ᐅ Condensing Gas Boiler, Air-to-Water Heat Pump, Fuel Cells – Request for Advice
Created on: 9 Apr 2018 20:46
G
gmt94
Hello everyone,
We are currently in the planning phase for our new home. We are building an urban villa of about 157 m² (1,690 sq ft) according to energy-saving regulations.
My favorite option until this morning was a heat pump with deep geothermal drilling plus a conventional fireplace. However, the drilling company declined the order today due to too high a risk. So I need a new heating alternative.
We are three people: man, woman, and toddler, possibly a fourth child. The child usually takes a bath daily, so there will likely be a relatively high hot water consumption. A rain shower would be desirable.
1. Air-to-water heat pump – somehow I just can’t get comfortable with this option. On one hand, it bothers me that the system is very sensitive to outside temperature, and on the other hand, I’m concerned about the appearance on the house and the noise.
2. Gas condensing boiler with solar hot water support and central ventilation with heat recovery. Since this requires a relatively large water storage tank, I thought of installing a water-bearing (water-carrying) fireplace. This would reduce the risk of overheating the living room, among other things, and the remaining energy could be used for water heating. Woodworking is my hobby. I have a chainsaw license, saw, wood splitter, trailer, and relatively cheap wood is available.
3. My builder also suggested an alternative to the gas boiler: a fuel cell. I haven’t looked into this at all. Does anyone have experience with it?
I hope you can help me. Oh, and ground collectors are not an option due to insufficient space on the plot.
We are currently in the planning phase for our new home. We are building an urban villa of about 157 m² (1,690 sq ft) according to energy-saving regulations.
My favorite option until this morning was a heat pump with deep geothermal drilling plus a conventional fireplace. However, the drilling company declined the order today due to too high a risk. So I need a new heating alternative.
We are three people: man, woman, and toddler, possibly a fourth child. The child usually takes a bath daily, so there will likely be a relatively high hot water consumption. A rain shower would be desirable.
1. Air-to-water heat pump – somehow I just can’t get comfortable with this option. On one hand, it bothers me that the system is very sensitive to outside temperature, and on the other hand, I’m concerned about the appearance on the house and the noise.
2. Gas condensing boiler with solar hot water support and central ventilation with heat recovery. Since this requires a relatively large water storage tank, I thought of installing a water-bearing (water-carrying) fireplace. This would reduce the risk of overheating the living room, among other things, and the remaining energy could be used for water heating. Woodworking is my hobby. I have a chainsaw license, saw, wood splitter, trailer, and relatively cheap wood is available.
3. My builder also suggested an alternative to the gas boiler: a fuel cell. I haven’t looked into this at all. Does anyone have experience with it?
I hope you can help me. Oh, and ground collectors are not an option due to insufficient space on the plot.
markus270310 Apr 2018 09:52Lumpi_LE schrieb:
Solar thermal systems never pay off and also do not provide any comfort benefits. So, if possible, you can leave them out.Amazing how many facts are packed into just two sentences.
Someone clearly took offense...
Depending on the household size, around 1500 kWh of energy is needed annually for domestic hot water preparation.
At a gas price of 5 cents per kWh, that amounts to €75, and you say you can save 75%, which equals €56 savings per year.
One solar thermal system currently costs at least €5000 all-inclusive; if you build with a turnkey general contractor, it’s likely even more.
So, it would take 80 to 90 years to recoup the investment without interest. Over those 80 to 90 years, the system would likely need repair five times, and by then, you would probably have passed away.
Depending on the household size, around 1500 kWh of energy is needed annually for domestic hot water preparation.
At a gas price of 5 cents per kWh, that amounts to €75, and you say you can save 75%, which equals €56 savings per year.
One solar thermal system currently costs at least €5000 all-inclusive; if you build with a turnkey general contractor, it’s likely even more.
So, it would take 80 to 90 years to recoup the investment without interest. Over those 80 to 90 years, the system would likely need repair five times, and by then, you would probably have passed away.
markus270310 Apr 2018 10:50I’ll leave the values in your calculation as they are for now. However, there isn’t just one typical example like Max Mustermann, who, by the way, doesn’t get offended that easily :-)
We had to choose between either solar thermal panels or insulation to meet the energy saving regulations (building permit / planning permission). Since I’m not a fan of insulation boards on the house, the decision was quickly made. And I have to spend the 5,000€ anyway—whether on solar thermal, which according to your calculation saves me €56 per year, or on insulation boards that reduce my heating costs by €4.45 per month.
So, the decision often isn’t just about whether it makes sense or not, but rather which less sensible option offers more benefit.
We had to choose between either solar thermal panels or insulation to meet the energy saving regulations (building permit / planning permission). Since I’m not a fan of insulation boards on the house, the decision was quickly made. And I have to spend the 5,000€ anyway—whether on solar thermal, which according to your calculation saves me €56 per year, or on insulation boards that reduce my heating costs by €4.45 per month.
So, the decision often isn’t just about whether it makes sense or not, but rather which less sensible option offers more benefit.
markus2703 schrieb:
Amazing, so many facts in just two sentences.markus2703 schrieb:
Since I don’t like insulation panels on the house, the decision was quickly made. Just take a moment to consider it.
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