Hello everyone!
My husband and I are in the early stages of planning our house. We had to submit a preliminary house plan to our local municipality (Salzburg Land/Austria) on short notice due to certain requirements. We developed this plan together with our designer with very little preparation time.
We have a somewhat unusual floor plan, in our opinion, featuring a setback on the ground floor, and we mainly want to hear your opinions about this. Our primary concern is whether we have taken a completely absurd approach or if we can build on this basic idea. Our biggest issue is that so far we haven’t seen a single house with this type of floor plan (neither online nor in real life, at least around Salzburg and nearby ...) and naturally, we wonder why. Does it have any significant disadvantages? Does it look strange in any way?
We look forward to your feedback and are already very grateful for your constructive criticism and especially your time to help us.
Now to the questionnaire:
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size 920 m² (9,900 sq ft)
Slope Elevated plot, gently sloping on three sides
Owners’ requirements
Style, roof type, building type rural-modern, gable roof, two-family house
Basement, floors Basement, 2 full floors, attic
Number of occupants, ages Currently three (28, 29, and 8 months old) with 1-2 more children planned
Space requirements on ground and upper floors
Ground floor: spacious open kitchen with integrated pantry, dining area, living room, WC, bathroom, office (later a bedroom)
Upper floor: 3 children’s bedrooms, family bathroom, WC
Attic: master bedroom with bathroom and an additional room (extra bedroom / hobby room)
Ground floor + upper floor approx. 200 m² (2,150 sq ft); attic size not yet finalized
Office For family use and later bedroom
Kitchen L-shaped with cooking island and wood stove
Number of dining seats 6-8, possibly extendable table for more space
Fireplace Yes – planned as a room divider between living room and "common room"
Balcony Balcony on the first floor – should eventually be large enough for the second family
Garage Small garage for 1 vehicle and a larger garage for 2 vehicles
House design
Planned by:
Designer from a construction company
What do you particularly like? Why?
Cost estimate according to architect/designer not yet available – only a preliminary draft
Personal budget for house including fixtures and fittings 350,000 € (with a lot of personal labor)
Preferred heating technology Heat pump
If you had to give up something, which features/finishes
- Could give up: attic expansion initially, but want to keep the possibility for future use
- Cannot give up: a cozy and large kitchen/dining area is very important to us
Why does the design look the way it does?
The most important aspect of our planning is that the house can be converted into a two-family home in the future when one of our children would need it, earliest in 20–25 years. That would mean one living unit on the ground floor and a second on the first floor plus the attic.
The office planned on the ground floor would then be used as a bedroom. The staircase can be completely separated with a (already marked) wall but is intended to remain open until then.
The attic is planned to house the master bedroom with bathroom. This is where the plan shows the biggest weaknesses for us: the bedroom is too large, and the bathroom is too small. This definitely needs to be changed.
Why sleep in the attic? There is not enough space on the ground floor, and we want to keep privacy from the children’s bedrooms so that when our kids are older and have friends/partners visiting, everyone can have their own space. We know this might be inconvenient with small children/babies due to additional distances, but since children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 are relatively large, siblings could share a room, and bedroom 3 could serve as a “backup bedroom” for us. We are only planning for two children but you never know!
If later children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 become kitchen/living areas, there would then be one bedroom on the first floor and two more in the attic.
What we particularly like is the idea of the split-level living room. We are aware that opinions on this are very divided and most experts discourage it. However, the level difference is only 36 cm (2 steps), and we believe it will be manageable even as we get older.
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
We would really like to know from you:
My husband and I are in the early stages of planning our house. We had to submit a preliminary house plan to our local municipality (Salzburg Land/Austria) on short notice due to certain requirements. We developed this plan together with our designer with very little preparation time.
We have a somewhat unusual floor plan, in our opinion, featuring a setback on the ground floor, and we mainly want to hear your opinions about this. Our primary concern is whether we have taken a completely absurd approach or if we can build on this basic idea. Our biggest issue is that so far we haven’t seen a single house with this type of floor plan (neither online nor in real life, at least around Salzburg and nearby ...) and naturally, we wonder why. Does it have any significant disadvantages? Does it look strange in any way?
We look forward to your feedback and are already very grateful for your constructive criticism and especially your time to help us.
Now to the questionnaire:
Development plan / Restrictions
Plot size 920 m² (9,900 sq ft)
Slope Elevated plot, gently sloping on three sides
Owners’ requirements
Style, roof type, building type rural-modern, gable roof, two-family house
Basement, floors Basement, 2 full floors, attic
Number of occupants, ages Currently three (28, 29, and 8 months old) with 1-2 more children planned
Space requirements on ground and upper floors
Ground floor: spacious open kitchen with integrated pantry, dining area, living room, WC, bathroom, office (later a bedroom)
Upper floor: 3 children’s bedrooms, family bathroom, WC
Attic: master bedroom with bathroom and an additional room (extra bedroom / hobby room)
Ground floor + upper floor approx. 200 m² (2,150 sq ft); attic size not yet finalized
Office For family use and later bedroom
Kitchen L-shaped with cooking island and wood stove
Number of dining seats 6-8, possibly extendable table for more space
Fireplace Yes – planned as a room divider between living room and "common room"
Balcony Balcony on the first floor – should eventually be large enough for the second family
Garage Small garage for 1 vehicle and a larger garage for 2 vehicles
House design
Planned by:
Designer from a construction company
What do you particularly like? Why?
- “Split-level” living room – in our opinion, this creates a visual separation between the kitchen/dining area and is our little “highlight.” The living room remains a distinct living space and doesn’t get cluttered with toys because the common room offers plenty of space.
- “Common room” – this refers to the area between the living room and kitchen in front of the terrace door – lots of space for children to play and creates an open atmosphere while keeping the living room somewhat separated. Where a sofa is drawn, a fireplace with a reading corner as a room divider is also planned.
- Setback at the terrace – seating area covered and wind-protected with privacy screening. The resulting floor plan (where the living room is not directly adjacent to the kitchen and dining area as in many open-concept designs) is something we like.
- The office is intended to become our bedroom later, but in our opinion, it is currently too small for that.
- Main entrance is in the basement – spatially, the floor plan doesn’t allow for another solution; otherwise, the entrance would be on the back of the house, which we do not like. However, there is certainly another entrance on the ground floor for easier access when bringing in groceries, so you don’t have to carry everything through the basement.
- The cloakroom in the basement is still too small but can be easily enlarged – just mentioning this in case someone notices.
Cost estimate according to architect/designer not yet available – only a preliminary draft
Personal budget for house including fixtures and fittings 350,000 € (with a lot of personal labor)
Preferred heating technology Heat pump
If you had to give up something, which features/finishes
- Could give up: attic expansion initially, but want to keep the possibility for future use
- Cannot give up: a cozy and large kitchen/dining area is very important to us
Why does the design look the way it does?
The most important aspect of our planning is that the house can be converted into a two-family home in the future when one of our children would need it, earliest in 20–25 years. That would mean one living unit on the ground floor and a second on the first floor plus the attic.
The office planned on the ground floor would then be used as a bedroom. The staircase can be completely separated with a (already marked) wall but is intended to remain open until then.
The attic is planned to house the master bedroom with bathroom. This is where the plan shows the biggest weaknesses for us: the bedroom is too large, and the bathroom is too small. This definitely needs to be changed.
Why sleep in the attic? There is not enough space on the ground floor, and we want to keep privacy from the children’s bedrooms so that when our kids are older and have friends/partners visiting, everyone can have their own space. We know this might be inconvenient with small children/babies due to additional distances, but since children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 are relatively large, siblings could share a room, and bedroom 3 could serve as a “backup bedroom” for us. We are only planning for two children but you never know!
If later children’s bedrooms 1 and 2 become kitchen/living areas, there would then be one bedroom on the first floor and two more in the attic.
What we particularly like is the idea of the split-level living room. We are aware that opinions on this are very divided and most experts discourage it. However, the level difference is only 36 cm (2 steps), and we believe it will be manageable even as we get older.
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan in 130 characters?
We would really like to know from you:
- Is there a name for this floor plan style (like L-shaped or U-shaped)?
- What do you think in general about the idea of the setback? We like the idea of having a covered terrace area and the resulting floor plan. We haven’t seen houses or floor plans like this before (if at all, only with bungalows) and wonder why? Does nobody like it, or are there disadvantages we are overlooking? Do you have experiences with sunlight exposure – will it be a problem that the setback measures 3.5 m (11.5 ft) from the balcony edge to the terrace door?
- Even though we love the idea, we would appreciate experiences and opinions on the split-level living room.
- Would you build the wall separating the common room from the living room (shown as 1.20 m (4 ft) high in the plan) all the way to the ceiling?
- Suggestions and ideas for the office/bedroom on the ground floor – how could the layout be changed to make the room at least 5 m² (54 sq ft) larger?
G
goldmarieeeee5 Jun 2019 22:32ypg schrieb:
The first step would be financing. Well, not financing itself, but a meeting with the bank to find out how much house you can afford.
Where do the 350,000 come from? Is that just a rough estimate?
You already have the plot of land.
Let’s take the 350,000 (with a lot of subsidies),
then subtract 30,000 for the additional construction costs, leaving 320,000.
At 2,000 €/sqm (185 $/sqft), you could build 150 sqm (1,615 sqft)... let’s just reserve 20,000 for the kitchen and so on.
Even if subsidies apply... let’s just take that figure. Or, say, 160 sqm (1,722 sqft)... garage and garden materials cost as well.
That explains a house with a ground floor and upper floor, whether it’s one or two stories. No basement, no complicated garage, no balconies, no finished attic.
Now distribute your room plan over 160 sqm (1,722 sqft). This isn’t done by sketching but by listing what you need:
Living room: 20 sqm (215 sqft)
Open-plan kitchen/living area: 25 sqm (269 sqft)
3 children's rooms: 45 sqm (484 sqft)
etc.
Only this way does it make sense. You don’t need to submit anything else. Maybe include the attic as a question mark, whether it will be built or not.
Just a side note, without focusing on the budget issue:
You can’t simply make one room bigger without the upper floor “growing” accordingly.
You can’t see it that way. If you plan a house from the start to be split later into two separate living units, and the ground floor unit will be for retirement with about 80 sqm (860 sqft), then you should plan a guest WC that provides enough space for older age. An additional guest WC would then be unnecessary in relation to the size and use of the apartment.
Your fallback option (by the way, I know other similar U-shaped floor plans) is your least problem. - Thank you for your tips regarding the budget; I already briefly mentioned this above.
- I didn’t mean making the room larger but rather “shifting” spaces within the floor plan to use it more efficiently. It’s a bit hard to explain, but you have an idea what I mean ;-O
- Basically, I understand your point about the guest WC. But I see it this way: all guests or my children’s friends will naturally use the WC on the ground floor, and I would prefer not to invite everyone into the full bathroom at any time. Besides, personally, I find having a toilet and bath in the same room quite unpleasant. However, I could imagine reducing the size of the bathroom with a good room layout...
G
goldmarieeeee5 Jun 2019 22:49haydee schrieb:
Wrong order
1. Financial framework
2. Floor plan
The financial framework determines what is possible, not your wishes.
You mentioned 350,000, Ypg estimated 600,000, and that already includes a lot of your own work. If you build move-in ready, it would be 600,000 plus basement plus garage plus attic plus additional construction costs, which are high here due to the slope plus landscaping.
If a child stays, you can, for example, partition off the TV area and convert it into a bedroom.
Without children, you don’t need such a large space.
Split-level: my parents-in-law have a true split-level house and complain every day. They immediately said we shouldn’t build like that.
Your child is becoming mobile now. Do you want to watch out for it not accidentally falling down the stairs for the next two years?
With a broken leg at 30, later rheumatism, various age-related aches and pains.
Looking at the side view, you are really building up quite a bit. How does it actually run?
I can’t read the height dimensions properly.
You absolutely must draw the correct furniture to scale in every room on the floor plan.
Later expansion: you will pay off debts, maintain the house and support 3 children—money will not increase.
Regarding the floor plan:
Basement entrance and wardrobe are too small
What will you use the basement for?
Ground floor:
Pantry seems very narrow
Why one bathroom plus an extra toilet?
As Ypg noted, where is the dining table?
Upper floor:
Stairs are not aligned. You should try a different layout.
Again, 1.5 bathrooms here as well
I would plan a standard sleeping floor with 2 children’s rooms and 1 master bedroom.
Attic: don’t convert it at all
You have rooms on every floor that you don’t use. Hello haydee—thanks to you as well for your feedback.
- I don’t want to revisit the budget topic, as I’ve already addressed it above.
- I like the idea of using the living room/bedroom option.
- I think a true split-level house is a completely different matter than our two steps. For children, there are these safety gates that you would need anyway on the upper floor near the stairs. In relation to how long my children need supervision and how long I will live in this house, I can accept that. Of course, you are totally right about your concerns regarding old age, but you could play that “what-if” game endlessly...
- I already wrote that the basement entrance on the ground floor is too small. The basement will house the utility room, complete storage for garden/outdoor equipment/car/bikes, etc. You can never have enough storage space, especially with kids and planning two households in one house.
- You are right about the pantry—it’s almost too small for me as well.
- I have already explained the separate bathroom/toilet setup. I just find it very impractical.
- The dining table or corner bench is planned in front of the window opposite the kitchen. Is that space too small?
- What do you mean by a different staircase location?
- Yes, as I wrote, it is also an option for us not to convert the attic (for now).
Thank you for your help!!
G
goldmarieeeee5 Jun 2019 22:56Niloa schrieb:
We have two steps on the ground floor between the kitchen/dining area and the living room. I find it quite annoying and am already looking forward to not having that in our next house. It mainly bothers me when vacuuming/cleaning.
I would reconsider whether the house really should be planned as a multi-family home. There is too much uncertainty in that. Who knows what will happen in 20-25 years, where work or studies will take the children, whether they even want to live there, or whether you will still want to live there yourselves. I think it’s not worth it. Hello Niloa! Thanks for your feedback!
I can understand the cleaning issue, but do you find the steps visually appealing, or do you not like the whole idea at all?
The multi-family house issue is probably a fundamental question. Our position is that times are not getting any easier, and if possible, we want to support our children as best as we can, just as we are supported by our parents. Both of our brothers still live at home at ages 25 and 30, maybe that is more common in rural areas.
Apart from that, the apartment can always be rented out to third parties!
goldmarieeeee schrieb:
Our two brothers, aged 25 and 30, still live at home—maybe that’s more common in rural areas :eek Does that lead to shows like "Wife Swap"? Here, men that age are usually not considered as life partners... but that would be a topic for another forum. Sorry for going off-topic... but with THAT setup... hehe
G
goldmarieeeee5 Jun 2019 23:1411ant schrieb:
Can this be explained in simple terms?
The building design seems highly concentrated and complex, similar to model train houses where some details are exaggerated in scale or the variety and density appear slightly overloaded.
I also share the concern that the irregularity (the floor plans don’t seem to belong to the same building, and so on) will actually require considerable financial investment that won’t be reflected in the living quality afterward.
To me, the design looks like it was inspired by buildings developed over three hundred years in alpine regions (including Swiss ones). To say it bluntly: almost like how the average ugly German tourist imagines how the local native would live. It’s almost as if a wolpertinger might come out of the cuckoo clock. Dear 11ant, maybe you can’t imagine it, but we are actually fortunate to live where the “average ugly German tourist” loves to spend their vacation. And even though I find this discussion pointless anyway, I just want to clarify that this initial draft, with its exterior design (balconies, stone wall, etc.), does not correspond to our ideas either. However, we did not want to make this the focus of our discussion with you.
G
goldmarieeeee5 Jun 2019 23:17ypg schrieb:
Do they end up on "Daughters-in-law Wanted"? At this age, men like that aren’t usually chosen as life partners... but that’s a topic for another forum. Sorry for the off-topic... but with THAT setup... hehe Oh, you’d be surprised. Both are in relationships and well established in life. But wasting money on rent instead of saving for your own house isn’t always the worst decision.
Similar topics