Hello everyone,
My wooden house is nearly complete, and I want to handle the wiring myself. I will have the builder’s electrician show me where to run the cables, which beams I am allowed to drill through, etc., but the circuit breaker panel, outlets, and so on will be installed by the electrician.
The challenge starts already with sourcing the materials and choosing the cables.
- Expert 1 (architect and trained electrician): A 5x1.5mm² (with 13A breaker) feed line to each room, then from there 3x1.5mm² cable to lights and outlets. Reason: Less material, smaller breaker panel, less work.
- Expert 2 (master electrician): 3x2.5mm² cable to each room for outlets and 3x1.5mm² to each room for lighting. Outlets protected by a 16A breaker. His reason: If the outlet breaker trips, the lights remain on, and the outlets have a higher load capacity.
- Expert 3 (master electrician): For himself, he would choose expert 2’s option. He could live with expert 1’s option, but then with a 5x2.5mm² feed line and then 3x2.5mm² to outlets and 3x2.5mm² to lighting.
My goal is, of course, to save costs and reduce work. Since I plan to treat each room separately, it seems unlikely that a 1.5mm² line with a 13A breaker would be overloaded. You’d have to run a TV, 2000W vacuum cleaner, hairdryer, lights, and radio all at the same time in one room for something to happen, right? Seems unlikely, doesn’t it? My father used to combine several rooms on one circuit in his old house, and breakers only tripped every few years. Then you just go to the basement with a flashlight and reset the breaker... done!
Of course, major appliances have their own circuits, and the stove has a thicker cable, which is logical.
As a non-expert, I don’t see a need for multiple breakers/circuits in every room. But are there any professionals here who have a different opinion?
Regards,
Tito
My wooden house is nearly complete, and I want to handle the wiring myself. I will have the builder’s electrician show me where to run the cables, which beams I am allowed to drill through, etc., but the circuit breaker panel, outlets, and so on will be installed by the electrician.
The challenge starts already with sourcing the materials and choosing the cables.
- Expert 1 (architect and trained electrician): A 5x1.5mm² (with 13A breaker) feed line to each room, then from there 3x1.5mm² cable to lights and outlets. Reason: Less material, smaller breaker panel, less work.
- Expert 2 (master electrician): 3x2.5mm² cable to each room for outlets and 3x1.5mm² to each room for lighting. Outlets protected by a 16A breaker. His reason: If the outlet breaker trips, the lights remain on, and the outlets have a higher load capacity.
- Expert 3 (master electrician): For himself, he would choose expert 2’s option. He could live with expert 1’s option, but then with a 5x2.5mm² feed line and then 3x2.5mm² to outlets and 3x2.5mm² to lighting.
My goal is, of course, to save costs and reduce work. Since I plan to treat each room separately, it seems unlikely that a 1.5mm² line with a 13A breaker would be overloaded. You’d have to run a TV, 2000W vacuum cleaner, hairdryer, lights, and radio all at the same time in one room for something to happen, right? Seems unlikely, doesn’t it? My father used to combine several rooms on one circuit in his old house, and breakers only tripped every few years. Then you just go to the basement with a flashlight and reset the breaker... done!
Of course, major appliances have their own circuits, and the stove has a thicker cable, which is logical.
As a non-expert, I don’t see a need for multiple breakers/circuits in every room. But are there any professionals here who have a different opinion?
Regards,
Tito
S
Steffen809 May 2017 13:08Peanuts74 schrieb:
Toaster, kettle, hairdryer, etc...
I can’t understand how people try to save about 50 euros on cables when they’re spending nearly a million on the house. But then they want every technical gadget with KNX, etc...The reason is obviously not cost savings (in case you hadn’t figured that out yourself), but the problems that occur when using 2.5mm² (5 AWG) cables during terminal connections. In a junction box with continuous KNX, 1-Wire cables, sensors, and sockets, space is very tight despite using a deep or double junction box! That alone is the reason for choosing 1.5mm² (16 AWG).
(A kettle isn’t really necessary, hairdryers and toasters only run briefly and don’t draw that much power.)
titoz schrieb:
Well, I’m only laying the cables. I’ll have someone else connect the sockets and the fuse box.Pulling cables is usually a task for assistants or apprentices. However, assistants or apprentices typically don’t work alone; a qualified technician who is familiar with installation regulations is usually present. With modern installation methods using conduits, cables should not come into direct contact with insulation (or any other materials that require clearance).
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
T
toxicmolotof9 May 2017 14:00titoz schrieb:
I wonder how often it happens that everything in a room is turned on at the same time and the total power consumption exceeds 2,500 W.Basically, it’s relatively rare, but you can reach that level quite quickly.
In a child’s room, the gaming PC is running at medium load (500 W), the radio is on, a desk lamp is lit, a network switch, a few devices on standby, phone chargers, a PS3, and so on... let’s ignore those for now. Then the mother comes in with the vacuum cleaner (800 W) and the son starts a print job on a basic 120 euro laser printer. It has a 10-second warm-up phase at 1,000 W.
Altogether, for a brief moment, you easily reach around 2,300 W without considering the base load or other devices.
So, I don’t find such a scenario unrealistic for a 16-year-old’s bedroom. And yes, of course there are solutions for this.
S
Steffen809 May 2017 14:14toxicmolotow schrieb:
for a momentPlease study the basics of electrical engineering. "For a moment" is exactly the right keyword! There is a difference between "for a moment" and a continuous load of 3 hours.
At the topping-out ceremony, I had to improvise a bit (it was cold) and "blocked" a 16A fuse in the construction power distribution box. There were two 3500 watt heaters connected at the same time. It ran for about 4 hours. The cable was definitely quite hot... BUT even for a few minutes, nothing would have happened or it would not have become very warm.
Steffen80 schrieb:
The reason is, of course, not cost savings (in case you hadn’t considered that…), but the issues caused by using 2.5mm² wire when clamping. In a junction box with continuous KNX, 1Wire cables, sensors, and an outlet, it’s very tight even with a deep or double-gang box! That alone is the reason for using 1.5mm².
(You don’t need a kettle, and hair dryers and toasters are only used briefly and don’t draw that much)Oh yes, I installed 2.5mm² wire everywhere and curse every time I have to do wiring in the deep box now. [emoji3]S
Steffen809 May 2017 14:26ONeill schrieb:
Oh yes, I installed 2.5 everywhere and I curse every time I have to wire something in a deep box now. [emoji3]Sounds ironic... as I said, it’s not about 2 incoming 5x2.5 cables, but 2x 5.25 + KNX + 1Wire + this and that (reed switch, for example, on windows)...