ᐅ Installing a Mechanical Ventilation System with Heat Recovery Yourself: Timeline and Costs?
Created on: 12 Jan 2016 12:57
A
andimann
Hi everyone,
We will be building in a few months. The building permit / planning permission was submitted last year to take advantage of the previous energy-saving regulations. So far, so good.
Originally, we planned to build without a mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery. Based on our experience in our current house, we considered such a system unnecessary.
However, for various reasons, we are now reconsidering. A mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery will never really pay for itself, but as a comfort upgrade and to improve marketability in case of a future sale, it might be worthwhile after all.
We are talking about a central system with heat recovery for nearly 180 sqm (approximately 1,940 sq ft) of living space over two floors plus basement.
The general contractor is quoting completely insane prices. I’m still waiting for the detailed offer, but initial estimates were between 15,000 and 18,000 Euros (around 10,000 to 12,000 USD, depending on exchange rate) for a system from Helios, and even more with the basement. So, a classic deterrent offer...
In a thread here, I came across a supplier who designs, plans, and assembles the materials for these systems, delivering everything ready for installation. The installation itself would then be done by us. According to the advisor, it’s truly no rocket science and for a house of this size, two people could easily do it in 4-5 working days (which equals 8-10 man-days).
It would also be a Helios system (specific model to be confirmed) with about 6-7 supply air and 6-7 exhaust air ducts. Installation is done within the impact sound insulation layer, that is, on top of the finished concrete ceiling. The supplier also provides plans for the necessary ceiling penetrations etc., so these can be incorporated directly during the concrete pour.
What caught my attention was his initial rough price estimate for the materials, which was about one-third of the general contractor’s price. So for around 10,000 Euros (about 11,000 USD), I might just take a week off work...!
But is it really that simple? This is a trade that happens right in the middle of construction, so our own work must be absolutely punctual, otherwise the overall schedule collapses...
My question is: How realistic is it to install such a system yourself within one week?
Has anyone done this before and could share some of their experiences?
Best regards,
Andreas
We will be building in a few months. The building permit / planning permission was submitted last year to take advantage of the previous energy-saving regulations. So far, so good.
Originally, we planned to build without a mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery. Based on our experience in our current house, we considered such a system unnecessary.
However, for various reasons, we are now reconsidering. A mechanical ventilation system with heat recovery will never really pay for itself, but as a comfort upgrade and to improve marketability in case of a future sale, it might be worthwhile after all.
We are talking about a central system with heat recovery for nearly 180 sqm (approximately 1,940 sq ft) of living space over two floors plus basement.
The general contractor is quoting completely insane prices. I’m still waiting for the detailed offer, but initial estimates were between 15,000 and 18,000 Euros (around 10,000 to 12,000 USD, depending on exchange rate) for a system from Helios, and even more with the basement. So, a classic deterrent offer...
In a thread here, I came across a supplier who designs, plans, and assembles the materials for these systems, delivering everything ready for installation. The installation itself would then be done by us. According to the advisor, it’s truly no rocket science and for a house of this size, two people could easily do it in 4-5 working days (which equals 8-10 man-days).
It would also be a Helios system (specific model to be confirmed) with about 6-7 supply air and 6-7 exhaust air ducts. Installation is done within the impact sound insulation layer, that is, on top of the finished concrete ceiling. The supplier also provides plans for the necessary ceiling penetrations etc., so these can be incorporated directly during the concrete pour.
What caught my attention was his initial rough price estimate for the materials, which was about one-third of the general contractor’s price. So for around 10,000 Euros (about 11,000 USD), I might just take a week off work...!
But is it really that simple? This is a trade that happens right in the middle of construction, so our own work must be absolutely punctual, otherwise the overall schedule collapses...
My question is: How realistic is it to install such a system yourself within one week?
Has anyone done this before and could share some of their experiences?
Best regards,
Andreas
S
Sebastian7913 Jan 2016 09:04I am currently installing 40 + 30 mm (1.6 + 1.2 inches) insulation – 120 mm (4.7 inches) would have been ideal, of course.
But otherwise, adding more insulation of that thickness is somewhat unnecessary, since there is hardly any need for insulation anyway.
But otherwise, adding more insulation of that thickness is somewhat unnecessary, since there is hardly any need for insulation anyway.
We are also doing it ourselves, with 8 + 3cm (3 + 1 inch) insulation and round ducts on the ground floor, and 5 + 3cm (2 + 1 inch) insulation with flat ducts on the upper floor. The most difficult part is the planning beforehand, because you really can hardly have any crossovers, for example with the electrical system. Thanks to home equity prices, we end up paying about €5000 all-inclusive with Helios.
@Sebastian79, greetings back from Mr. Schliebe...
I have the offer now, and it is within your range. Everything sounds pretty good so far. The problem will be my HVAC contractor, who unfortunately uses a somewhat unusual floor construction. He calculates 160 mm (6.3 inches), which is composed as follows:
50 mm (2 inches) insulation
30 mm (1.2 inches) fixing panel
70 mm (2.8 inches) screed
10 mm (0.4 inches) tile/wood flooring
We wouldn’t be able to fit the 52 mm (2 inches) flat ducts in there. Their standard practice, when ventilation is installed, is to immediately increase the floor construction height to 190 mm (7.5 inches). That would reduce the ceiling height on the upper floor to 245 cm (8 ft), which is basically a no-go for us. The current 248 cm (8 ft 1.6 in) is already our absolute minimum. On the ground floor, the ceiling height is 260 cm (8 ft 6.3 in), so dropping to 257 cm (8 ft 5.2 in) would still be acceptable...
Why he uses this floor construction approach is not entirely clear to me, and even the planner couldn’t really explain it...
Would it be possible to do something like this instead:
70 mm (2.8 inches) insulation
20 mm (0.8 inches) fixing panel
50 mm (2 inches) screed
10 mm (0.4 inches) tile/wood flooring
What is the minimum thickness for the screed?
Best regards,
Andreas
I have the offer now, and it is within your range. Everything sounds pretty good so far. The problem will be my HVAC contractor, who unfortunately uses a somewhat unusual floor construction. He calculates 160 mm (6.3 inches), which is composed as follows:
50 mm (2 inches) insulation
30 mm (1.2 inches) fixing panel
70 mm (2.8 inches) screed
10 mm (0.4 inches) tile/wood flooring
We wouldn’t be able to fit the 52 mm (2 inches) flat ducts in there. Their standard practice, when ventilation is installed, is to immediately increase the floor construction height to 190 mm (7.5 inches). That would reduce the ceiling height on the upper floor to 245 cm (8 ft), which is basically a no-go for us. The current 248 cm (8 ft 1.6 in) is already our absolute minimum. On the ground floor, the ceiling height is 260 cm (8 ft 6.3 in), so dropping to 257 cm (8 ft 5.2 in) would still be acceptable...
Why he uses this floor construction approach is not entirely clear to me, and even the planner couldn’t really explain it...
Would it be possible to do something like this instead:
70 mm (2.8 inches) insulation
20 mm (0.8 inches) fixing panel
50 mm (2 inches) screed
10 mm (0.4 inches) tile/wood flooring
What is the minimum thickness for the screed?
Best regards,
Andreas
Hmm... just a basic general question for the group:
Why do people install such thick insulation layers under the screed inside the house? Is it only to hide the ventilation pipes? There are no thermal differences between the ground floor and upper floor, so there is nothing thermal to insulate there.
Are these 50–80 mm (2–3 inches) layers purely for impact sound insulation? Wouldn’t 10–20 mm (0.4–0.8 inches) of acoustic rubber mat or bitumen be much better suited for this purpose? This EPS material isn’t actually soundproof, right? It just decouples the screed from the raw concrete ceiling, but that’s all?
I’m not planning to pour bitumen into my house, don’t worry, just a question that came to mind…
Best regards,
Andreas
Why do people install such thick insulation layers under the screed inside the house? Is it only to hide the ventilation pipes? There are no thermal differences between the ground floor and upper floor, so there is nothing thermal to insulate there.
Are these 50–80 mm (2–3 inches) layers purely for impact sound insulation? Wouldn’t 10–20 mm (0.4–0.8 inches) of acoustic rubber mat or bitumen be much better suited for this purpose? This EPS material isn’t actually soundproof, right? It just decouples the screed from the raw concrete ceiling, but that’s all?
I’m not planning to pour bitumen into my house, don’t worry, just a question that came to mind…
Best regards,
Andreas
Masipulami13 Jan 2016 17:37Without insulation, the underfloor heating would not operate efficiently.
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