Good morning dear forum,
as the title suggests, I have a question regarding the detailed design phase, but unfortunately, I need to provide some background first:
We worked with an architect on the planning permission stage, and the building permit / planning permission application has been submitted. We have a friend who is a contractor (civil and structural works) supporting us privately with our project. He recommended an engineering firm for phases 6-9 (execution planning and supervision), with whom he likes to cooperate because they are both technically skilled and personally reliable.
We have now met with the engineering firm. They will handle the commercial aspects and the tendering, and one of their engineers is an energy consultant and building surveyor who would take over the site management / construction supervision. So far, so good.
Now to the main reason for my question:
The future site manager has reviewed our plans and found them very good. So good, in fact, that he suggested, once he receives the structural engineer’s plans and possibly one or two additional detailed drawings (including floor and roof construction), we could forego the execution planning phase. After a brief discussion with our contractor friend, this would be possible but would mean more coordination effort for the site manager.
Naturally, we are somewhat uncertain. On the one hand, we want to build a house without major defects or problems, but on the other hand, this option is financially tempting for us.
Can we rely on the statement of the site manager, who is also a building surveyor, or how would you proceed? What can we do to avoid any pitfalls?
Thank you in advance for your answers.
If any additional information is needed, I am happy to provide it.
Best regards
P.S.: Maybe it’s important to mention: we are building a fairly “simple” house in terms of structure, with no complicated walls or ceilings as far as I can judge.
as the title suggests, I have a question regarding the detailed design phase, but unfortunately, I need to provide some background first:
We worked with an architect on the planning permission stage, and the building permit / planning permission application has been submitted. We have a friend who is a contractor (civil and structural works) supporting us privately with our project. He recommended an engineering firm for phases 6-9 (execution planning and supervision), with whom he likes to cooperate because they are both technically skilled and personally reliable.
We have now met with the engineering firm. They will handle the commercial aspects and the tendering, and one of their engineers is an energy consultant and building surveyor who would take over the site management / construction supervision. So far, so good.
Now to the main reason for my question:
The future site manager has reviewed our plans and found them very good. So good, in fact, that he suggested, once he receives the structural engineer’s plans and possibly one or two additional detailed drawings (including floor and roof construction), we could forego the execution planning phase. After a brief discussion with our contractor friend, this would be possible but would mean more coordination effort for the site manager.
Naturally, we are somewhat uncertain. On the one hand, we want to build a house without major defects or problems, but on the other hand, this option is financially tempting for us.
Can we rely on the statement of the site manager, who is also a building surveyor, or how would you proceed? What can we do to avoid any pitfalls?
Thank you in advance for your answers.
If any additional information is needed, I am happy to provide it.
Best regards
P.S.: Maybe it’s important to mention: we are building a fairly “simple” house in terms of structure, with no complicated walls or ceilings as far as I can judge.
T
Tagtraum854 Feb 2015 13:57@toxicmolotow
Thanks for the tip. We aim to meet KfW70 standards, but we will not be applying for KfW loans. However, nothing is finalized yet.
I just double-checked with the engineering firm: the site manager would also act as the energy consultant.
Thanks for the tip. We aim to meet KfW70 standards, but we will not be applying for KfW loans. However, nothing is finalized yet.
I just double-checked with the engineering firm: the site manager would also act as the energy consultant.
T
toxicmolotof4 Feb 2015 14:03That’s exactly why I wanted to point this out. Your site manager can technically check everything but is not allowed to in this case.
The energy consultant required by the KfW must be independent and cannot have any other interest in the construction project. This is not the case if they also act as the site manager.
If the KfW allows it anyway, you must insist on an external consultant despite the site manager’s qualifications (however that works in practice).
Your site manager is not allowed to do this because then execution and supervision would be combined.
The energy consultant required by the KfW must be independent and cannot have any other interest in the construction project. This is not the case if they also act as the site manager.
If the KfW allows it anyway, you must insist on an external consultant despite the site manager’s qualifications (however that works in practice).
Your site manager is not allowed to do this because then execution and supervision would be combined.
T
Tagtraum854 Feb 2015 14:11You never stop learning, even if you feel like you've read through the entire forum.
Back to the topic:
I’m also skeptical, though my significant other is less so. There were comments like: We have been building almost exclusively with design plans for nearly 10 years — partly because they are detailed enough, and partly because the construction documentation was only completed when the house was handed over (paraphrased).
Of course, if the plans are only finished by the handover, then I might as well skip them. I had assumed that construction would only start once the construction documentation for the respective phase was finalized... but I’m just a layperson.
Back to the topic:
I’m also skeptical, though my significant other is less so. There were comments like: We have been building almost exclusively with design plans for nearly 10 years — partly because they are detailed enough, and partly because the construction documentation was only completed when the house was handed over (paraphrased).
Of course, if the plans are only finished by the handover, then I might as well skip them. I had assumed that construction would only start once the construction documentation for the respective phase was finalized... but I’m just a layperson.
T
toxicmolotof4 Feb 2015 14:16Some things are actually only planned when the particular phase is due. For example, in our case, the final planning of the floor structure was completed only after the shell builders and roofers had already sent their final invoices three times.
If you really want a complete construction plan before the start of building, it mainly costs time. A lot of time.
On the other hand, there is the issue of liability. Personally, I would find that at least partly too risky.
If you really want a complete construction plan before the start of building, it mainly costs time. A lot of time.
On the other hand, there is the issue of liability. Personally, I would find that at least partly too risky.
Tagtraum85 schrieb:
We have been building for almost 10 years using mainly design plans, partly because they are detailed enough, and partly because the construction plans were only completed upon house handover (roughly speaking).My structural contractor also builds houses where, at the start of construction, there are only 2 sections on DIN A3 paper. He carries out all the details during execution to the best of his knowledge and belief. Well, that’s Berlin for you...
T
Tagtraum854 Feb 2015 14:22Well, I meant it like this: the detailed planning is done for, for example, the wall, and then the walls are built, so not planning the entire house in detail first and then starting.
Does anyone know how long such an execution plan / construction drawing typically takes? Our building permit / planning permission might be delayed until the end of April.
Does anyone know how long such an execution plan / construction drawing typically takes? Our building permit / planning permission might be delayed until the end of April.
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