ᐅ Use of District Heating – Are Consumption and Costs Typical?
Created on: 10 Feb 2018 07:36
R
Rollo83
Good morning.
I’m curious to know who here uses district heating.
We live as two people in a semi-detached house of about 130m2 (1,400 sq ft) built at the end of 2015, with underfloor heating. We use very little heating and rarely shower at home since we exercise five times a week.
Yesterday, the district heating bill arrived.
Rounded up, it was 10,000 kWh/year with an additional charge of nearly €150.
That means from now on a monthly payment of €107. I somehow find that “very expensive.”
I’m curious to know who here uses district heating.
We live as two people in a semi-detached house of about 130m2 (1,400 sq ft) built at the end of 2015, with underfloor heating. We use very little heating and rarely shower at home since we exercise five times a week.
Yesterday, the district heating bill arrived.
Rounded up, it was 10,000 kWh/year with an additional charge of nearly €150.
That means from now on a monthly payment of €107. I somehow find that “very expensive.”
M
Mastermind111 Feb 2018 21:47blaupuma schrieb:
In our new development area, district heating is mandatory.
Although, even if I had a choice, district heating was recommended to me.
Absolutely reliable
No extra maintenance costs
If there is a defect or something similar, the service comes immediately and repairs it free of charge.
The heating system never needs to be replaced.
It is apparently not uncommon for gas or geothermal systems to incur significant costs after the warranty expires.
The question in many rural areas is, what is the one-time connection cost for a new build? For our mother’s place, they wanted a one-time connection fee of 11,000€ (about $12,000) including the transfer station, plus an additional hot water storage tank needed for summer.
Fortunately, there was no obligation to connect.
And the subsidy for the system runs out (upon inquiry) in about 5 years—what happens if there are no more subsidies?
Then district heating would become a problem for us.
Price per kWh around 4 cents. Basic service fee?
Our current plan:
(Passive house—planned from the start)
Brine heat pump (around 6,000€ / about $6,500)
Ground collectors 2,000€ (about $2,200) (self-built) installed during soil/garden excavation (1,000€ / about $1,100)
The heat pump including installation is thus cheaper than the pure district heating connection.
+ Additionally, a photovoltaic system of 7–10 kWp.
10 kWp costs about 12,000€ (about $13,000). (Return on investment after 7–10 years—faster if electricity prices rise)
This should reduce heating, hot water, and household electricity costs to zero, or even generate a small surplus.
I prefer the combination of heat pump and photovoltaics far more than district heating.
P.S. We are now getting district heating as a backup for 1,000€ (about $1,100) in case our heating fails, without any obligations.
P.S. And regarding district heating having no maintenance or repair costs—well, that cost is simply passed on to the customer...
But don’t fool yourself. While achieving zero heating costs is possible, consider how much extra investment you have already made. The premium for a passive house compared to the energy-saving regulation (building code) standard. Photovoltaic system, geothermal drilling, and so on.
With district heating, one usually builds to energy-saving regulation standard without a heating system and pays connection fees and transfer station costs. Usually, this is much, much less than your additional expenses. Now you just have to save against that. I wonder if I’ll still see that at 60.
With district heating, one usually builds to energy-saving regulation standard without a heating system and pays connection fees and transfer station costs. Usually, this is much, much less than your additional expenses. Now you just have to save against that. I wonder if I’ll still see that at 60.
M
Mastermind111 Feb 2018 22:37Nordlys schrieb:
But don’t fool yourself. Although zero heating costs are achievable, what extra investments have you already made? The additional cost of a passive house compared to the standard energy-saving regulation. Photovoltaic system, geothermal drilling, and so on...
With district heating, you build according to the standard energy-saving regulation without a heating system and pay connection fees and transfer point costs. Usually, that is much, much less than your additional expenses. Now you have to save against that. Will I still see this at 60? The passive house standard was a given! A large house with a large plot is being sold, and a downsizing is planned. Everything is designed for accessibility on one level.
No geothermal drilling—instead, geothermal baskets. That means the earthworks contractor digs a bit more, places the baskets, and it’s done.
Since the municipality requires a partial roof area’s rainwater to be managed via a soakaway trench, it’s a perfect combination. The rainwater additionally warms the soil.
We calculate a realistic annual performance factor of 5. Since the source temperature is surely above 0°C (32°F), probably between 5–10°C (41–50°F).
2000 kWh for heating
1000 kWh for hot water.
3000 kWh divided by an annual performance factor of 5 equals 600 kWh electricity demand for heating, plus a generous safety margin... 1000 kWh electricity for heating + hot water.
At €0.25 per kWh, that’s €250 in annual energy costs.
As I said, every new build (that wants district heating) pays €11,000 in the development area—that’s, well, questionable—and that’s with a monopoly!
That means the €2,000 saved compared to the district heating connection could cover about eight years of heating/hot water costs.
Can someone tell me what the future of district heating will be politically in eight years?
I don’t rely on a system that only looks attractive due to EU/German subsidies—as long as the funding lasts... and the fact that biomass is used here is not really to our taste anyway.
M
Mastermind112 Feb 2018 07:53Completely forgot, we will get at least €4000 (around $4400) back from BAFA as a subsidy.
So the €9000 (about $9900) investment effectively becomes €5000 (about $5500).
This means we save around €6000 (about $6600) compared to our previous heating system connection. With that, we can pay for heating and hot water for 24 years (without price increases).
Or use it to cover the cost of a 5 kWp photovoltaic system...
So the €9000 (about $9900) investment effectively becomes €5000 (about $5500).
This means we save around €6000 (about $6600) compared to our previous heating system connection. With that, we can pay for heating and hot water for 24 years (without price increases).
Or use it to cover the cost of a 5 kWp photovoltaic system...
B
Bieber081512 Feb 2018 08:15blaupuma schrieb:
[...]District heating [...] Absolutely reliable[,] No extra maintenance costs[.] If there is a defect or similar issue, service comes immediately and repairs it free of charge. The heating system never has to be replaced.That is definitely not free of charge. In my opinion, district heating is a kind of all-inclusive package; you have warmth without having to worry about the technology, space for equipment, maintenance, and so on. This package must(!) come at a price and over a period of, say, 20 years, it will initially be more expensive than an individual gas boiler or a comparable system. The advantage of district heating could then be a dilution of fixed costs. It is generally (specifically) cheaper to heat 100 houses or housing units with one large plant than to do the same with 100 small systems. Part of these savings goes toward administration, part remains as profit for the operator, and ideally, a portion also benefits the users.Beyond the pure cost considerations, there is of course the feeling of having your "own" heating system or not. And naturally, choice options are limited (mandatory district heating yes/no, gas supply yes/no, energy saving regulations, renewable energy heating laws).
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