Hello everyone,
since I couldn’t find any thread under the keywords “basement envelope” in the title, I’m quickly creating one myself:
Current status: A single-family house of about 170 sqm (1,830 sq ft), two stories, is planned with 36 or 42 cm (14 or 17 inches) insulated bricks (probably with perlite). We have not yet carried out the heating load calculation according to the energy-saving regulation, but that will happen in the next few weeks. Nevertheless, at the moment, a ground loop heat pump with ring trench collector is the favorite heating system, along with the planned underfloor heating in all rooms on the ground floor and upper floor. Additionally, a central ventilation system with heat recovery is planned for all rooms on both floors.
Now to the main point. Originally, I had planned the ventilation system with heat recovery also for all basement rooms.
Since there are two home office spaces, a hobby room, and corresponding children’s rooms planned on the ground floor and upper floor, we cannot do without a basement that would include a guest room (also desired), heating and utilities, and storage spaces (please no “you don’t need a basement” discussions, just constructive contributions on whether the basement with the only partially used living space “guest room” should be within or outside the thermal envelope).
Now my question is whether the mostly uninhabited and only rarely used basement (actually only on a few days when the guest room with visitors is needed, but I don’t know exactly how many days per year on average) should be included in the thermal envelope or not. At first, my gut feeling says no, which would mean that the ground floor slab / basement ceiling should be insulated accordingly.
But then, for ecological reasons, I obviously cannot implement the ventilation system for the entire house (including basement). The question is also what kind of heating I should install in the basement guest room (underfloor heating outside the envelope is a no-go). Additionally, how strongly should the basement be insulated if it is outside the thermal envelope (perimeter insulation)?
Of course, in that case, I would have to insulate the basement entrance door accordingly to prevent heat loss or cold air infiltration.
Or is it more cost-effective and ecological to include the mostly uninhabited basement in the thermal envelope, connect it to the central ventilation system, and also install the underfloor heating circuits there? And then insulate the externally waterproofed concrete basement with perimeter insulation? What do you recommend here?
Best regards
ludwig88sta
since I couldn’t find any thread under the keywords “basement envelope” in the title, I’m quickly creating one myself:
Current status: A single-family house of about 170 sqm (1,830 sq ft), two stories, is planned with 36 or 42 cm (14 or 17 inches) insulated bricks (probably with perlite). We have not yet carried out the heating load calculation according to the energy-saving regulation, but that will happen in the next few weeks. Nevertheless, at the moment, a ground loop heat pump with ring trench collector is the favorite heating system, along with the planned underfloor heating in all rooms on the ground floor and upper floor. Additionally, a central ventilation system with heat recovery is planned for all rooms on both floors.
Now to the main point. Originally, I had planned the ventilation system with heat recovery also for all basement rooms.
Since there are two home office spaces, a hobby room, and corresponding children’s rooms planned on the ground floor and upper floor, we cannot do without a basement that would include a guest room (also desired), heating and utilities, and storage spaces (please no “you don’t need a basement” discussions, just constructive contributions on whether the basement with the only partially used living space “guest room” should be within or outside the thermal envelope).
Now my question is whether the mostly uninhabited and only rarely used basement (actually only on a few days when the guest room with visitors is needed, but I don’t know exactly how many days per year on average) should be included in the thermal envelope or not. At first, my gut feeling says no, which would mean that the ground floor slab / basement ceiling should be insulated accordingly.
But then, for ecological reasons, I obviously cannot implement the ventilation system for the entire house (including basement). The question is also what kind of heating I should install in the basement guest room (underfloor heating outside the envelope is a no-go). Additionally, how strongly should the basement be insulated if it is outside the thermal envelope (perimeter insulation)?
Of course, in that case, I would have to insulate the basement entrance door accordingly to prevent heat loss or cold air infiltration.
Or is it more cost-effective and ecological to include the mostly uninhabited basement in the thermal envelope, connect it to the central ventilation system, and also install the underfloor heating circuits there? And then insulate the externally waterproofed concrete basement with perimeter insulation? What do you recommend here?
Best regards
ludwig88sta
ludwig88sta schrieb:
whether the basement with the only partially used living space "guest room" should remain inside or outside the thermal envelopeIf it is officially called a guest room, I’m afraid it will have to be included in the area complying with the energy-saving regulations, and I see the question settled due to the lack of alternative options.https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
11ant schrieb:
If it is officially called a guest room, I’m afraid it will have to be included in the area that complies with the energy-saving regulations, and I see the issue as resolved due to the lack of alternative options.Officially, it will then be called a storage room but simply used as a guest room.L
ludwig88sta23 Dec 2019 10:14-XIII- schrieb:
If money is no longer the limiting factor, then include everything within the thermal envelope, with underfloor heating everywhere and mechanical ventilation with heat recovery.
We are building it that way too; it’s simply a gain in comfort, and comfort does come at a cost. Have you calculated what you would save if the basement were outside the thermal envelope?
At the moment, I can’t really compare due to a lack of offers.
L
ludwig88sta23 Dec 2019 10:24Tassimat schrieb:
If someone only comes 2-3 times a year, they can either sleep in one of the office or hobby rooms, maybe even in the living room, or you could install an electric storage heater downstairs. But to heat a basement room that is not within the thermal envelope with an electric heater, the room should be insulated; otherwise, you’ll never get it warm. You would be transferring the heat from the electric heater through the reinforced concrete (its U-value I don’t know, but it’s probably quite high) directly to the outside into the ground.
How does the insulation of a basement within the thermal envelope differ from one that is outside it? Both should have perimeter insulation on the outside (to what thickness?), and underneath it should rest on a proper layer of cellular glass gravel or similar, right?
face26 schrieb:
It doesn’t make sense to spend 50-70k for a basement and then consider taking it out of the thermal envelope. How much energy savings would that actually bring? Unfortunately, I lack construction experience and, especially, comparable offers to assess. Do you happen to know?
@WingVII
Which thread?
ludwig88sta schrieb:
Have you calculated how much you would save if the basement was outside the thermal envelope?
Unfortunately, I can’t easily compare right now due to a lack of quotes. We didn’t calculate that because from the start, having everything inside the thermal envelope was the only option for us. I estimate the additional costs at about 4,500 for insulation and 6,000 for building services. The footprint is 10 x 12 m (33 x 39 ft). Since we wanted living-quality space, several other items added to the cost, such as higher ceilings, quality plaster and flooring, extra power outlets and LAN connections, etc.
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