Hello community,
I urgently need help. I am losing track of the different options for roller shutter control.
We have:
Ground floor (GF) 10 roller shutters
GF 1 distribution box
Upper floor (UF) 6 roller shutters
UF 1 sub-distribution box.
We want to:
- Control each roller shutter up/down individually with a push button
- Control all roller shutters on the GF up/down via a central switch
- Central time scheduling for groups or each individual roller shutter
- Possibly later control roller shutters via a sun sensor (but not a must!!)
The plan was:
To implement all this using LOGO. The problem is that on the GF I need 20 outputs for the roller shutters plus additional ones for the central switch.
So, for the GF distribution box I would need 1 x base unit (4 outputs) plus 2 x extension modules (16 outputs) plus another extension module for the central switch???
On the UF, I would need 1 x base unit and 1 x extension module again.
What has been done so far:
The window manufacturer installed 16 elero motors.
Each roller shutter is wired with 5x1.5 mm² cables to the respective distribution box.
Done.
The main question:
Am I missing a supplier on the market who specializes in roller shutter control? All I find are base stations with 4 outputs plus countless output extensions at high cost.
We do not want to rely on wireless control. I have looked into Busch, Gira, Comexio. It comes to over €1,600.
Thank you in advance.
Regards, tyr0n
I urgently need help. I am losing track of the different options for roller shutter control.
We have:
Ground floor (GF) 10 roller shutters
GF 1 distribution box
Upper floor (UF) 6 roller shutters
UF 1 sub-distribution box.
We want to:
- Control each roller shutter up/down individually with a push button
- Control all roller shutters on the GF up/down via a central switch
- Central time scheduling for groups or each individual roller shutter
- Possibly later control roller shutters via a sun sensor (but not a must!!)
The plan was:
To implement all this using LOGO. The problem is that on the GF I need 20 outputs for the roller shutters plus additional ones for the central switch.
So, for the GF distribution box I would need 1 x base unit (4 outputs) plus 2 x extension modules (16 outputs) plus another extension module for the central switch???
On the UF, I would need 1 x base unit and 1 x extension module again.
What has been done so far:
The window manufacturer installed 16 elero motors.
Each roller shutter is wired with 5x1.5 mm² cables to the respective distribution box.
Done.
The main question:
Am I missing a supplier on the market who specializes in roller shutter control? All I find are base stations with 4 outputs plus countless output extensions at high cost.
We do not want to rely on wireless control. I have looked into Busch, Gira, Comexio. It comes to over €1,600.
Thank you in advance.
Regards, tyr0n
I wrote that for an additional 1,600€ he would get KNX for the ENTIRE house. I did NOT write that he gets KNX for the house for 1,600€!!!!!
He himself wrote that he spends 1,600 euros JUST for lowering the blinds in the evening and raising them in the morning !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He himself wrote that he spends 1,600 euros JUST for lowering the blinds in the evening and raising them in the morning !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I wonder if the original poster or his brother is really capable of setting up their own interface with the PI?
The software still needs to be purchased, and someone has to do the programming as well. If you can do it yourself, even better, otherwise there will be additional costs.
It’s just a bit more expensive and complicated than described. ;-)
If the original poster only wants to control the shutters, there are certainly other systems that are cheaper and easier.
The software still needs to be purchased, and someone has to do the programming as well. If you can do it yourself, even better, otherwise there will be additional costs.
It’s just a bit more expensive and complicated than described. ;-)
If the original poster only wants to control the shutters, there are certainly other systems that are cheaper and easier.
Pi is an option; otherwise, there’s the USB interface. The demo is free but limited to 5 devices per project. With 4 actuators and 10 switches, that makes 3 projects. Alternatively, ETS Light supports 20 devices per project and costs €200.
But honestly, before spending €1600 just to have the blinds go up in the morning and down in the evening, I’m looking into KNX. And the fact that his brother is an electrician suggests he does some of his own electrical work, which again speaks in favor of KNX. Anyone who says KNX is difficult or complicated probably hasn’t really looked into it. I claim that anyone who can work with Excel can handle ETS as well.
I recently visited a friend who has had KNX in his house since 1994. Over the years, he had an electrician make occasional changes. I spent an hour showing him what HIS electrician had done for him over the years… He was almost in disbelief. Since then, he has activated a lot of NEW functions in his home. He said that if he had known earlier what is possible by default and how simple it actually is… (And no, he’s not an IT specialist.)
I’m not trying to convince anyone, but it annoys me that everyone says KNX IS EXPENSIVE and KNX IS COMPLICATED.
KNX is simply different. Especially when comfort functions come into play, it is unbeatable in flexibility and, in this case, no more expensive than the traditional method. Just the fact that I no longer have a wall full of switches. With heating, lighting, and 3 blinds in a room, you typically have at least 5 switch boxes in the traditional setup! With KNX, you only need one. And instead of running 5 NYM cables away from there (1 for lighting, 1 for heating, 3 for blinds), you only need one bus cable.
But honestly, before spending €1600 just to have the blinds go up in the morning and down in the evening, I’m looking into KNX. And the fact that his brother is an electrician suggests he does some of his own electrical work, which again speaks in favor of KNX. Anyone who says KNX is difficult or complicated probably hasn’t really looked into it. I claim that anyone who can work with Excel can handle ETS as well.
I recently visited a friend who has had KNX in his house since 1994. Over the years, he had an electrician make occasional changes. I spent an hour showing him what HIS electrician had done for him over the years… He was almost in disbelief. Since then, he has activated a lot of NEW functions in his home. He said that if he had known earlier what is possible by default and how simple it actually is… (And no, he’s not an IT specialist.)
I’m not trying to convince anyone, but it annoys me that everyone says KNX IS EXPENSIVE and KNX IS COMPLICATED.
KNX is simply different. Especially when comfort functions come into play, it is unbeatable in flexibility and, in this case, no more expensive than the traditional method. Just the fact that I no longer have a wall full of switches. With heating, lighting, and 3 blinds in a room, you typically have at least 5 switch boxes in the traditional setup! With KNX, you only need one. And instead of running 5 NYM cables away from there (1 for lighting, 1 for heating, 3 for blinds), you only need one bus cable.
Tom1607 schrieb:
I wrote that for an additional €1600 (about $1700) he gets KNX for the entire house. I never said he gets KNX for the house for €1600 (about $1700) total!!!
He actually said he spends 1,600 euros (about $1700) JUST for lowering the blinds in the evening and raising them in the morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Then it was confusingly phrased with spaces!!!!!111exclamation marks
@Neill: It would be helpful if you could explain what is easier and more cost-effective.
@sirhc: Sorry for the exclamation mark, but it seems you helped.
Just to share how things are set up for me.
Shutter functions:
Central control
Up in the morning, down at night, central down/up (36 shutters).
Ground floor up/down, upper floor up/down.
Zones
(Shading) South, east, west, north.
Dining/kitchen/living/bedroom.
Scenes.
Different shutter settings for watching TV in the evening versus daytime (living room windows facing south and west).
Control by room for shutters,
Individual shutter control.
If one or more terrace doors are open, those shutters remain fully up until the door is closed (even if the central command is to lower or the evening automatic shutter is triggered). When the door closes, the shutters go down.
Ventilation function: If a window is tilted open and the shutter is down, the shutter will move to 90% closed (slats open).
What I have invested: An atom PC with 64GB SSD and logic/visualization software Edomi (€150) 4 actuators from BMS (€1200), 5 eight-button glass switches from MDT (€650) which are also used for scenes and lighting. Window contacts (about €25 per window) – the BMS has digital inputs that can be used for the window contacts.
The wiring is also simpler since you only need to run NYM cables from the shutter to the distribution box. (For me, 18 cables on the ground floor and 18 on the upper floor). Alternatively, you can run one NYM cable from shutter to shutter, but then the BUS cable must also be routed along, and actuators are installed decentrally. You generally have a connection point next to the shutter anyway.
The BUS cable can have any topology, meaning it can be run across the house in any layout except a ring. This makes it easier to retrofit or expand later.
Maybe someone could share what they paid for a traditional shutter control system. Surely there are some with electric shutters.
@sirhc: Sorry for the exclamation mark, but it seems you helped.
Just to share how things are set up for me.
Shutter functions:
Central control
Up in the morning, down at night, central down/up (36 shutters).
Ground floor up/down, upper floor up/down.
Zones
(Shading) South, east, west, north.
Dining/kitchen/living/bedroom.
Scenes.
Different shutter settings for watching TV in the evening versus daytime (living room windows facing south and west).
Control by room for shutters,
Individual shutter control.
If one or more terrace doors are open, those shutters remain fully up until the door is closed (even if the central command is to lower or the evening automatic shutter is triggered). When the door closes, the shutters go down.
Ventilation function: If a window is tilted open and the shutter is down, the shutter will move to 90% closed (slats open).
What I have invested: An atom PC with 64GB SSD and logic/visualization software Edomi (€150) 4 actuators from BMS (€1200), 5 eight-button glass switches from MDT (€650) which are also used for scenes and lighting. Window contacts (about €25 per window) – the BMS has digital inputs that can be used for the window contacts.
The wiring is also simpler since you only need to run NYM cables from the shutter to the distribution box. (For me, 18 cables on the ground floor and 18 on the upper floor). Alternatively, you can run one NYM cable from shutter to shutter, but then the BUS cable must also be routed along, and actuators are installed decentrally. You generally have a connection point next to the shutter anyway.
The BUS cable can have any topology, meaning it can be run across the house in any layout except a ring. This makes it easier to retrofit or expand later.
Maybe someone could share what they paid for a traditional shutter control system. Surely there are some with electric shutters.
