Hello everyone,
this is my third post in this forum. First of all, thank you for the valuable tips I have already received. I think I have learned a lot so far.
I have linked the previous posts below. To avoid any misunderstandings, I will list all the necessary information again. Therefore, reading the old posts only makes limited sense. For completeness, I have included them here.
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grundrissplanung-Bungalow-170qm.31445/
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grobe-Grundstücksplanung-819m.31558/
For the initial selection, there were three rough floor plan drafts. One was from Yvonne, the second from kbt09, and the third from the planner/ourselves. Many thanks to both of you for the good ideas! After some time for consideration and consultation with the developer, we decided to pursue the third floor plan.
Now to the main topic.
At the end of April 2019, we reserved a plot (plot no. 10) and started working on the floor plan. The plot is tied to the developer, and unfortunately, the planner has not turned out to be very creative (myself included). Two weeks ago, we had another meeting with the developer and talked about the three options mentioned above. We then chose one variant and want to proceed with it. We have now received a draft, which certainly still needs improvement.
For this reason, I would like to present the floor plan here again for discussion and hope for feedback, ideas, suggestions, and tips. Maybe you will immediately see things that “just don’t work” or are not practical for everyday life. I have also already noticed a few things that I would change, but since we will probably make quite a few modifications anyway, I have not yet suggested my own improvements in the floor plan. Also, the planner and I have not yet discussed doors and windows.
Attached again is the completed questionnaire.
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: 819m² (8809 sq ft)
Slope: NO
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4 (allowable exceedance 25 per 100)
Gross floor area ratio (GFAR): 0.6
Building envelope, building line and boundary: On the northeast side approximately 31m (102 ft) deep, west side approximately 35m (115 ft) deep, plot frontage on the street 18.7m (61 ft) and rear boundary (development limit) approximately 27m (89 ft). The major challenge with the plot is the narrow width at the front. Depending on house orientation, after the 3m (10 ft) building setback on the street side, we have about 19.5m (64 ft) to 20.4m (67 ft) available. This means that if the house is parallel to the street, it is 19.5m (64 ft), and parallel to the neighbor in the northeast direction about 20.1m (66 ft).
Side building setback: 3m (10 ft)
Number of parking spaces required: no specification
Number of floors: maximum 2 full floors
Roof type: gable roof, hip roof
Other requirements: Garage must be at least 5m (16 ft) from the property boundary.
Client requirements
Style, roof shape, building type: bungalow with hip roof
Basement, floors: no basement due to high groundwater level
Number of people, age: 4 people aged 36 years (female), 37 years (male), 2 years (child), 7 months (child)
Room requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
Ground floor: living/dining/kitchen, utility room, guest toilet with shower, hallway with coat area and stairs to the upper floor, children’s rooms, master bedroom, bathroom, and storage room.
Upper floor: office, children’s playroom and additional storage space.
Office: family use or home office? home office
Overnight guests per year: 1–2 times
Open or closed floor plan: a mix of both
Conservative or modern design: a mix of both
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen with island would be nice but not a must, closed kitchen also has advantages
Number of dining seats: 4, with the option for 6–8 would be nice but not essential
Fireplace: no
Music/sound wall: sound system in the living room
Balcony, roof terrace: no
Garage, carport: Space for 2 cars is required. Currently, I am considering a garage (3x6m / 10x20 ft) and carport (3.6m / 12 ft).
Kitchen garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special requirements/daily routine, including reasons for preferences or restrictions
House design
Who designed the plan:
-Developer’s planner / do-it-yourself
What do you particularly like? Why?
-There should be enough space in the coat area and behind the stairs to store jackets, shoes, etc.
-The children’s rooms have a comfortable size and are practically equal in size.
-Living room/kitchen are close to entrance and garage.
-The storage room has a good (central) location.
-
What do you not like? Why?
-Garage/carport is very far to the back (but I can probably live with this)
-The utility room is comparatively large and long
-The kitchen in my opinion is somewhat too large
-The living room is only the desired minimum size and could use 5m² (54 sq ft) more
-The main bathroom is located between both children’s rooms and the noise from showering and toilet use is likely to be a major issue
-The main bathroom could be slightly larger
-Between the garage and the property boundary there will be a dead space where weeds will probably grow later. Does anyone have ideas on how to prevent this?
-The garage is currently planned with a length of 9m (30 ft), of which 6m (20 ft) is for the garage and 3m (10 ft) for a storage room. The current position directly behind the garage is not optimal in my view
Price estimate according to architect/planner: no new price estimate received yet
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 400,000
Preferred heating technology: heat pump
Why is the design the way it is now? e.g.
ideas from planner and do-it-yourself ideas from me
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan summarized in 130 characters?
The main bathroom is located between the children’s rooms. How can we reduce noise disturbance to a minimum?
Imagine I drive a Skoda Superb into the garage. Since the garage is on the property boundary and the driveway narrows between the house and property line, I have to enter at a slight angle. Does this cause problems in everyday life? See pictures.
Assuming we build a double garage directly attached to the bungalow instead of a garage and carport, is there anything special to consider during construction?
this is my third post in this forum. First of all, thank you for the valuable tips I have already received. I think I have learned a lot so far.
I have linked the previous posts below. To avoid any misunderstandings, I will list all the necessary information again. Therefore, reading the old posts only makes limited sense. For completeness, I have included them here.
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grundrissplanung-Bungalow-170qm.31445/
https://www.hausbau-forum.de/threads/grobe-Grundstücksplanung-819m.31558/
For the initial selection, there were three rough floor plan drafts. One was from Yvonne, the second from kbt09, and the third from the planner/ourselves. Many thanks to both of you for the good ideas! After some time for consideration and consultation with the developer, we decided to pursue the third floor plan.
ypg schrieb:
If I say that the plot is not easy, I am understated.
Maybe this is an approach?
kbt09 schrieb:
I continued with the approach from the floor plan adjustments.
Now to the main topic.
At the end of April 2019, we reserved a plot (plot no. 10) and started working on the floor plan. The plot is tied to the developer, and unfortunately, the planner has not turned out to be very creative (myself included). Two weeks ago, we had another meeting with the developer and talked about the three options mentioned above. We then chose one variant and want to proceed with it. We have now received a draft, which certainly still needs improvement.
For this reason, I would like to present the floor plan here again for discussion and hope for feedback, ideas, suggestions, and tips. Maybe you will immediately see things that “just don’t work” or are not practical for everyday life. I have also already noticed a few things that I would change, but since we will probably make quite a few modifications anyway, I have not yet suggested my own improvements in the floor plan. Also, the planner and I have not yet discussed doors and windows.
Attached again is the completed questionnaire.
Development plan/restrictions
Plot size: 819m² (8809 sq ft)
Slope: NO
Floor area ratio (FAR): 0.4 (allowable exceedance 25 per 100)
Gross floor area ratio (GFAR): 0.6
Building envelope, building line and boundary: On the northeast side approximately 31m (102 ft) deep, west side approximately 35m (115 ft) deep, plot frontage on the street 18.7m (61 ft) and rear boundary (development limit) approximately 27m (89 ft). The major challenge with the plot is the narrow width at the front. Depending on house orientation, after the 3m (10 ft) building setback on the street side, we have about 19.5m (64 ft) to 20.4m (67 ft) available. This means that if the house is parallel to the street, it is 19.5m (64 ft), and parallel to the neighbor in the northeast direction about 20.1m (66 ft).
Side building setback: 3m (10 ft)
Number of parking spaces required: no specification
Number of floors: maximum 2 full floors
Roof type: gable roof, hip roof
Other requirements: Garage must be at least 5m (16 ft) from the property boundary.
Client requirements
Style, roof shape, building type: bungalow with hip roof
Basement, floors: no basement due to high groundwater level
Number of people, age: 4 people aged 36 years (female), 37 years (male), 2 years (child), 7 months (child)
Room requirements on ground floor and upper floor:
Ground floor: living/dining/kitchen, utility room, guest toilet with shower, hallway with coat area and stairs to the upper floor, children’s rooms, master bedroom, bathroom, and storage room.
Upper floor: office, children’s playroom and additional storage space.
Office: family use or home office? home office
Overnight guests per year: 1–2 times
Open or closed floor plan: a mix of both
Conservative or modern design: a mix of both
Open kitchen, kitchen island: open kitchen with island would be nice but not a must, closed kitchen also has advantages
Number of dining seats: 4, with the option for 6–8 would be nice but not essential
Fireplace: no
Music/sound wall: sound system in the living room
Balcony, roof terrace: no
Garage, carport: Space for 2 cars is required. Currently, I am considering a garage (3x6m / 10x20 ft) and carport (3.6m / 12 ft).
Kitchen garden, greenhouse: no
Other wishes/special requirements/daily routine, including reasons for preferences or restrictions
House design
Who designed the plan:
-Developer’s planner / do-it-yourself
What do you particularly like? Why?
-There should be enough space in the coat area and behind the stairs to store jackets, shoes, etc.
-The children’s rooms have a comfortable size and are practically equal in size.
-Living room/kitchen are close to entrance and garage.
-The storage room has a good (central) location.
-
What do you not like? Why?
-Garage/carport is very far to the back (but I can probably live with this)
-The utility room is comparatively large and long
-The kitchen in my opinion is somewhat too large
-The living room is only the desired minimum size and could use 5m² (54 sq ft) more
-The main bathroom is located between both children’s rooms and the noise from showering and toilet use is likely to be a major issue
-The main bathroom could be slightly larger
-Between the garage and the property boundary there will be a dead space where weeds will probably grow later. Does anyone have ideas on how to prevent this?
-The garage is currently planned with a length of 9m (30 ft), of which 6m (20 ft) is for the garage and 3m (10 ft) for a storage room. The current position directly behind the garage is not optimal in my view
Price estimate according to architect/planner: no new price estimate received yet
Personal price limit for the house including equipment: 400,000
Preferred heating technology: heat pump
Why is the design the way it is now? e.g.
ideas from planner and do-it-yourself ideas from me
What is the most important/basic question about the floor plan summarized in 130 characters?
The main bathroom is located between the children’s rooms. How can we reduce noise disturbance to a minimum?
Imagine I drive a Skoda Superb into the garage. Since the garage is on the property boundary and the driveway narrows between the house and property line, I have to enter at a slight angle. Does this cause problems in everyday life? See pictures.
Assuming we build a double garage directly attached to the bungalow instead of a garage and carport, is there anything special to consider during construction?
C
Chrisi190617 Aug 2019 21:20kbt09 schrieb:
I experimented again with an L-shaped bungalow.
The idea was to create a proper summer evening barbecue terrace.
The garage is placed on the north side (which means the window in the utility room has to go) with an attached storage extension; alternatively, it could be a carport with a storage extension here as well.
On the southwest side, there is another carport with a nice dividing wall.
If the house is positioned at the 5m (16 feet) corner, same as the northern garage, I think it is far enough away from the street to create a nice spot in the corner of the bungalow for summer evenings—also undisturbed by neighbors, where you can enjoy the evening sun.
You can still put a terrace on the southeast side and consider adding an exit from the children's rooms, etc.
Just meant as inspiration for now.
[ATTACH alt="Bungalow-148m-Grundstücksplanung-grundrissplanung-341178-1.jpg"]37595[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH alt="Bungalow-148m-Grundstücksplanung-grundrissplanung-341178-3.jpg"]37597[/ATTACH]Nice floor plan. I’m just not sure how practical it is to have the terrace at the front. There is a large log cabin about 200m (650 feet) away. The sun might disappear behind that house. I’ll check it out again on the plot in the coming days.
Advantages:
– Nice layout structure
– Little traffic area
– Huge living, dining, and kitchen area
– My wife will like that the kids’ rooms are at the back
Disadvantages:
– Kids’ room 1 is next to the living room
– To get from the bedroom to the bathroom you have to go through the dining area (not sure whether that’s a big disadvantage)
– Utility room is not at the front
– Both plot boundaries are built up with garage/carport
kaho674 schrieb:
The staircase design primarily depends on the floor-to-ceiling height. I usually calculate it on a website (-> google) "staircase basics." It helps to keep some basic principles in mind. For example, I wouldn’t go below 1m (3.3 feet) width for my house—the stringers and railing make it narrower anyway. Also, I try to keep the rise between 18 and 18.6 cm (7.1 and 7.3 inches) and the tread depth around 26 to 27 cm (10.2 to 10.6 inches). For headroom, at least 2.10 m (6 feet 11 inches).
I did some experimenting with the floor plan again. This is how I would do it now, although the stairs are supposed to have a quarter turn with no landing (program error).
[ATTACH alt="Treppe.jpg"]37592[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH alt="treppenmaße.jpg"]37593[/ATTACH]
For the roof, I only see a gable roof—without knee walls, the hip roof is pointless here and looks terrible in my opinion.
Maybe you could open the ceiling in the entrance up to the roof for a small gallery. Add some big windows there—it would look something like this:
[ATTACH alt="DG.jpg"]37600[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH alt="Dielenansicht.jpg"]37594[/ATTACH]
Okay, just playing around. The stairs don’t have to be 1m (3.3 feet) wide for us. I tried a 90 cm (35 inch) stairway, which is plenty. But none of us are very tall.
Regarding the gable roof: If we go for a gable roof now, the builder will probably suggest using a proper reinforced concrete ceiling. That would surely be much more expensive in combination with the (cheaper) gable roof than a hip roof with wooden beam ceiling, or am I mistaken?
Escroda schrieb:
Are you still waiting for answers from the OP? Well, at least their actions match the development plan, which raises more questions than it answers. Actually, the usage template specifies gable and hip roofs. The legend confirms this. However, there is no reference to the legal basis. According to the Building Code, roof shape and pitch cannot be fixed. That must be regulated in a regional design ordinance, which can be included in the development plan but must be clearly marked—which is not the case here. The justification for the development plan doesn’t help either—in fact, it even mentions “simultaneous specification of roof shape and pitch.” I find no indication of roof pitch in the plan document. In my opinion, fixing the roof shape is invalid. Someone in this development area has built a shed roof even though it’s not specified in the development plan. Either they just did it or checked with the building authority and got written permission. If you sort that out in advance with the building department, it should be possible.
I could really imagine a bungalow with a staggered shed roof.
ypg schrieb:
The builder can’t do that.
I don’t think stair width is important here; 90 cm (35 inches) works fine. After all, it’s not the main staircase. I agree about the stairs. 90 cm (35 inches) is enough for us...
kaho674 schrieb:
I would like to arrange the living areas more like this:
[ATTACH alt="Variante.jpg"]37602[/ATTACH]
But then I can’t fit a staircase, and the rooms end up next to the “noisy” areas again. What do you think? I like the room layout very much from a sectional point of view. But a staircase has to be there. No way around it. I also prefer the L-shaped arrangement of the living, dining, and kitchen areas.
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
If we go with a gable roof now, the structural engineer will probably suggest using a proper reinforced concrete slab.With a gable you can use trusses, which are lighter than with a hip roof. I don’t follow your reasoning.https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
C
Chrisi190617 Aug 2019 22:22ypg schrieb:
I saved mine for reference...
Subwoofer... check
Washing machine... check
Short cables... check
South-facing kids... check
kaho674 schrieb:
I left out the staircase – sorry, I’m not convinced about it.
But if included, you could choose to position it in the private area at the back. That would have the advantage of the double doors letting plenty of light into the dining area. Also, you could place a window behind the stairs, illuminating the hallway. However, the second storage room would be lost.
Otherwise, the version stays as in the first draft.
Here are sketches of both versions, although the space under the straight staircase might need to be custom-built by a carpenter or even the staircase builder for more useful storage volume.
[ATTACH alt="Bungalow 148m - site and floor plan - 340964-1.jpg"]37517[/ATTACH] Today I sat down with my wife and we went through both floor plans. We both prefer the lower one. Her main reason is that the main bathroom isn’t adjacent to the bedroom. Honestly, that’s not very important to me.
One question about the lower floor plan: If the staircase is placed at the bottom, could you have a split shed roof? Meaning the left section of the bungalow would still have rooms?
Something like this visually...
C
Chrisi190617 Aug 2019 22:3011ant schrieb:
With a gable roof, it can rest on trusses, which is easier than with a hip roof. I can't follow your reasoning.The question is what type of ceiling construction he will use for the ground floor.
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
We prefer the lower one a bit more. The main reason for her is that the master bathroom is not next to the bedroom. Are you referring to the one Katja mentioned? – I didn’t quite understand it because of the two staircases.
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
Could you then use a staggered shed roof? So the left area in the bungalow would still have rooms? Yes, that would be possible. But I was thinking more about the bungalow without attic conversion: living and sleeping areas with an open roof structure, the higher part of the roof with skylights in a staggered arrangement (gable end); the lower side only as an attic space.
Chrisi1906 schrieb:
The question is what kind of ceiling construction he plans to use for the ground floor. Yes, of course. Wooden beams or concrete. But why do you specifically think he would want to use concrete with a gable roof?
https://www.instagram.com/11antgmxde/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/bauen-jetzt/
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