ᐅ Construction of an approximately 190 sqm urban villa in Hesse (Wetterau district)
Created on: 10 Jul 2022 17:36
D
Dribbdebach
Dear Homebuilding Community,
First of all, thank you very much for the countless tips and suggestions from all of you. I have been visiting this forum for many years and have always greatly benefited from it.
Accordingly, I would like to give something back by sharing our building project here. However, this is not entirely selfless—I welcome advice and recommendations.
For about 10 years, I have been searching for a house and have viewed many existing properties. Building was initially not an option, as plots were either unavailable or far too expensive. So far, I haven’t found the ideal house, but nearly 10 years ago I bought my first condominium and then a second one two years ago. Both apartments are now rented out, currently almost breaking even, and in about a year they will start generating income.
Fortunately, we have now purchased a plot in a new development area and, despite the challenging situation, want to fulfill the dream of owning our own house.
A few details about us:
About the house:
Regarding the budget for the house:
About 570,000 euros remain, we are estimating around 60,000 euros for additional construction-related costs.
Outdoor work will be done gradually by ourselves, a garage could also be postponed.
We therefore need a builder who can construct a house for about 470,000 euros. This is quite ambitious for the desired size. We have had many discussions at model homes, and most providers come in at a minimum of 500,000 euros.
Offer 1:
We have chosen a small regional builder who would construct a shell house in solid construction with Liapor (lightweight concrete). The price is fair for the quality offered and would be sufficient for us. However, we would only have a fixed price for the shell house. The remaining trades would be supervised by this builder but carried out by partner companies, and I believe fixed price guarantees here are unrealistic. Ideally, we would stay within budget, but the buffer would be very tight, and the outdoor areas and garage might initially be at risk or very minimal.
Here is my first question for you: The builder basically suits us, but we are unsure whether it is wise to forgo fixed prices due to war, inflation, and material shortages. While I see some chances for stable or even slightly lower prices due to a slowdown in construction orders, the inflation risk from the energy crisis might still dominate for now. Would you currently take such a risk?
A house potentially costing 1 million euros due to cost increases is really out of budget and, combined with rising interest rates, could become a long-term burden. It wouldn’t ruin us, but we would likely have to sell the (really nice) condominiums then.
Offer 2:
The alternative: A very large provider from a parent company that almost everyone here probably knows. Premium within the group, but overall very much focused on good value for money. Timber frame construction—not our favorite since we prefer solid construction—but based on information from this forum, I would probably be satisfied with this construction method in the end.
We received a good price offer there, close to 400,000 euros. After selecting many extras and special requests, I still ended up at about 450,000 euros. Not all line items are comparable with the first offer, but some things are included here that are not yet priced in the first offer.
With additional construction costs, outdoor work, and a double garage, we are still within the budget and could even spend around 20,000 euros more on selections.
There are positive reviews of this provider but also some very critical comments. Given the large number of houses they build annually, the number of critics may be appropriate in absolute terms, but you could certainly be one of them.
My further questions for you: How do you assess the risk of being let down by such a large provider? Would you choose a builder with a large budget who does not necessarily have a reputation for delivering houses to the highest standard? I do not intend to sell the house again, but future property valuation plays a role in refinancing at follow-up financing. If the house ever needs or should be sold, some buyers might be put off by the construction method or the original general contractor. Has anyone built with this provider or lives in one of their houses?
Floor plan designs are quite advanced and have been optimized multiple times. The development area is ready, and as financing is secured, construction should start soon. The second offer will expire soon, so the main decision now is basically for or against the second offer. With the first offer, it would still be possible to request new comparison offers. If we choose the second provider, we need to decide soon.
Thank you very much for any tips and recommendations. I am happy to provide further information.
First of all, thank you very much for the countless tips and suggestions from all of you. I have been visiting this forum for many years and have always greatly benefited from it.
Accordingly, I would like to give something back by sharing our building project here. However, this is not entirely selfless—I welcome advice and recommendations.
For about 10 years, I have been searching for a house and have viewed many existing properties. Building was initially not an option, as plots were either unavailable or far too expensive. So far, I haven’t found the ideal house, but nearly 10 years ago I bought my first condominium and then a second one two years ago. Both apartments are now rented out, currently almost breaking even, and in about a year they will start generating income.
Fortunately, we have now purchased a plot in a new development area and, despite the challenging situation, want to fulfill the dream of owning our own house.
A few details about us:
- 2 adults (40 years / 38 years), two children (elementary school age)
- Net income including child benefits about 8000 euros
- Rental income of approximately 1800 euros (currently nearly cost-neutral, from next year about 400 euros monthly profit, significantly more in the medium term as loans are gradually paid off)
- Budget 850,000 euros (financing for the house construction is secured)
- Land purchase costs including additional fees about 280,000 euros, already acquired
- The apartments only make sense tax-wise when owned together and are not intended for sale. The budget could probably be increased slightly if necessary.
About the house:
- KfW55 standard is sufficient for us and is also being offered
- Urban villa on a slab foundation with porch, heat pump, photovoltaic system
- Possibly with a small bay window at the front door and on the garden side
- Ground floor with living room, open kitchen, utility room, study, guest toilet/shower
- Upper floor with 2 children’s rooms, master bedroom, 2 bathrooms, guest room
- Ceiling height 2.80 m (9 ft 2 in), electric roller shutters
- Detached double garage
Regarding the budget for the house:
About 570,000 euros remain, we are estimating around 60,000 euros for additional construction-related costs.
Outdoor work will be done gradually by ourselves, a garage could also be postponed.
We therefore need a builder who can construct a house for about 470,000 euros. This is quite ambitious for the desired size. We have had many discussions at model homes, and most providers come in at a minimum of 500,000 euros.
Offer 1:
We have chosen a small regional builder who would construct a shell house in solid construction with Liapor (lightweight concrete). The price is fair for the quality offered and would be sufficient for us. However, we would only have a fixed price for the shell house. The remaining trades would be supervised by this builder but carried out by partner companies, and I believe fixed price guarantees here are unrealistic. Ideally, we would stay within budget, but the buffer would be very tight, and the outdoor areas and garage might initially be at risk or very minimal.
Here is my first question for you: The builder basically suits us, but we are unsure whether it is wise to forgo fixed prices due to war, inflation, and material shortages. While I see some chances for stable or even slightly lower prices due to a slowdown in construction orders, the inflation risk from the energy crisis might still dominate for now. Would you currently take such a risk?
A house potentially costing 1 million euros due to cost increases is really out of budget and, combined with rising interest rates, could become a long-term burden. It wouldn’t ruin us, but we would likely have to sell the (really nice) condominiums then.
Offer 2:
The alternative: A very large provider from a parent company that almost everyone here probably knows. Premium within the group, but overall very much focused on good value for money. Timber frame construction—not our favorite since we prefer solid construction—but based on information from this forum, I would probably be satisfied with this construction method in the end.
We received a good price offer there, close to 400,000 euros. After selecting many extras and special requests, I still ended up at about 450,000 euros. Not all line items are comparable with the first offer, but some things are included here that are not yet priced in the first offer.
With additional construction costs, outdoor work, and a double garage, we are still within the budget and could even spend around 20,000 euros more on selections.
There are positive reviews of this provider but also some very critical comments. Given the large number of houses they build annually, the number of critics may be appropriate in absolute terms, but you could certainly be one of them.
My further questions for you: How do you assess the risk of being let down by such a large provider? Would you choose a builder with a large budget who does not necessarily have a reputation for delivering houses to the highest standard? I do not intend to sell the house again, but future property valuation plays a role in refinancing at follow-up financing. If the house ever needs or should be sold, some buyers might be put off by the construction method or the original general contractor. Has anyone built with this provider or lives in one of their houses?
Floor plan designs are quite advanced and have been optimized multiple times. The development area is ready, and as financing is secured, construction should start soon. The second offer will expire soon, so the main decision now is basically for or against the second offer. With the first offer, it would still be possible to request new comparison offers. If we choose the second provider, we need to decide soon.
Thank you very much for any tips and recommendations. I am happy to provide further information.
Dribbdebach schrieb:
maybe the TV - and even more likely somewhere else You have a point! Is anything really planned there at all? Apparently, where there happens to be a wall, the TV just gets placed.
And I should have mentioned this days ago: dining area meets seating area… in my opinion, that’s way too tight…
Dribbdebach schrieb:
wanted clear, rectangular floor plans for the rooms That also applies to virtual boundaries.
ypg schrieb:
Dining meets seating area… in my opinion, that’s way too cramped… I agree with ypg. I also find it clearly too tight. I don’t quite understand why you had to discard the L-shape. I would reduce the size of the office (a large closet can still fit!). I would give more space to the dining-living-kitchen area. The utility room can be extended into the space under the stairs. The first 5-6 steps of the staircase could be designed with built-in storage for shoes, etc.
I sketched an idea for the layout:
Upstairs, the staircase then switches sides. Move the children’s rooms closer to the office and place a closet (because the office downstairs is smaller). Enlarge the master bedroom, make the bathroom slightly narrower and access it through the dressing room. However, you won’t be able to have symmetrical windows on the east side. But I don’t think that’s a problem!
D
Dribbdebach5 Aug 2022 14:08Würfel* schrieb:
I agree with ypg on that. I also find it clearly too tight. I don’t quite understand why you had to discard the L-shape. I would reduce the size of the office (a large cabinet still fits in!) and allocate more space to dining-living-kitchen. The utility room should include the space under the stairs. Design the first 5-6 steps of the staircase with built-in storage for shoes, etc.
I sketched an idea for the layout:
[ATTACH alt="1659624303431.png"]73743[/ATTACH]
Upstairs, the staircase then changes sides. Move the children’s room closer to the study and place a wardrobe (because the office downstairs is smaller). Enlarge the master bedroom, make the bathroom slightly narrower and access it from the dressing area. However, you won’t get symmetry in the windows on the east side. I don’t consider that a problem!!
[ATTACH alt="1659625028273.png"]73744[/ATTACH]The L-shape was basically an extension that reached further into the garden. The house was about 12sqm (130sqft) larger. That way, the dining area next to the kitchen would have been almost outdoors, in the garden area.
Before the L-shaped design, the office was smaller as well. Good point, I have revised that and downsized the office again.
Your design for the upper floor was almost identical to an earlier version we had. What bothered us was that the bedroom door would then be directly in front of the wardrobe in the dressing area. Also, we wanted the bathroom to open towards the hallway. That’s why we switched the staircase to the other side.
On the ground floor, we had the office and toilet switched. Personally, I feel the utility room is not well placed between the office and the living room. It’s not ideal in terms of noise or plumbing. In my view, the toilet and kitchen should be adjacent. That also seems more logical given the east side orientation.
Thank you very much for your plan and suggestions. I have incorporated your and ypg’s ideas and will show you the optimized version shortly, including the actual placement of the furniture.
D
Dribbdebach5 Aug 2022 17:04Thank you for your suggestions. Attached is what I have made from them.
All the windows should now look better from the outside.
The guest room on the upper floor will keep its size. The windows in the children’s rooms should now provide better lighting, and I have accurately shown the planned furnishings.
On the ground floor, the kitchen will have a full-height door instead of a window due to the relocated window.
The living area is enlarged, and the study is reduced in size. This creates a more relaxed space, and the TV is no longer on the window wall.
Our dining table measures 1.80 m x 0.80 m (approximately 5 ft 11 in x 2 ft 7 in), so it is a bit smaller than in the previous draft. (I have included a table measuring 1.80 m x 1 m (approximately 5 ft 11 in x 3 ft 3 in) in the sketch in case a larger table is wanted later.) In the current arrangement, you do not sit with your back to the garden when seated at the long sides. It could also be rotated, and in my view, it would still be far enough away from the living area. Alternatively, the plan could be made without an island, moving the dining table closer to the kitchen. However, then the table would partly be in line with the hallway/window.
The “free” space in the southwest corner could be furnished with an armchair. But I would rather reserve that as a play and craft area, leaving some airier space for decoration.
Here it would also be possible to depart from symmetry with the windows and move them further away from the corner. If the living area is arranged differently, there would be space for a TV or furniture there. However, this would be counterproductive regarding the window layout on the upper floor.
Have I overlooked anything with these changes?
Thank you very much for your support!
All the windows should now look better from the outside.
The guest room on the upper floor will keep its size. The windows in the children’s rooms should now provide better lighting, and I have accurately shown the planned furnishings.
On the ground floor, the kitchen will have a full-height door instead of a window due to the relocated window.
The living area is enlarged, and the study is reduced in size. This creates a more relaxed space, and the TV is no longer on the window wall.
Our dining table measures 1.80 m x 0.80 m (approximately 5 ft 11 in x 2 ft 7 in), so it is a bit smaller than in the previous draft. (I have included a table measuring 1.80 m x 1 m (approximately 5 ft 11 in x 3 ft 3 in) in the sketch in case a larger table is wanted later.) In the current arrangement, you do not sit with your back to the garden when seated at the long sides. It could also be rotated, and in my view, it would still be far enough away from the living area. Alternatively, the plan could be made without an island, moving the dining table closer to the kitchen. However, then the table would partly be in line with the hallway/window.
The “free” space in the southwest corner could be furnished with an armchair. But I would rather reserve that as a play and craft area, leaving some airier space for decoration.
Here it would also be possible to depart from symmetry with the windows and move them further away from the corner. If the living area is arranged differently, there would be space for a TV or furniture there. However, this would be counterproductive regarding the window layout on the upper floor.
Have I overlooked anything with these changes?
Thank you very much for your support!
A few things I would reconsider:
The wardrobe will not be sufficient for four people, even with a depth of 60cm (24 inches), and you are planning:
However, I would find the view from the dining table to the front door and the stairs, as well as the items stored underneath, unattractive. That’s why in my idea I tried to avoid exactly this line of sight. You could also simply add a door to the living-dining area; then, naturally, you wouldn’t see—or wouldn’t see as much—anymore.
I think the sofa and TV look very cramped there. But if the living room is not a priority for you and you don’t have a large TV, it should be fine.
Upstairs, the children’s room on the left side of the plan doesn’t seem nicely furnished to me. The bed is uncomfortably placed facing the door. It would be better positioned along the wall adjacent to the study. However, that would mean the window would have to be moved back outside.
If the children are supposed to have access to the master bathroom anyway, I would consider removing the small shower bathroom entirely. I don’t think it’s necessary to have two toilets upstairs if there is one right down the stairs. This would have the advantage of giving you space for a dressing area and/or a larger bathroom.
The wardrobe will not be sufficient for four people, even with a depth of 60cm (24 inches), and you are planning:
Dribbdebach schrieb:
There is a little space for coats under the stairs,
However, I would find the view from the dining table to the front door and the stairs, as well as the items stored underneath, unattractive. That’s why in my idea I tried to avoid exactly this line of sight. You could also simply add a door to the living-dining area; then, naturally, you wouldn’t see—or wouldn’t see as much—anymore.
I think the sofa and TV look very cramped there. But if the living room is not a priority for you and you don’t have a large TV, it should be fine.
Upstairs, the children’s room on the left side of the plan doesn’t seem nicely furnished to me. The bed is uncomfortably placed facing the door. It would be better positioned along the wall adjacent to the study. However, that would mean the window would have to be moved back outside.
If the children are supposed to have access to the master bathroom anyway, I would consider removing the small shower bathroom entirely. I don’t think it’s necessary to have two toilets upstairs if there is one right down the stairs. This would have the advantage of giving you space for a dressing area and/or a larger bathroom.
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