ᐅ Installation of a Gas Heating System in New Construction 2023/2024
Created on: 11 Apr 2023 14:47
R
robert0815
Hello fellow home builders,
we have started constructing a single-family house. The approved building permit / planning permission includes a gas heating system, which we still want to install.
There are two possible scenarios:
1. What happens if the heating system is installed in October 2023, but the house is only inspected and approved in February 2024?
2. What happens if the heating system is installed in January 2024, and the house is inspected and approved in May 2024?
Both options are difficult to plan for. So far, we do not know whether the construction schedule might be delayed.
I haven't found any information on this. Do you have any further details?
Regards,
robert0815
we have started constructing a single-family house. The approved building permit / planning permission includes a gas heating system, which we still want to install.
There are two possible scenarios:
1. What happens if the heating system is installed in October 2023, but the house is only inspected and approved in February 2024?
2. What happens if the heating system is installed in January 2024, and the house is inspected and approved in May 2024?
Both options are difficult to plan for. So far, we do not know whether the construction schedule might be delayed.
I haven't found any information on this. Do you have any further details?
Regards,
robert0815
Snowy36 schrieb:
let the others have their gas Definitely not without addressing the collected fake news here. I have done so now – and it was not intended for you, but for the silent readers.
B
Bausparfuchs26 Apr 2023 08:12Why is it that in Germany you are always treated like a stubborn little child?
If I want to install a gas heating system, I have my reasons. Not everyone likes heat pumps and the heating concepts behind them. By the way, I don’t either.
First, I don’t want underfloor heating but classic radiators. I also don’t want a house with a constant temperature and slow-responding heating. Underfloor heating is not that healthy anyway. I always have warm feet and find it pleasant to have a cool floor.
At the same time, I want to be able to quickly heat one or several rooms to 24°C (75°F) or more in winter. I also want a house without additional ventilation systems or forced ventilation. It was possible, and it should remain possible, to achieve a flow temperature of 60°C (140°F). Anyone who wants to do this with a heat pump might manage it technically somehow, but then won’t be able to pay their electricity bill.
Heat pumps mean surface heating with low flow temperatures and slow heat control. And above all: constant heating. They heat even when no one is home or you are briefly on vacation.
And now it’s starting again. Wood stoves are banned, existing fireplaces have to be retrofitted with filters, emission limits keep getting stricter. Bad refrigerants, good refrigerants in heat pumps. Anyone who installed a heat pump three years ago now has a climate-damaging heating system in their almost new building. Dear home builders, that is the reality.
And what a strange coincidence that Germany’s largest heat pump and heating manufacturer is being sold to the Americans. At a time when all other heating methods are practically being banned. To me, this leaves more than a bad taste.
But all of this only annoys me secondarily. My oil heating system from 1992 runs perfectly. I bought the heating system for 14 euros once.
I need 1000 liters (265 gallons) of heating oil for my 180 m² (1,938 sq ft) living space, and I do the maintenance myself. Boiler cleaning, nozzle replacement, and occasional renewal of the ignition electrode I can manage on my own.
If something electronic breaks in my heat pump, it immediately gets expensive. And just like electricity meters, smart meters, and inverters, most heat pumps are made in Asia.
Heat pumps are just as much a dead end as night storage heaters. Those were banned in 2009, allowed again in 2014, and today are the only alternative to heat pumps in ideologically polluted Germany.
If I want to install a gas heating system, I have my reasons. Not everyone likes heat pumps and the heating concepts behind them. By the way, I don’t either.
First, I don’t want underfloor heating but classic radiators. I also don’t want a house with a constant temperature and slow-responding heating. Underfloor heating is not that healthy anyway. I always have warm feet and find it pleasant to have a cool floor.
At the same time, I want to be able to quickly heat one or several rooms to 24°C (75°F) or more in winter. I also want a house without additional ventilation systems or forced ventilation. It was possible, and it should remain possible, to achieve a flow temperature of 60°C (140°F). Anyone who wants to do this with a heat pump might manage it technically somehow, but then won’t be able to pay their electricity bill.
Heat pumps mean surface heating with low flow temperatures and slow heat control. And above all: constant heating. They heat even when no one is home or you are briefly on vacation.
And now it’s starting again. Wood stoves are banned, existing fireplaces have to be retrofitted with filters, emission limits keep getting stricter. Bad refrigerants, good refrigerants in heat pumps. Anyone who installed a heat pump three years ago now has a climate-damaging heating system in their almost new building. Dear home builders, that is the reality.
And what a strange coincidence that Germany’s largest heat pump and heating manufacturer is being sold to the Americans. At a time when all other heating methods are practically being banned. To me, this leaves more than a bad taste.
But all of this only annoys me secondarily. My oil heating system from 1992 runs perfectly. I bought the heating system for 14 euros once.
I need 1000 liters (265 gallons) of heating oil for my 180 m² (1,938 sq ft) living space, and I do the maintenance myself. Boiler cleaning, nozzle replacement, and occasional renewal of the ignition electrode I can manage on my own.
If something electronic breaks in my heat pump, it immediately gets expensive. And just like electricity meters, smart meters, and inverters, most heat pumps are made in Asia.
Heat pumps are just as much a dead end as night storage heaters. Those were banned in 2009, allowed again in 2014, and today are the only alternative to heat pumps in ideologically polluted Germany.
Well, someone is really unpacking the complete FDP/AfD rhetoric here.
Well, that’s because reason, good persuasion, and scientific facts (by now) no longer reach everyone. And at some point, enough is enough, because CO2 reduction concerns us all. And after the war of aggression in Ukraine, the massive dependence on countries we definitely don’t want to rely on has become clear. By the way, this also applies to the USA – so much for the "unpleasant connotation," which apparently only partly works for you.
So what? That works just as well with a heat pump.
Huh? I can switch mine off. More than that: I can set it to start again in time.
Yes, particulate matter is a health issue. The regulations are actually too lenient, but they are designed this way so that people aren’t overburdened.
That’s completely irrelevant for single-family home heat pumps for now. Old systems can stay. And switching new ones to propane is simply better.
No coincidence, just a simple explanation. Profit margins of German manufacturers are set to drop significantly due to foreign competition and ramped-up mass production. Now is the best time to cash in on a sale. Viessmann will never be worth this much again.
That means you’re at about 55 kWh/sqm (5.1 kWh/sq ft). Perfect house for a heat pump 🙂 Up to 100 kWh/sqm (9.3 kWh/sq ft), installation is usually possible without additional measures and is more economical.
Would you care to explain? Especially since this concerns new construction. I don’t see how your claims hold up against physical reality.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
Why is it that in Germany you are always treated like a defiant little kindergartener.
Well, that’s because reason, good persuasion, and scientific facts (by now) no longer reach everyone. And at some point, enough is enough, because CO2 reduction concerns us all. And after the war of aggression in Ukraine, the massive dependence on countries we definitely don’t want to rely on has become clear. By the way, this also applies to the USA – so much for the "unpleasant connotation," which apparently only partly works for you.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
First of all, I don’t want underfloor heating, but classic radiators.
So what? That works just as well with a heat pump.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
It also heats when no one is home or if you’re on a short vacation.
Huh? I can switch mine off. More than that: I can set it to start again in time.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
Wood stoves are banned, existing fireplaces must be retrofitted with filters, and emissions limits keep getting stricter.
Yes, particulate matter is a health issue. The regulations are actually too lenient, but they are designed this way so that people aren’t overburdened.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
Bad refrigerant, good refrigerant in heat pumps. If you installed a heat pump three years ago, you now have a climate-damaging heating system in your nearly new home.
That’s completely irrelevant for single-family home heat pumps for now. Old systems can stay. And switching new ones to propane is simply better.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
And what a strange coincidence that Germany’s largest heat pump and heating manufacturer is being sold to the Americans. At a time when all other heating types are practically banned. To me, this smells fishy.
No coincidence, just a simple explanation. Profit margins of German manufacturers are set to drop significantly due to foreign competition and ramped-up mass production. Now is the best time to cash in on a sale. Viessmann will never be worth this much again.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
1000 liters of heating oil for my 180 sqm (1,940 sq ft) living space.
That means you’re at about 55 kWh/sqm (5.1 kWh/sq ft). Perfect house for a heat pump 🙂 Up to 100 kWh/sqm (9.3 kWh/sq ft), installation is usually possible without additional measures and is more economical.
Bausparfuchs schrieb:
Heat pumps are the same dead end as storage heaters. These were banned in 2009, approved again in 2014, and today are the only alternative to heat pumps in ideologically biased Germany.
Would you care to explain? Especially since this concerns new construction. I don’t see how your claims hold up against physical reality.
B
Bausparfuchs26 Apr 2023 09:17I don’t see how expressing doubts about a heat pump qualifies as AfD rhetoric. But well, nowadays you can be labeled a Nazi just for expressing even slight criticism of political absurdities.
A heat pump is not suitable for everyone, just like an electric car isn’t. For the owner of a detached house that still receives full sunlight, equipped with a photovoltaic system and a charging station in the yard, and with the right driving profile, an electric car might be the best and most economical choice.
For the commuter living in a rented apartment on a busy city street without a private parking space or charging options, it’s simply not feasible. Politically forcing everyone to drive electric is just as absurd as politically forcing everyone to heat electrically.
Ninety-six percent of property management companies believe that condominium owners are not capable of renovating their units or installing new heating systems.
What does this mean in practice?
There will be significant write-offs and impairments in the value of existing properties. Condominiums, apartment buildings, and single-family homes are likely to suffer considerable losses in value. In turn, this could cause problems for banks. Many loans will become undercollateralized.
It will, of course, also affect the new construction market. On one hand, costs will continue to rise. At the same time, the value of inherited or property intended for sale will drop drastically. Anyone planning fixed sales proceeds here could be deeply disappointed.
And then there is Section 490 of the Building Code. This will become relevant in the event of a general decline in real estate prices. Can that really be ruled out if existing property values are falling so sharply? This will almost certainly also impact newly built houses.
Section 490 of the Building Code
If there is a substantial deterioration or threat of deterioration in the borrower’s financial situation or in the value of collateral provided for the loan, which endangers repayment of the loan, even through the realization of the collateral, the lender may, in doubt, terminate the loan agreement without notice before disbursing the loan, and after disbursement usually without notice.
It will be interesting!
A heat pump is not suitable for everyone, just like an electric car isn’t. For the owner of a detached house that still receives full sunlight, equipped with a photovoltaic system and a charging station in the yard, and with the right driving profile, an electric car might be the best and most economical choice.
For the commuter living in a rented apartment on a busy city street without a private parking space or charging options, it’s simply not feasible. Politically forcing everyone to drive electric is just as absurd as politically forcing everyone to heat electrically.
Ninety-six percent of property management companies believe that condominium owners are not capable of renovating their units or installing new heating systems.
What does this mean in practice?
There will be significant write-offs and impairments in the value of existing properties. Condominiums, apartment buildings, and single-family homes are likely to suffer considerable losses in value. In turn, this could cause problems for banks. Many loans will become undercollateralized.
It will, of course, also affect the new construction market. On one hand, costs will continue to rise. At the same time, the value of inherited or property intended for sale will drop drastically. Anyone planning fixed sales proceeds here could be deeply disappointed.
And then there is Section 490 of the Building Code. This will become relevant in the event of a general decline in real estate prices. Can that really be ruled out if existing property values are falling so sharply? This will almost certainly also impact newly built houses.
Section 490 of the Building Code
If there is a substantial deterioration or threat of deterioration in the borrower’s financial situation or in the value of collateral provided for the loan, which endangers repayment of the loan, even through the realization of the collateral, the lender may, in doubt, terminate the loan agreement without notice before disbursing the loan, and after disbursement usually without notice.
It will be interesting!
W
WilderSueden26 Apr 2023 09:17Apolyxo schrieb:
For single-family houses, heat pumps are initially completely irrelevant. The old systems can remain. And switching new ones to propane is simply better.I wouldn’t say irrelevant. According to the current draft, maintenance and repairs are also not allowed. That means if there is a leak somewhere, the heat pump wouldn’t be repairable. For example, we have installed R407C, which would no longer be permitted.Similar topics