Hello everyone,
we are planning to build a 150 m² (1,615 sq ft) house and are currently optimizing our floor plan... Overall, we are quite happy with it, but there are still a few doubts.
I’m a bit uncertain about the following areas:
- Living room: Is the sofa placement very awkward? I’d prefer not to rotate it 90 degrees, as that would require placing the TV on the short window wall...
- Kitchen: Do we need a separate heating source, or will the living/dining area provide enough warmth for the kitchen? I can’t immediately think of a good spot to install a heater there.
- Pantry: Is it practical in this layout? Of course, the space with a width of 60 cm (24 inches) isn’t ideal, but could it still be used for spare chairs or similar items? Additionally, we want to store drinks, cordless vacuum cleaner, paper/plastic waste, baking trays, etc. — basically all things not used very often or too bulky for kitchen cabinets.
- Upstairs bathroom: I’d rather not fill the large room with very expensive bathroom cabinets, which is why I came up with the idea of the space behind the shower/bathtub. Is there enough room between the sink and the bathtub/shower for 2 to 4 people to move comfortably if needed? I’m quite enthusiastic about this idea. Previously, the sanitary fixtures were just placed around the edges and there wasn’t even space left for a cabinet.
If anyone feels like taking a look and sharing their thoughts, I’d really appreciate it!
Thank you,
hemali
The floor plan and measurements are approximate, please excuse the odd values!
Top is west, right is north, bottom is east, left is south.
The windows are not perfectly aligned vertically, but that’s not a concern for us since the sides of the house are barely visible from outside, so the asymmetry doesn’t bother us much.
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size: 800 m² (8,611 sq ft)
Slope: none
Site coverage ratio: -
Floor area ratio: -
Building envelope, setback lines, boundaries: -
Edge development: -
Number of parking spaces: -
Number of floors: 1.5
Roof type: gable roof, 45 degrees
Architectural style: classic/modern
Orientation: entrance east, terrace west
Maximum heights / limits: -
Additional requirements: -
Client requirements
Style, roof type, building type –
Basement, floors: no basement, 1.5 floors
Number of occupants, ages: 2 adults, 2 children (2 and 5 years old)
Space requirement on ground and upper floor: as shown in the floor plan
Office: family use or home office? No, filing cabinets in utility room
Guest bedrooms per year: negligible
Open or closed architecture: semi-open kitchen
Conservative or modern construction: -
Open kitchen, island: semi-open kitchen
Number of dining seats: 6, expandable
Fireplace: no
Music/Stereo wall: yes, preferably a whole wall with storage
Balcony, rooftop terrace: no
Garage, carport: no
Utility garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special features/daily routine –
House design
Planning origin: original developer plan, customized by us
What do you particularly like? Ground floor extra shower, pantry, large utility room, masonry shower upstairs, large bedrooms, upstairs storage room
What do you dislike? -
Cost estimate by architect/planner: not relevant
Personal price limit for house including equipment: not relevant
Preferred heating system: gas boiler + solar with 400-liter (105-gallon) water storage tank
If you had to give up certain details/add-ons:
- Could you do without: –
- Could you not do without: –
we are planning to build a 150 m² (1,615 sq ft) house and are currently optimizing our floor plan... Overall, we are quite happy with it, but there are still a few doubts.
I’m a bit uncertain about the following areas:
- Living room: Is the sofa placement very awkward? I’d prefer not to rotate it 90 degrees, as that would require placing the TV on the short window wall...
- Kitchen: Do we need a separate heating source, or will the living/dining area provide enough warmth for the kitchen? I can’t immediately think of a good spot to install a heater there.
- Pantry: Is it practical in this layout? Of course, the space with a width of 60 cm (24 inches) isn’t ideal, but could it still be used for spare chairs or similar items? Additionally, we want to store drinks, cordless vacuum cleaner, paper/plastic waste, baking trays, etc. — basically all things not used very often or too bulky for kitchen cabinets.
- Upstairs bathroom: I’d rather not fill the large room with very expensive bathroom cabinets, which is why I came up with the idea of the space behind the shower/bathtub. Is there enough room between the sink and the bathtub/shower for 2 to 4 people to move comfortably if needed? I’m quite enthusiastic about this idea. Previously, the sanitary fixtures were just placed around the edges and there wasn’t even space left for a cabinet.
If anyone feels like taking a look and sharing their thoughts, I’d really appreciate it!
Thank you,
hemali
The floor plan and measurements are approximate, please excuse the odd values!
Top is west, right is north, bottom is east, left is south.
The windows are not perfectly aligned vertically, but that’s not a concern for us since the sides of the house are barely visible from outside, so the asymmetry doesn’t bother us much.
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size: 800 m² (8,611 sq ft)
Slope: none
Site coverage ratio: -
Floor area ratio: -
Building envelope, setback lines, boundaries: -
Edge development: -
Number of parking spaces: -
Number of floors: 1.5
Roof type: gable roof, 45 degrees
Architectural style: classic/modern
Orientation: entrance east, terrace west
Maximum heights / limits: -
Additional requirements: -
Client requirements
Style, roof type, building type –
Basement, floors: no basement, 1.5 floors
Number of occupants, ages: 2 adults, 2 children (2 and 5 years old)
Space requirement on ground and upper floor: as shown in the floor plan
Office: family use or home office? No, filing cabinets in utility room
Guest bedrooms per year: negligible
Open or closed architecture: semi-open kitchen
Conservative or modern construction: -
Open kitchen, island: semi-open kitchen
Number of dining seats: 6, expandable
Fireplace: no
Music/Stereo wall: yes, preferably a whole wall with storage
Balcony, rooftop terrace: no
Garage, carport: no
Utility garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special features/daily routine –
House design
Planning origin: original developer plan, customized by us
What do you particularly like? Ground floor extra shower, pantry, large utility room, masonry shower upstairs, large bedrooms, upstairs storage room
What do you dislike? -
Cost estimate by architect/planner: not relevant
Personal price limit for house including equipment: not relevant
Preferred heating system: gas boiler + solar with 400-liter (105-gallon) water storage tank
If you had to give up certain details/add-ons:
- Could you do without: –
- Could you not do without: –
B
Bauexperte22 May 2016 10:41Good morning,
That can’t be the case, because you continue to write:
So it’s about reliable figures as a basis for your calculation, as is the case for most homebuilders. However, if your budget is really that tight, you should avoid these experiments:
Every modification costs money, a lot of money with this license provider:
I don’t know where exactly you want to build in NRW, but for example for the Rhein Kreis Neuss district, the price calculator on the provider’s website shows a price of EUR 160,000 for the standard house. However, a 148 sqm (1,593 sq ft) house cannot be built for that price in a realistic manner; not even in Münsterland, where construction costs are comparatively low.
Before you, in my opinion, start “tinkering” with the designs, you should first discuss the standard house with your provider and get a detailed price breakdown. You will quickly find that many features you consider standard must be purchased as extras at an additional cost. This also confirms that the prices on the provider’s website mainly serve to attract potential homebuilders and are mostly to be seen as base prices.
I would recommend getting a comparison offer; that would be important to me if the budget for the house build is indeed as tight as you describe.
Regards, Bauexperte
hemali2003 schrieb:
The costs are not relevant here.
That can’t be the case, because you continue to write:
hemali2003 schrieb:
Overall, our budget looks very tight, so we need to carefully check the affordability of all points and cannot afford an architect to redesign everything.
So it’s about reliable figures as a basis for your calculation, as is the case for most homebuilders. However, if your budget is really that tight, you should avoid these experiments:
hemali2003 schrieb:
We really liked the layout of this standard house type, so we didn’t make many changes.
Every modification costs money, a lot of money with this license provider:
hemali2003 schrieb:
Thanks! It’s the Mitwachshaus 148 by Town & Country, mirrored.
I don’t know where exactly you want to build in NRW, but for example for the Rhein Kreis Neuss district, the price calculator on the provider’s website shows a price of EUR 160,000 for the standard house. However, a 148 sqm (1,593 sq ft) house cannot be built for that price in a realistic manner; not even in Münsterland, where construction costs are comparatively low.
Before you, in my opinion, start “tinkering” with the designs, you should first discuss the standard house with your provider and get a detailed price breakdown. You will quickly find that many features you consider standard must be purchased as extras at an additional cost. This also confirms that the prices on the provider’s website mainly serve to attract potential homebuilders and are mostly to be seen as base prices.
I would recommend getting a comparison offer; that would be important to me if the budget for the house build is indeed as tight as you describe.
Regards, Bauexperte
H
hemali200322 May 2016 10:52We have discussed everything in detail and already priced all special requests. The floor plan changes, including structural calculations, have been factored in, so we have quite a bit of flexibility to make changes. Of course, extending a meter of wall costs extra, as do doors and, for example, an additional shower. But I'm aware of that.
The final selection of materials and fixtures has not taken place yet; that happens much later. However, I have reviewed all standard options, compared prices, and I feel I have a fairly good sense of planning certainty, at least within the usual limits when it comes to building a house.
Isn’t it acceptable to use more affordable, unremarkable standard options in some areas and invest a bit more where it really matters? Ultimately, the changes have to be "worth it to us." That seems logical, doesn’t it?
In this thread, my focus was not on the exact costs, but rather on the usability of the current floor plan. I only mentioned that we want to build economically so that no one insists I should include a central vacuum system or a sunroom.
Wow, you are quite harsh in your criticism here. Maybe I’m just sensitive...
The final selection of materials and fixtures has not taken place yet; that happens much later. However, I have reviewed all standard options, compared prices, and I feel I have a fairly good sense of planning certainty, at least within the usual limits when it comes to building a house.
Isn’t it acceptable to use more affordable, unremarkable standard options in some areas and invest a bit more where it really matters? Ultimately, the changes have to be "worth it to us." That seems logical, doesn’t it?
In this thread, my focus was not on the exact costs, but rather on the usability of the current floor plan. I only mentioned that we want to build economically so that no one insists I should include a central vacuum system or a sunroom.
Wow, you are quite harsh in your criticism here. Maybe I’m just sensitive...
B
Bauexperte22 May 2016 11:05Hello,
I assume you have chosen this provider because they seem to be cheaper on average compared to others. Since you also mentioned a tight budget – I may have misunderstood – I tried to point out the pitfalls to you. It would not be the first, nor the last time, that the final price ends up higher than those other providers after customizing according to your specific needs. This is simply because Stadt & Land focuses on their carefully calculated standard houses; any deviation from these raises the cost disproportionately.
Regards, Bauexperte
hemali2003 schrieb:This is not about what is allowed or not! You haven’t done your research here yet, otherwise you wouldn’t ask this question – especially in connection with this provider.
Isn’t it allowed to use a more affordable and straightforward standard in certain areas, and invest a bit more where it really matters?
I assume you have chosen this provider because they seem to be cheaper on average compared to others. Since you also mentioned a tight budget – I may have misunderstood – I tried to point out the pitfalls to you. It would not be the first, nor the last time, that the final price ends up higher than those other providers after customizing according to your specific needs. This is simply because Stadt & Land focuses on their carefully calculated standard houses; any deviation from these raises the cost disproportionately.
hemali2003 schrieb:Just a little
Wow, you’re quite harsh here. Maybe I’m just sensitive…
Regards, Bauexperte
H
hemali200322 May 2016 11:35We chose a more affordable provider because they gave us the best overall impression so far in terms of sales approach, effort, transparency about potential extra costs, and expertise. Of course, I would like to spend an additional 50,000 euros (around $54,000) on other well-known providers (this is just an estimate), but I simply can’t. Town & Country is what we can afford and what seems reasonably priced in the true sense: it seems to be worth the price. I’m aware that some people might see this differently.
However, I am keeping a close eye on extra charges—it’s logical that they need to make some profit somewhere when the base house prices are set quite low. I understood from the start that I wouldn’t get an extra shower for just 300 euros (about $320)—besides the shower tray and door, there are also labor, tiling, and plumbing connections to consider. So far, the way the additional costs are calculated seems quite fair to me.
I’ve been reading extensively on construction blogs and similar sources, so maybe that’s why I’m not too surprised by the extra costs that come along beyond the initial offer.
Thanks for your input!
However, I am keeping a close eye on extra charges—it’s logical that they need to make some profit somewhere when the base house prices are set quite low. I understood from the start that I wouldn’t get an extra shower for just 300 euros (about $320)—besides the shower tray and door, there are also labor, tiling, and plumbing connections to consider. So far, the way the additional costs are calculated seems quite fair to me.
I’ve been reading extensively on construction blogs and similar sources, so maybe that’s why I’m not too surprised by the extra costs that come along beyond the initial offer.
Thanks for your input!
B
Bauexperte22 May 2016 11:38hemali2003 schrieb:
I have been reading quite extensively on construction blogs, etc., so maybe that’s why I’m not too surprised by the additional costs that come up beyond the initial low offer.Then you should also know that, in the end, the local authorities often turn out to be the more expensive option, not the reputable provider who from the start avoids lowball offers.Regards, Bauexperte