M
MBPassion4 Dec 2020 19:17Hello everyone,
We are currently having our house (built in 1961) completely renovated, which also includes the floors. Before the work on them begins, I was informed that the screed in the entrance area definitely needs to be completely replaced, and that there are many cracks in the attic floor that need to be repaired. I don’t doubt this assessment—especially in the entrance area, the floor was literally crumbling.
What surprises me, however, are the estimated costs, so I wanted to ask whether these seem reasonable. Here is the breakdown (all net prices):
Ground floor (8 m² (86 sq ft))
Attic floor (18.00 m² (194 sq ft))
The work is done by professionals—I’m not trying to haggle over every last cent, and good work should be fairly paid. However, the usual costs for floor work per square meter were more in the range of €50 plus materials (parquet); here, the screed costs are over €220 per m². What do you think? Could these costs be correct?
We are currently having our house (built in 1961) completely renovated, which also includes the floors. Before the work on them begins, I was informed that the screed in the entrance area definitely needs to be completely replaced, and that there are many cracks in the attic floor that need to be repaired. I don’t doubt this assessment—especially in the entrance area, the floor was literally crumbling.
What surprises me, however, are the estimated costs, so I wanted to ask whether these seem reasonable. Here is the breakdown (all net prices):
Ground floor (8 m² (86 sq ft))
- Mechanically remove screed, transport debris, and dispose of it professionally.
- Cost: €367.52
- Supply and install insulation boards, deliver screed material, apply fresh screed and smooth it. Screed thickness approx. 4 cm (1.6 inches). Product: Sopro M5
- Cost: €1,418.32
Attic floor (18.00 m² (194 sq ft))
- Cut open and clean screed cracks; insert screed staples; mix, fill, and smooth 2-component epoxy resin, then scatter with quartz sand. 5.00 units
- Cost: €313.75
- Mill and clean screed; prime with SHP; supply, cut, and embed fabric into Schönox SG. After drying, prime again with Schönox SHP.
- Cost: €1,337.04
The work is done by professionals—I’m not trying to haggle over every last cent, and good work should be fairly paid. However, the usual costs for floor work per square meter were more in the range of €50 plus materials (parquet); here, the screed costs are over €220 per m². What do you think? Could these costs be correct?
N
nordanney4 Dec 2020 20:09Additional charges for small areas. 120 sqm (1,292 sq ft) of anhydrite screed 45 mm (1.8 inches) for 2,000 - 2,500€ net (just the installation with material – comes directly from the machine). For you, it might have to be mixed by hand.
With a sledgehammer, 2 hours of work, and a trip to the recycling center, you could manage at least the 8 sqm (86 sq ft) for 0€.
With a sledgehammer, 2 hours of work, and a trip to the recycling center, you could manage at least the 8 sqm (86 sq ft) for 0€.
H
hampshire5 Dec 2020 12:02The costs are reasonable. The setup costs for small areas are similar to those for large areas. Therefore, the price per square meter is higher.
Imagine you drive 5 km (3 miles) to the supermarket and buy one bottle of soda. Your neighbor drives to the same supermarket and buys a whole case of the same soda. Who ends up paying a higher price per liter when considering the travel costs?
Imagine you drive 5 km (3 miles) to the supermarket and buy one bottle of soda. Your neighbor drives to the same supermarket and buys a whole case of the same soda. Who ends up paying a higher price per liter when considering the travel costs?
You are all correct that smaller areas generally involve higher effort for scaffolding and machine cleaning compared to larger areas.
BUT!
The removal of a floating screed with disposal (mixed waste) will cost around €8 per m² (for removal) and an additional approximately €35 per m³ (that is, per cubic meter) for mixed construction waste disposal.
And it was only 8 m² (86 ft²) on the ground floor. That means: removal estimated at €65 to €70, plus (8 m² x 0.05 m = 0.4 m³ (14 ft³)) another approximately €15; so roughly under €100 for the ground floor removal.
Now, with Sopro M5, we are not talking about "anhydrite screed" (see NORDANNEY), which has been called "calcium sulfate screed" for about 15 years now, but rather a cement-based fast screed! Personal note: anyone mixing the screed manually will probably give up after the first 5 m² of screed installation. That won’t work!
I cannot assess the cost of the insulation layer, as it might either be impact sound insulation or more likely thermal insulation (in case of earth-contact construction).
So, let’s calculate without any insulation material: €65 per m² (8 cm (3 inches) thickness assumed; with flexural tensile strength F6 this fits residential construction).
8 m² x €65 per m² equals €520 (approximate figure).
Then, including removal and installation work, we have (€520 + €100 + €70) = €690.
Plus travel costs, overhead, etc.
The cost estimate of €1,785.84 (total of your figures for the ground floor only) is therefore very generous!
Regarding the attic:
What exactly are units in connection with crack repair?
Crack repairs are usually charged by linear meter.
If €8 per linear meter were quoted, that would be reasonable.
2 kg of epoxy resin costs about 2 x €15 = €30 for the contractor, who would likely charge you around €60 to €70 including a markup, unless charged by linear meter.
€313.75 is quite expensive.
Grinding:
The difference between “grinding” and “milling” has become less clear with modern tools. In many cases, these two surface preparation methods cannot be clearly distinguished anymore.
However, a full-surface fleece fabric plus Schönox SG only makes sense if the screed is considered "critical." It may have been the case in your situation; I do not know for sure.
I only get attentive regarding the second primer with Schönox SHP on top of the described construction, which should be used on non-absorbent substrates for subsequent tile work, as described in the product data sheet. The smoothing primer Schönox SG is not meant for that!
Long story short:
The total sum of €3,436.61 for just a few square meters seems rather high to me.
However, since the work has already been done, it was presumably based on some kind of offer provided beforehand, indicating your consent at the time of execution.
Otherwise, this is likely one of many cases I have encountered professionally where the client can only grit their teeth; the effort necessary for a legal dispute to recover some of the costs is usually disproportionate to the risk of losing the case.
Sometimes you just have to close your eyes, take a deep breath, and then focus on a more pleasant matter….
Regards, KlaRa
BUT!
The removal of a floating screed with disposal (mixed waste) will cost around €8 per m² (for removal) and an additional approximately €35 per m³ (that is, per cubic meter) for mixed construction waste disposal.
And it was only 8 m² (86 ft²) on the ground floor. That means: removal estimated at €65 to €70, plus (8 m² x 0.05 m = 0.4 m³ (14 ft³)) another approximately €15; so roughly under €100 for the ground floor removal.
Now, with Sopro M5, we are not talking about "anhydrite screed" (see NORDANNEY), which has been called "calcium sulfate screed" for about 15 years now, but rather a cement-based fast screed! Personal note: anyone mixing the screed manually will probably give up after the first 5 m² of screed installation. That won’t work!
I cannot assess the cost of the insulation layer, as it might either be impact sound insulation or more likely thermal insulation (in case of earth-contact construction).
So, let’s calculate without any insulation material: €65 per m² (8 cm (3 inches) thickness assumed; with flexural tensile strength F6 this fits residential construction).
8 m² x €65 per m² equals €520 (approximate figure).
Then, including removal and installation work, we have (€520 + €100 + €70) = €690.
Plus travel costs, overhead, etc.
The cost estimate of €1,785.84 (total of your figures for the ground floor only) is therefore very generous!
Regarding the attic:
What exactly are units in connection with crack repair?
Crack repairs are usually charged by linear meter.
If €8 per linear meter were quoted, that would be reasonable.
2 kg of epoxy resin costs about 2 x €15 = €30 for the contractor, who would likely charge you around €60 to €70 including a markup, unless charged by linear meter.
€313.75 is quite expensive.
Grinding:
The difference between “grinding” and “milling” has become less clear with modern tools. In many cases, these two surface preparation methods cannot be clearly distinguished anymore.
However, a full-surface fleece fabric plus Schönox SG only makes sense if the screed is considered "critical." It may have been the case in your situation; I do not know for sure.
I only get attentive regarding the second primer with Schönox SHP on top of the described construction, which should be used on non-absorbent substrates for subsequent tile work, as described in the product data sheet. The smoothing primer Schönox SG is not meant for that!
Long story short:
The total sum of €3,436.61 for just a few square meters seems rather high to me.
However, since the work has already been done, it was presumably based on some kind of offer provided beforehand, indicating your consent at the time of execution.
Otherwise, this is likely one of many cases I have encountered professionally where the client can only grit their teeth; the effort necessary for a legal dispute to recover some of the costs is usually disproportionate to the risk of losing the case.
Sometimes you just have to close your eyes, take a deep breath, and then focus on a more pleasant matter….
Regards, KlaRa
Similar topics