Hello everyone,
We are currently facing the question of heating systems. Just recently, on Monday or Tuesday, there was a program where someone ended up paying a fortune for an air-to-water heat pump, which served more as a cautionary example ;(
Personally, I would prefer a geothermal heating system using probes, but this costs us 7,500 € more plus the drilling cannot be guaranteed at a fixed price due to the Kaarst rock formation. So either it works with the first drilling, or if we’re unlucky, we might have to pay even more.
Therefore, we are also considering an air-source heat pump, but unfortunately, you mostly hear negative things about this type of heating system. Are there any users who have this system and are satisfied with it, where the costs are reasonable or at least where they should be? I know it all depends on location, temperatures, etc., but there must be some practical experiences.
I think, first and foremost, one should have a reliable heating contractor who is knowledgeable about the type of heating system. I have a meeting on Tuesday with our heating installer who has already installed many air-source heat pumps.
He had already mentioned the Stiebel Eltron 16 Trend, which is said to be very good and also qualifies for subsidies.
It would be great to hear your opinions and experiences, even if this is yet another thread on the topic.
We are currently facing the question of heating systems. Just recently, on Monday or Tuesday, there was a program where someone ended up paying a fortune for an air-to-water heat pump, which served more as a cautionary example ;(
Personally, I would prefer a geothermal heating system using probes, but this costs us 7,500 € more plus the drilling cannot be guaranteed at a fixed price due to the Kaarst rock formation. So either it works with the first drilling, or if we’re unlucky, we might have to pay even more.
Therefore, we are also considering an air-source heat pump, but unfortunately, you mostly hear negative things about this type of heating system. Are there any users who have this system and are satisfied with it, where the costs are reasonable or at least where they should be? I know it all depends on location, temperatures, etc., but there must be some practical experiences.
I think, first and foremost, one should have a reliable heating contractor who is knowledgeable about the type of heating system. I have a meeting on Tuesday with our heating installer who has already installed many air-source heat pumps.
He had already mentioned the Stiebel Eltron 16 Trend, which is said to be very good and also qualifies for subsidies.
It would be great to hear your opinions and experiences, even if this is yet another thread on the topic.
B
Bauexperte9 Nov 2015 12:33Watcher78 schrieb:
We would like to use a ground-source heat pump, but the problem is that our general contractor and the drilling company cannot guarantee a fixed price for the drilling. So, on top of the current additional cost of 7,500 € (ground-source heat pump + drilling – subsidy), there could easily be extra unforeseen expenses that we cannot plan for. Although I am not convinced about using a ground-source heat pump in a single-family home, I am surprised that the drilling company cannot or will not provide exact costs. They should have experience-based estimates... So far, in all the quotes I have seen from drilling companies, there is always a fixed price offered, often with a contractually guaranteed tolerance of "x" drilling meters.
Best regards, Bauexperte
B
Bieber08159 Nov 2015 21:35Bauexperte schrieb:
"For a heating load of 10 kilowatts, the air-to-water heat pump costs around 13,000 euros, with operating costs of about 1,100 euros. In comparison, the gas condensing boiler costs approximately 4,500 euros with annual operating costs of 1,800 euros. The difference in heating costs of 700 euros per year must cover the additional investment. This means the system pays off after about twelve years, not taking into account the interest on the extra investment." In addition to the interest, legally required compensatory measures must also be considered. The gas connection might possibly be eliminated. In our case, according to the builder, the "gas" option would have been about the same cost or more expensive compared to the air-to-water heat pump option (referring to investment costs — of course, this can vary with other cases or providers). If the air-to-water heat pump indeed results in lower operating costs (who can really tell), then everything will work out well .
We will also be building with an air-to-water heat pump since there is no gas connection available on the street. Therefore, I don’t have any experience yet. A colleague of mine has been living for 1.5 years in a house with a Stiebel Eltron unit rated at 9.7 kW for over 200 m² (2,150 sq ft) of living space (without controlled residential ventilation) and has heating and hot water costs of around €80 without solar thermal or photovoltaic systems.
Everything depends on proper sizing and fine-tuning. For an air-to-water heat pump, a correctly selected and well-adjusted system seems to be the most important factor.
Everything depends on proper sizing and fine-tuning. For an air-to-water heat pump, a correctly selected and well-adjusted system seems to be the most important factor.
Bauexperte schrieb:
“The payback period for a heat pump depends on the individual case. For comparison: With a heating load of 10 kilowatts, an air-to-water heat pump costs around 13,000 euros, with operating costs of about 1,100 euros per year. In comparison, a gas condensing boiler costs approximately 4,500 euros, with annual operating costs of 1,800 euros. The difference in heating costs of 700 euros per year must cover the higher initial investment. This means the system pays off after about twelve years, not taking into account interest on the additional investment.”
A brine/water heat pump or a water/water heat pump have lower operating costs but require a higher upfront investment. So if electricity prices rise significantly, choosing a heat pump may be a poor decision.
Regards, BauexperteHello Bauexperte,
I would like to ask for your advice or opinion.
Our situation is as follows:
New build according to the 2016 Energy Saving Ordinance, hollow brick construction, no basement, 155 m² (1,670 ft²) living area, underfloor heating and pellet stove in the living area, 2 adults, 1 child (possibly a second child to follow).
1. Viessmann gas condensing boiler and solar package Vitodens 343 F11 including 2x Vitosol 200-FM for domestic hot water support (Energy Saving Ordinance 2016), including commissioning and gas tank (the gas tank alone costs 2,700 euros since there is no existing connection).
Total gross price: 12,800 euros
or:
2. Viessmann Vitocal 222-S air-to-water heat pump including Vitotronic 200, Vitoconnect 100, and Vitocell 100-E SVP (46 liters (12 gallons)) domestic hot water storage, without solar thermal or ventilation:
Total gross price: 9,200 euros.
The air-to-water heat pump has an initial cost advantage of 3,600 euros, plus savings from removing the chimney in the utility room, lower maintenance costs, interest, etc.
Basically, an obvious choice, right?
Am I overlooking something? OK, the small 160-liter (42-gallon) domestic hot water tank with the air-to-water heat pump worries me a bit, as does the noise level of the outdoor unit (as always).
As you can see, I am by no means an expert, but all information is provided to the best of my knowledge and belief.
Thanks in advance!
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