Hello everyone,
I am finally planning to build our own house with my family. I don’t want to do without a smart system and have already done some research.
Loxone is basically off the table for me because it mainly relies on its proprietary system and products.
Of course, I have repeatedly come back to KNX (as here in the forum as well). However, I am not entirely happy with it because I don’t want to have to call a programmer every time I want to make a change; I also don’t really want to buy the ETS license. Additionally, I want to integrate and network fingerprint scanners, Sonos, and a heat pump, but I haven’t fully figured out how to do this with KNX.
The house basically has two floors with an open-plan kitchen/living area, entrance hall, utility room, bathrooms, children’s rooms, bedroom, garden, and so on.
The following systems should be connected:
- Lighting (some dimmable)
- External blinds / weather station
- Underfloor heating
- Heat pump
- Music system (Sonos)
- Fingerprint access
- Video intercom
- Some switched power outlets
- Photovoltaic system
Since I am technically fairly knowledgeable, I want to be able to manage, adjust, and optimize my system myself in the end.
Does anyone have good input here? Or already experience with Loxone, KNX, or others?
Thanks and best regards,
Stefan
I am finally planning to build our own house with my family. I don’t want to do without a smart system and have already done some research.
Loxone is basically off the table for me because it mainly relies on its proprietary system and products.
Of course, I have repeatedly come back to KNX (as here in the forum as well). However, I am not entirely happy with it because I don’t want to have to call a programmer every time I want to make a change; I also don’t really want to buy the ETS license. Additionally, I want to integrate and network fingerprint scanners, Sonos, and a heat pump, but I haven’t fully figured out how to do this with KNX.
The house basically has two floors with an open-plan kitchen/living area, entrance hall, utility room, bathrooms, children’s rooms, bedroom, garden, and so on.
The following systems should be connected:
- Lighting (some dimmable)
- External blinds / weather station
- Underfloor heating
- Heat pump
- Music system (Sonos)
- Fingerprint access
- Video intercom
- Some switched power outlets
- Photovoltaic system
Since I am technically fairly knowledgeable, I want to be able to manage, adjust, and optimize my system myself in the end.
Does anyone have good input here? Or already experience with Loxone, KNX, or others?
Thanks and best regards,
Stefan
Loxone has dropped KNX and was never certified. The solution you described is KNX. With it, you are manufacturer-independent and future-proof. It’s not that difficult to understand. Anyone who puts some effort into it and studies a bit of literature can program it. I don’t find Loxone any easier… The ETS software is occasionally available at a discount through group orders. Or maybe you know someone who can lend it to you temporarily.
untergasse4317 Feb 2020 09:21bonkers223 schrieb:
Regarding ETS: with the ETS demo (please correct me if I’m wrong), I can only manage 5 devices? My system will definitely have more than 50 devices. How is that supposed to work? I don’t want to spend another $1000 and then hope the programmer will even hand over the project to me. Yes, ETS does cost money. You can’t avoid that if you have more than the number of devices allowed in the Lite version. Professional tools come at a price.
The programmer must hand over the project to you. However, they will clearly inform you that you will lose any warranty from their side if you modify the project yourself during the warranty period. This is absolutely legitimate.
What:
bonkers223 schrieb:
I’m fully aware that I need to invest, but the whole system is supposed to last 20–30 years and run reliably. Also, I want to be sure that I can always get help without having to replace everything. is completely contradicted by this:
bonkers223 schrieb:
I had plenty of time over the weekend to look into it. I came across Loxone again, which also works with KNX. But to what extent can I work on it myself? Is there anyone here who has worked with it? Loxone is 100% proprietary, and no one can tell you how long it will continue to exist. KNX has been around for over 30 years with several hundred manufacturers. They won’t all suddenly stop production at the same time. One individual manufacturer might. Otherwise, only the old Loxone Miniserver had a KNX interface. It was never certified and is the exact opposite of “reliable.” The new Miniserver doesn’t even have the interface anymore. Besides, someone still needs to configure your KNX devices for integration with Loxone.
The same applies to MyGekko, by the way: another fully proprietary system.
MyGekko is basically just an operating system with a logic editor (like many others out there). In other words, it is software that can manage, control, and query devices across different standards. So it operates at the management level, and you still need the basic framework you want to control.
Loxone can be dismissed due to their pricing and now even more limited features. Pricing is similar to KNX but with more wiring and restricted capabilities, plus an uncertain future overall. I would definitely not rely on them.
Loxone can be dismissed due to their pricing and now even more limited features. Pricing is similar to KNX but with more wiring and restricted capabilities, plus an uncertain future overall. I would definitely not rely on them.
B
bonkers22317 Feb 2020 10:00Mycraft schrieb:
MyGekko is basically just an operating system with a logic editor. (Like many others out there) In other words, it is software that can manage, control, and query devices of various standards. It operates on the management level, so you still need the basic infrastructure that you want to control.Exactly, that’s what makes it interesting in principle. If I choose my actuators/sensors based on KNX and instead of ETS place an OS on top that manages everything for me and also aligns with common standards, I can’t really go wrong. Sonos, fingerprint systems, photovoltaic installations, etc., could be easily networked and integrated with KNX this way.
I still need to study it in more detail soon. In principle, its structure is interesting.
untergasse4317 Feb 2020 10:06Um. You have fundamentally misunderstood something: ETS doesn’t manage anything, it only programs your KNX devices. You need it for the initial setup in every “real” KNX installation.
You can add a lot of functionality on top of an already programmed KNX system, but MyGekko would hardly be my last resort. Look into KNX visualizations—that’s what people call the “additional layer” that handles logic and displays everything nicely. Sure, there are also pure logic controllers, but we’ll just ignore those for now.
You can add a lot of functionality on top of an already programmed KNX system, but MyGekko would hardly be my last resort. Look into KNX visualizations—that’s what people call the “additional layer” that handles logic and displays everything nicely. Sure, there are also pure logic controllers, but we’ll just ignore those for now.