ᐅ No building plot available due to new EU local residency model?
Created on: 11 Nov 2017 21:49
H
Hanneshickel
Hello everyone,
We are a family of two who have been searching for a building plot east of Munich, about 50-70km (30-45 miles) away, near the upcoming A94 highway, for several years. We have applied multiple times to local municipalities near us for a plot under the local resident model, but each time we were rejected due to too few points or because our equity or income was too high. We have too few points because we don’t have children. Since we have been searching for a long time, we have saved around €130,000 (about $140,000) and can save about €15,000 (about $16,000) more each year. However, here you are not allowed to have more savings than the plot would cost (mostly around €150-200/sqm (about $140-190/sqft), so approximately €120,000 (about $130,000)). Also, you are not allowed to earn more than the municipal average, which as a couple is about €80,000 (about $85,000) gross. We, however, earn almost double that gross, so together we have a net income of around €6,500 (about $7,000) per month (both earn roughly the same).
Therefore, our only option is to buy a plot privately. But prices here are extremely high compared to municipal land. We are talking about €500-700/sqm (about $460-650/sqft), so quickly around €300,000 (about $320,000) just for the plot. Then I estimate construction costs of about €400,000-500,000 (about $430,000-540,000) for a 160 sqm (about 1,700 sqft) house with a basement, double garage, and a simple building shape. That means approximately €700,000-800,000 (about $750,000-860,000) in total.
We don’t feel confident financing this amount, as it would easily mean paying over €2,000 (about $2,150) per month for the next 30 years. If one of us takes time off work due to having children, then there would be too little left for living expenses. Or is it now normal to finance this much for a house? My pain threshold is currently around €1,800 (about $1,950) per month for the mortgage.
What do you think?
What other options do we have to get affordable building land?
Or should we forget about building and only look for existing houses?
Thank you and best regards,
Hannes
We are a family of two who have been searching for a building plot east of Munich, about 50-70km (30-45 miles) away, near the upcoming A94 highway, for several years. We have applied multiple times to local municipalities near us for a plot under the local resident model, but each time we were rejected due to too few points or because our equity or income was too high. We have too few points because we don’t have children. Since we have been searching for a long time, we have saved around €130,000 (about $140,000) and can save about €15,000 (about $16,000) more each year. However, here you are not allowed to have more savings than the plot would cost (mostly around €150-200/sqm (about $140-190/sqft), so approximately €120,000 (about $130,000)). Also, you are not allowed to earn more than the municipal average, which as a couple is about €80,000 (about $85,000) gross. We, however, earn almost double that gross, so together we have a net income of around €6,500 (about $7,000) per month (both earn roughly the same).
Therefore, our only option is to buy a plot privately. But prices here are extremely high compared to municipal land. We are talking about €500-700/sqm (about $460-650/sqft), so quickly around €300,000 (about $320,000) just for the plot. Then I estimate construction costs of about €400,000-500,000 (about $430,000-540,000) for a 160 sqm (about 1,700 sqft) house with a basement, double garage, and a simple building shape. That means approximately €700,000-800,000 (about $750,000-860,000) in total.
We don’t feel confident financing this amount, as it would easily mean paying over €2,000 (about $2,150) per month for the next 30 years. If one of us takes time off work due to having children, then there would be too little left for living expenses. Or is it now normal to finance this much for a house? My pain threshold is currently around €1,800 (about $1,950) per month for the mortgage.
What do you think?
What other options do we have to get affordable building land?
Or should we forget about building and only look for existing houses?
Thank you and best regards,
Hannes
Grym schrieb:
That statement is still nonsense; no one will take a call with you at 7 a.m.
And no, you can’t nearly talk as effectively on the phone in a car as you can in an office. I have a colleague who occasionally does this in a new 5 Series, the current model, so the technology, sound insulation, etc., should be state of the art. He often can’t follow everything completely, can’t make his points, and when we try to discuss some slides, it completely breaks down. Although sometimes he even tries to review the slides and numbers beforehand and memorize as much as possible.Hello troll.
H
Hanneshickel12 Nov 2017 21:37I’m not exactly sure how this relates to the topic, but I’ll share my thoughts on commuting.
I need at least a 30-minute drive in the morning to fully “get into work mode” and in the evening to unwind. When the commute is longer, I usually call friends or family to strengthen social connections.
I couldn’t live just 5 minutes away from work because then you always end up being the person who is quickly asked to do things for others at the office on weekends. You’re basically always on call.
So having some distance from work is actually quite reasonable.
I need at least a 30-minute drive in the morning to fully “get into work mode” and in the evening to unwind. When the commute is longer, I usually call friends or family to strengthen social connections.
I couldn’t live just 5 minutes away from work because then you always end up being the person who is quickly asked to do things for others at the office on weekends. You’re basically always on call.
So having some distance from work is actually quite reasonable.
Hanneshickel schrieb:
...
I find it strange that families with low income and little salary are essentially encouraged to build, even though the risk is already high if interest rates rise...
Meanwhile, people who could afford it without risk have to compete with all the newly wealthy and heirs for the limited number of plots on the open market.
It’s like you are being punished for having saved money and for having a good job after spending many years in school and university...
Maybe someone can still give me some tips on where to look for building land or who to talk to.I don’t think anyone here is criticizing your saved equity. $130,000 is not a small amount.
What, if anything, is being questioned here is your planned savings rate.
I’m not familiar with the wage levels in Bavaria/Munich, but apparently some respondents here agree with me that you have a relatively high income. Where I’m from in the North, a couple planning to build could set aside around $3,500 monthly. Possibly more based on your rent.
I actually looked up the local resident model again for your question. It wasn’t really necessary, as the rules speak for themselves: yes, you are complaining from a position of privilege. You could easily finance a very expensive plot within 2-3 years, and if your house plans are realistic and modest, you could build normally and confidently, as most of us do.
This points system is precisely designed to filter out people like you.
I kept some parts of your quote above because I suspect you don’t have a fully realistic view of your situation.
You belong to the group of the newly wealthy. At least, your incomes provide that foundation.
And just because there are people with good salaries like you doesn’t mean others with fewer or more points deserve a house less. Nobody is being lured here; rather, those who earn a plot with cheaper conditions are being given an advantage over you.
You see yourselves as victims, but you are not. Just because you have your limits on borrowing doesn’t mean your perspective is correct.
You are not being punished—you are being rewarded for your good education, good jobs, and good salaries. So don’t complain [emoji6].
And honestly: maybe now is the time to think about how your desire for a family, your own home, and exclusive education can be reconciled.
In life, you often have to make sacrifices—whether that means compromises in location, number of children, or the kind of profession or job you pursue.
Most people who have gone through these changes don’t call them sacrifices, but rather adjustments based on their circumstances.
As long as you don’t have to make these, you can maintain your current lifestyle (though you don’t have to).
Commuting, for example, I don’t see as a big deal: public transport trips of 60 minutes pass quickly. A 40-minute drive from the suburbs into the city center is normal where I live.
But honestly: once you manage to reduce that commute, get older, and have the option to shorten it, you’ll appreciate the time you save. Usually, that comes with financial trade-offs.
Personally, I think it’s reasonable to explore your career options after your education and business training. You can always scale back 20 years later. But compromises become more necessary once children come into the picture—
and you haven’t reached that point yet.
H
HilfeHilfe13 Nov 2017 07:43Hanneshickel schrieb:
I’m not exactly sure how this relates to the topic, but I’ll share my thoughts on commuting.
I need at least a 30-minute (about 20 miles) car ride in the morning to properly get "ready for work" and the same in the evening to unwind. If I have to drive longer, I always call friends or family to strengthen social bonds.
I couldn’t live 5 minutes (about 3 miles) from work because then you’re always the person who gets asked to quickly do things for others on the weekend. You’re basically always on call.
So having some distance from work is definitely fine.Congratulations! It’s the first time I’ve heard that commuting by car helps you get ready for work or unwind.
I commute by train, which I find relaxing. Not like those speedsters on the highway rushing somewhere.
By the way, I’m also not a fan of involving your parents so much in such a big financing topic and child-related matters, when they’re basically just waiting in retirement to look after the kids. ^^
Here is a small tip from a mother of a 3-year-old. The person who mainly takes care of the child—I assume this will be your wife—should work close to home.
I work just a 3-minute bike ride from my job. By bike, it takes me a maximum of 10 minutes to get to the daycare. My son is really very healthy and has only ever been sent home with a suspected illness that never actually turned out to be anything.
Conclusion: I really appreciate having short distances. Not only can you, as a mother (or father), work as long as possible and then quickly head out to pick up the child and maybe do some quick shopping on the way, but in case of emergencies you are immediately reachable. Within 30 minutes I have my child at home and can continue to work remotely.
Don’t underestimate the stress factor! Before, we lived 20 minutes from my workplace. That is considered ridiculous here in the Ruhr area. But my stress level (and I’m usually hard to stress) was significantly higher than it is now.
Example: I usually work until 3:30 p.m. Then I calmly pack up and head to the daycare. But on some days, exactly at 3:30 p.m., an emergency comes in that urgently needs to be handled. Now I can still work easily for 30 more minutes before I really have to leave. I don’t have to build in any buffer time in case of traffic jams.
Then it’s really worth considering bringing the family planning forward a bit. Either you get a building plot / planning permission faster, or later on you won’t have to worry about lost income.
Then the proximity to the grandparents: Please, please don’t rely on them as permanent caregivers. It’s great if you can leave the kids with them on weekends (we do this every other weekend) or if the grandparents can step in when someone is sick. But don’t count on it as a fixed arrangement. Make sure you budget to pay for full daycare. If anything is left over, then you just have more.
I work just a 3-minute bike ride from my job. By bike, it takes me a maximum of 10 minutes to get to the daycare. My son is really very healthy and has only ever been sent home with a suspected illness that never actually turned out to be anything.
Conclusion: I really appreciate having short distances. Not only can you, as a mother (or father), work as long as possible and then quickly head out to pick up the child and maybe do some quick shopping on the way, but in case of emergencies you are immediately reachable. Within 30 minutes I have my child at home and can continue to work remotely.
Don’t underestimate the stress factor! Before, we lived 20 minutes from my workplace. That is considered ridiculous here in the Ruhr area. But my stress level (and I’m usually hard to stress) was significantly higher than it is now.
Example: I usually work until 3:30 p.m. Then I calmly pack up and head to the daycare. But on some days, exactly at 3:30 p.m., an emergency comes in that urgently needs to be handled. Now I can still work easily for 30 more minutes before I really have to leave. I don’t have to build in any buffer time in case of traffic jams.
Then it’s really worth considering bringing the family planning forward a bit. Either you get a building plot / planning permission faster, or later on you won’t have to worry about lost income.
Then the proximity to the grandparents: Please, please don’t rely on them as permanent caregivers. It’s great if you can leave the kids with them on weekends (we do this every other weekend) or if the grandparents can step in when someone is sick. But don’t count on it as a fixed arrangement. Make sure you budget to pay for full daycare. If anything is left over, then you just have more.