance to install new, higher-capacity power cables at the same time. Why do you think the problem lies with the "power cable networks"?
So far, I’ve only heard about issues with the transformer stations, and about sufficient electricity availability, but the cables on site?
In the past, systems were often designed around storage heaters, instantaneous water heaters, and similar appliances.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
If we look at such a new housing development, the main cable and the distribution to the individual homes can’t handle the power demand. Especially in areas with mostly heat pumps and many electric cars. If each household draws 20 kW and there are 30 or more households, it just won’t work, because it was never designed for that. Then it’s great that soon it will be possible to throttle down to 3 kW if needed! 🙂
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
There’s a big difference between heating my apartment building with 50 kW of electricity or 50 kW of oil or gas.
So anyone who wants to electrify both heating and mobility at the same time has to ensure the technical infrastructure can handle it. Because right now, it doesn’t. When done properly, it works just fine. From 50 kW of oil or gas heating, insulation reduces the demand to about 25 kW, and with a heat pump operating at a coefficient of performance of 4, that drops to just 6 kW.
So, it’s not really a problem. They just must not miss the chance to make the system controllable.
I find it unfortunate how many charging stations were installed with heavy subsidies but without any benefit to the wider community.
There should have been requirements for control options or public use from the start.
Our electrician just refused to install a small meter cabinet with only one meter slot. His reasoning: there will soon be a requirement for throttling, and he will have to come back and modify it again. To save us the costs, he installed a larger distribution cabinet, even though it currently only has one meter.
For now, the shutdown is compensated by favorable tariffs. Soon, this will no longer be the case...
For now, the shutdown is compensated by favorable tariffs. Soon, this will no longer be the case...
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RotorMotor15 Mar 2023 14:03sergutsh schrieb:
There will soon be a requirement for throttling, and for that, he will have to come back and modify it again. Hardly. Technically and space-wise, it is not always feasible.
I rather think that with smart metering systems becoming standard, time-based tariffs will be introduced.
It doesn’t really make sense to specifically subsidize electricity for cars or heat pumps.
The aim is actually to encourage lower consumption during certain times, when supply is limited, and in that case, it shouldn’t matter what type of load the consumer has.
W
WilderSueden15 Mar 2023 14:19RotorMotor schrieb:
It doesn’t really make sense to specifically subsidize electricity for cars or heat pumps. Not on its own. But if you have CO2 reduction targets for each sector and treat electricity from the socket as CO2-free, then it does.
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