ᐅ Comparability of Costs: Architect vs. General Contractor
Created on: 4 Mar 2021 16:57
A
askforafriend
Hello dear forum,
We are currently in the planning phase for a single-family house. We have requested quotes from several general contractors and have also spoken with a very approachable architect. We would be happy to present our building project (BVH) in detail at a later stage!
Overall, we much prefer the transparency and approach of the architect compared to the initial consultation with the general contractor. We understand that over time, we will also speak with an architect/planner through the general contractor who will discuss details with us. We have thoroughly researched the advantages and disadvantages both in this forum and through various guides.
At this stage, our main focus is on comparing the cost estimates from the general contractors versus the architect. The general contractor states the costs as a fixed price (based on the building and scope of services description) plus our additional requests (extra electrical outlets, KfW standard, etc.). A rough total for the house including additional requests was, for example, 410,000 euros. This naturally also includes architectural/planning/engineering services according to the scope of work description.
Land leveling.
Discussions about your building project together with you during planning and construction meetings. Preparation of building permit/planning permission documents at a scale of 1:100 in the required number of copies for the authorities.
You will receive an additional set of plans for your personal records.
Development of working drawings (scale 1:50) as well as any necessary detailed drawings.
Creation of structural engineering plans (standard structural design for the respective house type) including any required building physics reports for thermal and fire protection.
Calculation of energy demand and preparation of the energy performance certificate. A copy will be provided for your records.
Preparation of public funding applications, if required.
Site management and construction supervision up to handover of the house.
Support during the warranty period.
When we first met with the architect, he took out a book labeled BKI to provide a rough estimate of the feasibility of the building project based on this data. He calculated roughly 3,000 euros per square meter and 150 square meters (1,615 square feet) of living space, resulting in a total of 450,000 euros.
The big question now is: Does this amount exclude his fees or do these average construction costs per square meter already include the services mentioned above? This might be a somewhat naive question, but it’s really unclear to us. Is there a list of costs that are included in these average rates?
We have an appointment with him next week for a more detailed cost assessment.
Thank you very much for your feedback, and I wish you a pleasant week.
We are currently in the planning phase for a single-family house. We have requested quotes from several general contractors and have also spoken with a very approachable architect. We would be happy to present our building project (BVH) in detail at a later stage!
Overall, we much prefer the transparency and approach of the architect compared to the initial consultation with the general contractor. We understand that over time, we will also speak with an architect/planner through the general contractor who will discuss details with us. We have thoroughly researched the advantages and disadvantages both in this forum and through various guides.
At this stage, our main focus is on comparing the cost estimates from the general contractors versus the architect. The general contractor states the costs as a fixed price (based on the building and scope of services description) plus our additional requests (extra electrical outlets, KfW standard, etc.). A rough total for the house including additional requests was, for example, 410,000 euros. This naturally also includes architectural/planning/engineering services according to the scope of work description.
Land leveling.
Discussions about your building project together with you during planning and construction meetings. Preparation of building permit/planning permission documents at a scale of 1:100 in the required number of copies for the authorities.
You will receive an additional set of plans for your personal records.
Development of working drawings (scale 1:50) as well as any necessary detailed drawings.
Creation of structural engineering plans (standard structural design for the respective house type) including any required building physics reports for thermal and fire protection.
Calculation of energy demand and preparation of the energy performance certificate. A copy will be provided for your records.
Preparation of public funding applications, if required.
Site management and construction supervision up to handover of the house.
Support during the warranty period.
When we first met with the architect, he took out a book labeled BKI to provide a rough estimate of the feasibility of the building project based on this data. He calculated roughly 3,000 euros per square meter and 150 square meters (1,615 square feet) of living space, resulting in a total of 450,000 euros.
The big question now is: Does this amount exclude his fees or do these average construction costs per square meter already include the services mentioned above? This might be a somewhat naive question, but it’s really unclear to us. Is there a list of costs that are included in these average rates?
We have an appointment with him next week for a more detailed cost assessment.
Thank you very much for your feedback, and I wish you a pleasant week.
For a standard single-family home used by the owner, it seems like an unnecessary luxury to me. In rental apartment buildings, you can’t rely on tenants to report defects without the potential for rent reductions, so that’s a different matter.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
I
Iotafreak31 Mar 2021 16:00Hey, we have now decided to build with an architect...
The first meeting with one is coming up...
Assuming everything fits and we agree to work together...
We want to commission the entire service phases 1-8...
How does this usually work? When is the contract signed?
Is it signed at the very beginning for all the service phases or first for phases 1-4 and then a new contract afterwards?
Is it signed only after the design is created, or does the architect want it beforehand?
Maybe they prepare something for us, and despite several changes, we can’t agree on a final price, for example. Or after a few months of planning, we realize that we don’t work well together... etc.
What is the normal procedure?
Thanks
The first meeting with one is coming up...
Assuming everything fits and we agree to work together...
We want to commission the entire service phases 1-8...
How does this usually work? When is the contract signed?
Is it signed at the very beginning for all the service phases or first for phases 1-4 and then a new contract afterwards?
Is it signed only after the design is created, or does the architect want it beforehand?
Maybe they prepare something for us, and despite several changes, we can’t agree on a final price, for example. Or after a few months of planning, we realize that we don’t work well together... etc.
What is the normal procedure?
Thanks
Iotafreak schrieb:
Hey, we have now decided to build with an architect...
The first meeting with one is coming up... [...]
Maybe they will prepare something for us, and despite several changes, we won’t agree on a final price, for example. Or after a few months of planning, you realize you don’t work well together... etc... Then save yourself a restless night; after the initial consultation, you don’t have to sign anything right away. There is no early booking or volume discount—the price for each service phase is the same whether you book them individually or as a complete package. Make a contract for the basic evaluation and preliminary design first, and later one or several extension contracts. After the initial meeting, you get a first impression, and I consider one or two weeks of reflection time before signing a contract fair. In other words, you have the initial meeting and reflection period as two steps to judge if they’re the right fit, and the results at the stage of the “finished preliminary design” as a third. That should be enough to clearly decide whether you want to proceed together. After that, I would only add one more supplementary or extension agreement, because building permit/planning permission documentation, detailed design, and construction supervision, in my opinion, should not be separated (otherwise you lose part of the advantage compared to purely drafting-based planning). Between the two contracts or contract parts, you can take another two-week reflection period. If both spouses agree after that, it should provide enough certainty—even for those who are cautious.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
I
Iotafreak31 Mar 2021 16:3711ant schrieb:
Then save yourself a restless night—you don’t have to sign anything right after the initial consultation. There’s also no early booking or volume discount; the price for each project phase is the same whether you book them individually or as a complete package. Arrange a contract for the basic evaluation and preliminary design first, and later one or more extension contracts. After the first meeting, you get an initial impression, and I consider a week or two to think it over before signing the contract to be fair. This means you have the consultation and the reflection period as two steps to assess whether this architect is right for you, and the results at the "finished preliminary design" stage as a third step. That should be enough to decide if you want to continue working together. After that, I would only do one more supplementary or extension module, because in my opinion, the approval planning, detailed design, and construction management phases should not be separated (otherwise you risk losing part of the advantage compared to a purely draughtsman-based planning). Between the two contracts or contract parts, you can take another two weeks to reflect. If both spouses agree afterward, that should provide enough security even for those who are more cautious. Okay, thanks for the tips. Let’s see if the architect agrees… If he immediately wants to set up a contract for all phases, at least I know it can be done differently. Thanks.
Of course, no architect (who, as a creative person, might already have the finished house in mind after the first meeting) wants clients who are uncertain and might want to quit halfway through, only to have their approval plans handed over to a general contractor who then builds shameful rubbish according to those plans. But this can be communicated during the discussion, making it clear that this is not the reason for dividing the contract into parts.
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
I
Iotafreak31 Mar 2021 16:5511ant schrieb:
Of course, no architect (who, as a creative person, might already have the finished house in mind after the first meeting) wants clients who say "I’m not sure if I want this" and might back out halfway through, then take his approved plans to a general contractor who builds a terrible job based on them. But you can make it clear in the discussion that this is not the reason for dividing up the contract parts. Makes sense, understandable... I will bring this up with everyone to explain why we chose an architect. Thanks
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